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Wounded Ronin
Many of you probably remember how back in your favorite 80s martial arts films the hero was only able to kick ass after he went through a two minute training montage with funky pseudo asian music blared in the background and an asian mentor. Examples of this would be Bloodsport, Kickboxer, and The Karate Kid.

I decided that in order to enhance SRs 80s-ness I should write a SR3 rule for training montages. My aim was to keep the rule fun but not too powerful, so give me your comments.

Training Montage:

If your character needs to become more powerful in many different ways within a shorter time frame you will need a training montage.

A training montage offers a reduced karma cost and time investment for a character who needs to perfect many different skills and attributes at once. It's only a "good deal" if you are improving many things at once.

A montage costs the following amount of karma: (karma cost of most expensive skill or attribute improvement) + (average karma cost of all other skill or attribute improvements)

A montage uses the same formula for time with "time" replacing the term "karma cost" in the above equation.

In order to be able to execute a training montage two conditions must be met:

1.) A character must have an appropriate level "Asian Mentor" contact. (See below.)

2.) The player of the character must pick and play appropriate training montage 80s music and, for at least two minutes, must physically act out his or her character training and improving with the music playing in the background. The montage does not take effect until the player has succeeded in making the other players present giggle.


Asian Mentor Contact

The Asian Mentor Contact costs the same as any other normal SR3 contact. However, you need an Asian Mentor to be able to perform a training montage. The usefulness of the montage depends on the level of your Asian Mentor contact. A level 1 Asian Mentor contact allows you make a training montage for the purpose of raising skills or attributes up to a limit of level 3. A level 2 Asian Mentor contact allows you to make a training montage for the purpose of raising skills or attributes up to a limit of level 6. A level 3 Asian Mentor contact allows you to raise skills or attributes as high as you want during a training montage but the drawback of the level 3 Asian Mentor is that if he gets abducted your character has no choice but to attempt a rescue and the GM is required to torture you with ninjas in the commission of your rescue. ("IZUMO!!!" - American Ninja 3.)
FanGirl
Great idea, except I would rule that the Mentor need not be Asian. After all, the training montages in the Rocky films are perhaps the most famous montages in film history, yet Rocky's trainer is white.

Speaking of Rocky, someone should compile a list of good montage songs, one of which is "Gonna Fly Now" from the film's soundtrack. The list should also include "Montage" from Team America: World Police, and this is why:

QUOTE
The hour's approaching, just give it your best
You've got to reach your prime,
Thatís when you need to put yourself to the test,
And show us a passage of time;
We're gonna need a montage! (Montage!)
Ooh, it takes a montage! (Montage!)

Show a lot of things happening at once,
Remind everyone of whatís going on, (Whatís going on?)
And with every shot show a little improvement:
To show it all would take too long,
Thatís called a montage! (Montage!)
Ooh, we want a montage! (Montage!)

And anything that you want to go
From just a beginner to a pro,
You need a montage! (Montage!)
Even Rocky had a montage! (Montage!)

(Montage!
Montage!)

Anything that we want to go
From just a beginner to a pro,
You need a montage! (Montage!)
Ooh, it takes a montage! (Montage!)

Always fade out in a montage,
If you fade out, it seems like more time
Has passed in a montage!
Montage....
Lagomorph
QUOTE
The President has been kidnapped by Ninjas. Are you a bad enough dude to rescue the President?


yep, totally need a montage.
Supercilious
That team America song is really not that funny.
Dog
Thank you for this brilliant idea. Threads like this one keep me on this forum.
Domino
question.gif you've got to be kidding me.
Kalvan
I would impose the following restrictions on training montages:

May not raise Mental Attributes, only Physical

May only raise Combat or Physical Skills. May not raise Social (Except Ettiquettes), Technical, or Vehicle skills.

The only Combat skills that may be raised are unarmed combat, melee weapons, improvised and/or aerodynamic throwing weapons, and Archery. Firearms, crossobws, energy weapons, any weapon employing the Gunnery skill are out!

