That's the first time I will be playing a Rigger and hmm, I don't know if I'm going with a external or internal (cyberlimb) RCD. What do you think of both ? The cost is lower for a external (5k/r vs 20-25k/r) but internal is more usefull (easy to keep it everywhere and not lost it).

I'm not to sure of what to get, Ex. or In. What yours opinions ?

Thanks

Well, if you find you still have money left, and Essence, go for internal. If not, go for External (if you find more useful Riggerish items to sap your Essence away, that is ;p).

While internal is convinient, it is also harder to upgrade. Given that when a rigger is riggin he usually is some place safe, its usually not necessary as well. (The +8TN to other actions while rigging being the big problem that hinders its use). My vote goes with external. Not to mention external ones also have greater flux, and don't take up essence you need for that VCR 3.

As a hardcore geek, I can't imagine having to get opened up every time I wanted to upgrade. External all the way... and that goes double for cyberdecks.

Also keep in mind that without sig amplifiers your internal deck has a Flux rating of 0. But that is for crainial RCDs, if you are talking about just shoving one into a cyber arm with a DNI, then the only problem is that if you want to trick out the deck you'll be running tight on space and modding it will be kind hard since it's wedged in there.

External external external. Maybe internal if you're thinking of going to a really fancy ball, dropping some Arachnoids under the table, and then excusing yourself to the lavatory to make them crawl into people's pockets, but otherwise there's little to no reason for internal.

~J

Thanks everyones !

And for a Drone Rigger, what the best accessory to get ? There's a lot of ECM floating around to get a good ECCM ? And for the flux, does it need a grreeeaatt flux or just a middle one is enough ?

I will certaintly think of others questions around the night, maybe

Edit : Does a Gunnery B/R repair the gun himself and the turret/mount/pintles or just the turret/mount/pintles ?

Edit : And for the ones that have played a DR, do you get a lot of drone or just 2-4 is enough ? Cause I'm not gonna get a RCD Rating 10+ if I don't plan to have lot of them...

Thanks !

P.S : I'm a poor lonely french, sorry

Get a decently high-rating deck later on. You never know when you might need the extras.
As for accessories, you can get a starting Flux rating of 9 or 10 if you take a decent-sized vehicle and a Signal Amplifier R6 in it, and then pump in power from the engines. Control your drones from 25 klicks away, oh yeah.
Have fun with your drones. Some people say that the Awakened are better than mundanes because they have truly infinite potential, but they're wrong. It's the Riggers whose potential is boundless and infinite.

~J

I agree External with one exception. If you are making a Security Rigger, you MUST go Internal. However, if you're a playing it safe drone/vehicle rigger stayingin your van, definitely external.

Sphynx

Right off the bat get the best rating R/C deck you can get. That leaves it lots of room for customization later. Don't forget an intercomm too, the best twenty-five nuyen you'll ever spend. A good command vehicle is good too, something that can haul around the drones. Something like a Bulldog is good or a Roadmaster if you can get one. You know your typical unmarked van.

Spend the money and go for both. Did that with my drone rigger character, using the Server to CRD rules in Rigger 3. Came in damned handy on a couple of occasions. The biggest one was a on a daylight steatlh robbery job.
I had left my RCD (and it's amplifiers and boosters) in the limo parked outside. They are bulky and obvious so I didn't want to carry them around but needed the range. So I linked my CRD to the RCD as a server and ran things remotely from there, giving me almost total freedom of movement and free up my hands to carry a briefcase in with three stealth mini-spy drones into the building to monitor security. Allowing me to effectively monitor the guards inside and keep an eye outside with my Condor drone and provide escape cover if needed with a combat rotary drone all at once.

But do you think that work the try to put a ''mini-base" in a van ? It's kind of easy to destroy a stationary van... What gonna help to prevent that ? Do you think that starting with 2 vehicles is good too ? 'Cause good chances to lost one...

Edit : And don't ya think it's too much a Int. RCD + Ext. RCD ? I'm not gonna work on Security and plus, if I have to go away of my "control base", I gonna play as a good "gunrunners" (Don't want to bother with being a Rigger 100% of the time).

Gonna let some others questions after answer

Simple: Buy a cheap van, deck it with Armor and Signature raising stuff, as well as some ECM and ECCM to defeat all those kids who plan on targetting you with something.

Hmm good, and btw, does ECM can counter self-intelligent missile/rocket ?

Hmm... Possibly...

Thing is, they have to get a lock in the first place before the semi-intelligence can take over. IIRC, that is.

Again, you can at chargen have your little base of operations be well over 20 kilometers away from the target.
At least at first, you won't have to worry about personal safety much.

~J

Hmm and controling all of yours drones is a complex action ? And if I want to fire with my turret on my van and letting my drones blow somes ennemies, that's a complex too ?

Sorry, gonna read more about combat rule with Rigger this week (I'm in the creation now)

Oh yeah, starting as a combat drone rigger or are you going for more of a James Bond-esque feel?

Yop, gonna go with a few drones and with my guns (heavy, gonna go with assault rifles plus launch weapons)

That's bad RiggerThink. Remember, your drones are your guns

~J

edit: "your drones are your drones"... someone slap me please.

Btw I wanted to know, do I need to have the specific skill when piloting a drone ? Ex. piloting a vector-thrust drone, I need the Vector-Thrust Skill ?

Edit : "Slap Kagetenshi" That's why I didn't know what you was saying !