Super Secret TechniquesTM require a Rating 3 Mentor, and multiply the Karma cost by 1.25 (round all fractions up) per technique earned (and require the expenditure of 1 Karma point for every use). These Super Secret Techniques may be learned as Physical Adept powers instead(though not metamagic), assuming you have power points to spend...
Frag-o Delux
So if I have a chinese dude sitting around I could learn 11 different skills from 0 to 6 for only 64 Karma? I mean the highest skill would be 32 karma (31.5 rounded up supposing you have a 6 in the attribute governing the skills you wish to raise) plus the average of the rest of the skills, which would be 320/10=32 so 32+32=64 karma for 11 skills. Unless I really fucked my math up some where thats pretty ridiculous.
Domino
Hey and with the optional side kick rules you could cut that in half.

Give me a break.
Frag-o Delux
But the side kick would have to be killed by the nemisis of the runner at the beginning of the campaign. In a very dramatic way. Like the runner is distracted by the pay data nd the security guard they thought was dead sits up an shoots sparky in the back with his ally spirit created dikoted slivergun. Making the runner want to train harder.
Domino
But only if he has sex with it.
Frag-o Delux
With his dead sidekick?
Domino
No the Dikoted AVS ally spirit. The Necrophilia would just be RP at that point for an extra karma point.
Frag-o Delux
Ok, so we are down to 32 karama for 11 skills from 0 to 6 if joe runner has sex with a dikoted ally spirit AVS after a guard dramatically kills sparky, then trains with some asian guy. And if he he also has sex with sparkys corps hell get a bonus karma point for RPing? Sounds like a plan, can I have more then one sidekick at character creation?
Domino
No, only one at a time. But you can get more Side Kicks through RP to use in future Montages.

Side Kicks cost 10 karma earned through RP only so you need to keep track of where your karma comes from. (known as the munchkin clause) You can only have one Side Kick at a time and they musy have a name that ends in 'y' Sparky, Dorky etc.
Frag-o Delux
But thats more paper work and makes the rules overly complicated. What we need is a more stream lined rule set that captures the essence of the rule, but a lot less restrictive.

SO I suggest at character creation, pick any movie, book, comic book etc character you want, make them how youd like them to be. I mean Wolverine never used gatlin gun, but you never know when your runner may need one, so tack on heavy weapons 6 for good measure. Then you just say you had Sparky, but he died, you raped his corps an now you are going to get revenge. We'll cut out the whole karma system, the skill training time and all those surperfluous rules slowing the game down.
Domino
Actually make it even easier and just say you have all skills at 6.
Frag-o Delux
Can I still rape Sparky?
Domino
I dont see why not, but thats just me.
Frag-o Delux
Good, because I dont want to see any roles that limit my corps rapeing abilities.

Oh, Domino remember this from the lounge?

Memo:
To: All boardmembers, Division Heads, CEO Domino

From: Chairman of the Board, VP Europe, Head of Physical Security, Black Ops and Desert Wars Campaign, President and CEO of Empire. Great Balls of Thunder, VNN and subsidiaries, Empire Heavy Industries, Flying Monkey MaPS, Too Many Trees Publishing House and OSI, Empire Orphanage and Penitentairy, Board Member of DPC Africa, Asia, and Antarctica, Manager Darth Phylos Lords Urban Brawl team, Board Member of Domino Dyne, Head of R&D of Yo-Yo Dyne Industries,

Subject: Our robotic pants now have extra sac room and more armor.

I would like to inform the share holders and potential investers that Yo-Yo Dyne has worked closely with Domino Dyne to develope new nanotech which increases the crotch strength of our polyester leisure pants. We also added a second pouch to keep the boys from sticking together in warmer climates, like Miami.
Domino
Technically a runners role is to rape corps. Or did you mean a rule about the raping, well consensual really sparky cant say no, of corpses?

Edit: curse complicated concepts such as punctuation.
Domino
QUOTE (Frag-o Delux)

Subject: Our robotic pants now have extra sac room and more armor.

I would like to inform the share holders and potential investers that Yo-Yo Dyne has worked closely with Domino Dyne to develope new nanotech which increases the crotch strength of our polyester leisure pants. We also added a second pouch to keep the boys from sticking together in warmer climates, like Miami.

WOOT Robotic Pants love.gif

All most makes me want to bust out the old corporate pogo-stick smokin.gif
Frag-o Delux
Damn you and your proper spelling, you should know better then that to correct me, Im going to have to... wait they made us leave that game. Ill have to figure out how to get even. Hey you work with dead or close to dead people dont you? I guess thats where you came up with the they cant say no rule, to ease your conscience.
Domino
What is this conscience of which you speak? question.gif

And maybe some day the EMU will be rolled out and you can be Fish boi once again.
Frag-o Delux
QUOTE (Domino)
QUOTE (Frag-o Delux @ Jul 14 2006, 12:29 AM)

Subject: Our robotic pants now have extra sac room and more armor.

I would like to inform the share holders and potential investers that Yo-Yo Dyne has worked closely with Domino Dyne to develope new nanotech which increases the crotch strength of our polyester leisure pants. We also added a second pouch to keep the boys from sticking together in warmer climates, like Miami.

WOOT Robotic Pants love.gif

All most makes me want to bust out the old corporate pogo-stick smokin.gif

Please do, it only made it to the North AMerican CEO side of the boardroom, I never got my turn, I guess Africa and Antarctica dont rate that high for perks. I only started to get respect after I on the Asia board of directors and got Ninjas.
Domino
Ninjas PFFT.

We had Neo-Anarchist urban poets PWNAGE!!!!!!!!!
Adam
Admin post: Domino, Frag-o, don't totally derail threads, even if you have no interest in them.
Frag-o Delux
QUOTE (Adam)
Admin post: Domino, Frag-o, don't totally derail threads, even if you have no interest in them.

I do have a interest in this thread, including the beginning suggestion. I mean really, 64 karma for 11 level 6 skills? I dont know about this guys game, but we average 7 karma a run (session) thats 10 games, and you are Mr Badass. Eitehr he didnt think it out or was making a joke in the first place. Dont get me wrong Im a fan of the montage, but 64 karma?

Oh, Domino, your conscience is that thing in the back of your head when you start to offer that 14 year girl you just picked in front of the middle school a beer. Or when the cashier at the 7-11 turns his back and you grab cigarette money out of the jerry's kids jar.
Domino
QUOTE (Frag-o Delux)
QUOTE (Adam @ Jul 13 2006, 11:48 PM)
Admin post: Domino, Frag-o, don't totally derail threads, even if you have no interest in them.

I do have a interest in this thread, including the beginning suggestion. I mean really, 64 karma for 11 level 6 skills? I dont know about this guys game, but we average 7 karma a run (session) thats 10 games, and you are Mr Badass. Eitehr he didnt think it out or was making a joke in the first place. Dont get me wrong Im a fan of the montage, but 64 karma?

Oh, Domino, your conscience is that thing in the back of your head when you start to offer that 14 year girl you just picked in front of the middle school a beer. Or when the cashier at the 7-11 turns his back and you grab cigarette money out of the jerry's kids jar.

As do I and through hyperbole was demonstrating how silly it was.

And that isn't a conscience Frag-O ole chap thats called ambition.
Frag-o Delux
QUOTE (Domino)
QUOTE (Frag-o Delux @ Jul 14 2006, 12:59 AM)
QUOTE (Adam @ Jul 13 2006, 11:48 PM)
Admin post: Domino, Frag-o, don't totally derail threads, even if you have no interest in them.

I do have a interest in this thread, including the beginning suggestion. I mean really, 64 karma for 11 level 6 skills? I dont know about this guys game, but we average 7 karma a run (session) thats 10 games, and you are Mr Badass. Eitehr he didnt think it out or was making a joke in the first place. Dont get me wrong Im a fan of the montage, but 64 karma?

Oh, Domino, your conscience is that thing in the back of your head when you start to offer that 14 year girl you just picked in front of the middle school a beer. Or when the cashier at the 7-11 turns his back and you grab cigarette money out of the jerry's kids jar.

As do I and through hyperbole was demonstrating how silly it was.

And that isn't a conscience Frag-O ole chap thats called ambition.

I was only using examples the judge said that were morally reprehensible acts that only a monster would commit as he was giving me the sentence. I could have used a montage there to learn how to escape the courthouse.
Domino
I dont think the RAW says anything about a montage being used in that way but the karma gained through RPing it could be used in a future Montage or to pick up a sidekick.
Frag-o Delux
So you are saying I would have to RP the court trial, and make a side kick out of the baliff that takes me back to my cell everyday. Then during sentencing he helps me escape and in the following melee hes killed by the Judgenator. Thus making me want to train hard to get revenage on the Judge?
Birdy
Do I get a cost reduction if:

+ The monatage takes about 15 minutes
+ I get belittled by my rather frail looking mentor all the way
+ I was Kidnapped by my government and foreced to train as an Assasin
+ My Mentor is from a remote part of Korea
+ And has orders to kill me if I fail
+ Can dodge bullets and walk over water

Oh and how much Karma is it worth if I am forced to kiss Kathe Mulgrew (Janeway) during a mission?

Domino
QUOTE (Frag-o Delux)
So you are saying I would have to RP the court trial, and make a side kick out of the baliff that takes me back to my cell everyday. Then during sentencing he helps me escape and in the following melee hes killed by the Judgenator. Thus making me want to train hard to get revenage on the Judge?

Not necesarily, the court stenographer could count as well. Though her ability to help you escape is limited. But on the other hand she may be more attractive than the bailiff. So with your predilection for necrophilia may be the better option.
Domino
QUOTE (Birdy)
Do I get a cost reduction if:

+ The monatage takes about 15 minutes
+ I get belittled by my rather frail looking mentor all the way
+ I was Kidnapped by my government and foreced to train as an Assasin
+ My Mentor is from a remote part of Korea
+ And has orders to kill me if I fail
+ Can dodge bullets and walk over water

Oh and how much Karma is it worth if I am forced to kiss Kathe Mulgrew (Janeway) during a mission?

Depends on if Mulgrew is a side kick and you kiss her after she has been brutally slayed. If before she is just a really old gf, sicko.
Jrayjoker
QUOTE (Dog)
Thank you for this brilliant idea. Threads like this one keep me on this forum.

You seem to have a low threshold for what will keep you here, wink.gif
Grinder
He didn't convert to the DBC, it seems.
Jrayjoker
Oh, they all will.

And on topic...I have no problem with the "montage" skill developer, but I don't think it will ever see the light of day in our campaigns. The fact that you need to have a contact specifically for the montage seems like a pretty big resource pull for a new character.
Wounded Ronin
QUOTE (Jrayjoker)
Oh, they all will.

And on topic...I have no problem with the "montage" skill developer, but I don't think it will ever see the light of day in our campaigns. The fact that you need to have a contact specifically for the montage seems like a pretty big resource pull for a new character.

As some of the other posters pointed out the rules as I initially banged them out offer a massive karma discount, and actually a lot of the suggestions for revision make sense.

That being said, the huge initial investment in the Asian Mentor contact, difficult for starting characters, was part of my attempt to "balance" the montage.
Jrayjoker
Well OK, then. That is what I get for skimming the topic. Thanks for the clarifications.
Frag-o Delux
So if I as a new player pick up the Friends Abroad (3 build points) and possibly the Friends in High Places (2 build points), that would be enough of a balance to off set 260 karma later? I would pick friends in high places so he would be a high level shaolin monk or something cool. I mean 5 whole build points is a real investment. A Bad Karma flaw or Hunted flaw would fit well and add more backstory and not bother a new character all that much. I already act like an ass and make my group laugh, so itll be easy to do the montage stuff. And I rarely take a skill over 6, so I think I can handle the higher level skills one point at a time with all the karma Ill save doing a montage at the beginning.

EDIT: A montage in a movie is not the character becoming a superhero over night. Its a way for the director of the movie to show you what that guy is doing then advacing the story ahead in time. In short its a way to keep you from walking out of the theater instead of watching Rocky beat on a side of beef in real time.

As a GM you accomplish the same thing in several ways.

Either the player plays a different character while the rest of the party continues to play, the entire party takes a break while they all train (the whole party plays new characters) or the GM says POOF! its 3 months later, your fixer calls.
Dog
In a similar theme, I give extra karma when players have prewritten flashback scenes that they pull out and read at appropriate moments in game. (ie. they have to "flash-back" in character and get karma to represent the insight of a certain memory.) It encourages interesting backgrounds.

For example:

GM: "The villain's thugs toss you roughly into a tiny cell lit only by a single candle. 'Stay here 'til you rot.' they chuckle"

Player: (fishing out his character notes.) "I stare at the candle until it becomes the candle from my eighth birthday party, the day I learned my mother went to the hospital. I can see her in her uniform, on the way to work.... blah blah blah."
hyzmarca
Here is an idea.

A Montage may be used to reduce the time required for any test over an hour long to 1 combat turn per hour. This use of the Montage requires that the PC burn 1 point of karma pool.

The reason I say burn instead of spend is so that high-karma deckers cannot abuse this to make absurdly powerful programs . Alternatly, use spend and limit it to one use per catagory of test during the character's lifetime.

A character with the Asian (or Italian for Boxers) Mentor Contact may burn karma pool to incerase skills or attributes at a 1:1 rate. This can be used on any Skill or Attribute because martial arts training makes you good at everything. The mentor is not required to be alive if the character has trained under him before (see Rocky V). If the mentor is dead this is a Flashback Montage.

Since WR often complains about high karma pools this seems like a good solution. It benefits the skilled more than the unskilled, as well. Burning a karma pool point may be economical if raising the skill costs more than 10 or 20 karma but it is wasteful otherwise.
emo samurai
What if my character IS sort of an asian mentor?
Domino
Then you can not use a montage but can assist in one.
Wounded Ronin
I've been doing futher reading on the subject of asian mentors. I have encountered a series of books called "The Destroyer" by Richard Sapir and Warren Murphy, published circa 1977 by Pinnacle Books. This series is really mandatory reading on the subject of asian mentors!

Anyway, it made me realize that I should make rules for how you can use an Asian Mentor Flashback to save your bacon in a seemingly intractable situation. It's like the orientalist Deus Ex Machina. For example, let's say that your character falls off a building and faces certain splattering death. In mid fall you have an asian mentor flashback (cued in and out by flute music) and as a result you mentally really get into some passage from the tao te ching, totally relax yourself, and manage to not die upon impact.

Of course, I'd have to think of rules which wouldn't just make the game explode in a mushroom cloud, so I'll post more when I've thought of something.
Nikoli
Actually, The Destroyer series was the basis for Remo Williams: The Adventure Begins.

Chun for the win!
ShadowDragon8685
QUOTE (Wounded Ronin)
I've been doing futher reading on the subject of asian mentors. I have encountered a series of books called "The Destroyer" by Richard Sapir and Warren Murphy, published circa 1977 by Pinnacle Books. This series is really mandatory reading on the subject of asian mentors!

Anyway, it made me realize that I should make rules for how you can use an Asian Mentor Flashback to save your bacon in a seemingly intractable situation. It's like the orientalist Deus Ex Machina. For example, let's say that your character falls off a building and faces certain splattering death. In mid fall you have an asian mentor flashback (cued in and out by flute music) and as a result you mentally really get into some passage from the tao te ching, totally relax yourself, and manage to not die upon impact.

Of course, I'd have to think of rules which wouldn't just make the game explode in a mushroom cloud, so I'll post more when I've thought of something.

What the HELL are you thinking?!

You cannae bring it back, Jim! It's more'n a year an' a day dead! We jus' cannae dooo it! All we can do is hump the corpse...
Wounded Ronin
QUOTE (ShadowDragon8685)
QUOTE (Wounded Ronin @ Aug 20 2007, 02:18 AM)
I've been doing futher reading on the subject of asian mentors.  I have encountered a series of books called "The Destroyer" by Richard Sapir and Warren Murphy, published circa 1977 by Pinnacle Books.  This series is really mandatory reading on the subject of asian mentors!

Anyway, it made me realize that I should make rules for how you can use an Asian Mentor Flashback to save your bacon in a seemingly intractable situation.  It's like the orientalist Deus Ex Machina.  For example, let's say that your character falls off a building and faces certain splattering death.  In mid fall you have an asian mentor flashback (cued in and out by flute music) and as a result you mentally really get into some passage from the tao te ching, totally relax yourself, and manage to not die upon impact.

Of course, I'd have to think of rules which wouldn't just make the game explode in a mushroom cloud, so I'll post more when I've thought of something.

What the HELL are you thinking?!

You cannae bring it back, Jim! It's more'n a year an' a day dead! We jus' cannae dooo it! All we can do is hump the corpse...

This is what I was thinking, actually: http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?act=...=ST&f=7&t=18743
Daddy's Little Ninja
The mentor does not have to be asian. Think of the Rocky movies. They include the most famous training montage of all time. The climax of him running up the steps of the Philadelphia Art Museum is an iconic momment in film history.
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