Nope, you need, if I remeber right, a Computer skill (Non-Matrix Programming Concentration of Computer) to help Drones understand better (so worth it... Drones are dumber than sticks, but so much more helpful when they work right ;p). Also get the Control Systems Concentration of Electronics.

I'd also get Tactics, followed by the Concentration Vehicle Tactics. And, if you plan on firing lots of guns (or one), get Gunnery. Need it to fire stuff off from a Drone/Vehicle.

Anybody correct me if I'm wrong on any of this, or add anything as they see fit.

So I will control my drones using the rating of my Computer Skill and maybe, chips ?

You control drones with your closest vehicles skill, IIRC, so a vectored-thrust drone would be vectored-thrust skill, while a skimmer would be hovercraft, while a crawler would be car, while a rotodrone would be rotor aircraft... etc.

~J

No, the Computer Concentration (NMP) is for getting your Drones to understand you. The Electronics Concentration (CS) is for controlling them.

Drones have what is called a "Dog brain," very stupid, but, if you command them just right, they do it perfectly. Otherwise they kind of do what you say in a roundabout manner.

Oh, and if you can afford it, get BattleTac IVIS for them. Or if your GM will allow it, I should say. It isn't cheap, and it isn't expensive, either. Well worth it if you can get it.

Hm. Reread section in R2 about Drones... Yup, you're right about the part for being in the Drone, and not Captain's Chair. Curses.

So, if you're going to have multiple Drones, have multiple vehicle skills. This is why Riggers need mad Skills, otherwise they are seriously handicapped when it comes to being very dynamic.

Sorry for anything misleading. The NMP comes in handy only while commanding as a group in Captain's Chair, and the CS comes in handy while using an RCD in general (still hunting what it's really, really good for).

So "Being the Drone" it's your skill.
In "Captain's Chair" it's the Pilot Rating of the Drone.

So if I'm in primary mode, I control directly one drone and the others "play" with the informations I given to them early ?

They'll do what you told them to do before switching to one Drone. If they finish, they'll wind up sitting about. So, the better your NMP skill, the more advanced the command you can give. And, also, the higher the Pilot rating, the more they'll wind up doing without faltering and botching the job horrendously.

Great

So a good piloting skill, a good NMP and a good pilot rating and here you go !

More or less. Make sure you take a Vehicle skill in each type of Drone you'll be using. Also go for that VCR or you can't jump into a Drone, you can only Captain's Chair it.

This is the set-up I normally use for drone riggers, it has its drawbacks, but in general it works very well. It is contigent on several principles however:

1) That unless the rules state that each unit on a network requires the hardware, you only need to have the hardware on the hub for it function. That is to say, while every active slaved system and the hub R.C. Deck require encryption for the encryption to work, only the hub R.C. deck needs a Rigger Protocol Emulation Module in order for any aspect to gain the benefits (you'll see why later).

2) That you are not going to find yourself in situations where a high vehicle initiative or control pool are vital (i.e. Your a drone rigger, and rather invest in pilot ratings and Battletac). In this system, you must be prepared to invest in drones that are either cheap and expendible (such as a rotodrone with a LMG and 3 points of recoil, a relative bargin), or not meant to be exposed to hazardous situations (like a Hedgehog or Condor)

3) That any encryption or ECCM is designed as a speed bump, just to give you give a few quick commands. Likewise, the system is designed to operate at low flux, and centered on you person, with relay points, to avoid detection.

4) That you plan on using a lot of drones, and also having a very high computer and electronics skill to run your network. When I play a rigger, the character will have spent as much time in front of a computer as a decker, figuring out pre-programmed commands. All these commands will normally be verbal, four word commands that specify the variables for the commands. Talk to you GM as to what you will be allowed first: this system is far less effective when you can't issue commands as four word free actions. Also, invest in a computer with lots of memory.

Anyway, here's the system:

A VCR I, Cranial RCD 7-10 (depending on character creation and how many money saving tricks the GM will let me get away with), one level of encryption so that only another rigger can mess with my system (and almost any rigger can, but at least it adds another step to the process). Get higher encryption if you can afford it, but that's about all you want to put inside you (note that you will have a flux of zero). Some other things that are nice are a datajack (although you technically don't need it with this system) and a display link.

Your going to slave your Cranial RCD to another RCD of equal rating (or less, depending on how many drones you want to get). Battletac IVIS is really nice to have, particularly if you DM will allow you benefits that have no direct game effect, but give you more information (in my last group, a set of Battletac drones could spread out over an area, and with overlapping sensors, give me an overview of what was happening in an area. The exact effect varied, but my GM treated it as having my own personal radar. You'll also have to install it in your head.) On this RCD, put your decryption, your protocol emulation, and whatever tricks you want. Also, you will want to hardwire this to a van, along with your computer (in which you will program as many commands as you can get away with. I would suggest, if you can get your GM to allow it, a contingency command that will send a "rally at point X and disregard further transmissions" command in case of system shutdown, and a hardwired, override command that say "change to channel X, disregard further transmissions on this channel, clear all other active commands."

Anyway, this Van will be your C&C center. Put anything you don't want destroyed in the van. Armor it. Do whatever you need to do, and then argue that if the Air Force can control drones via sat uplink now, and Deckers can Deck via Sat uplink, you van should be able to do that too. Put a satlink on it, and then build a cheap drone with a signal amp, a retrans unit, and a satlink. This drone is your decoy, your going to send signals through it. Now, in my last group, it was argued that so long as my cranium was in the flux range of the decoy, I could control all drones directly, without having to interface with the master unit, avoiding any delay and initiative penalties. If this won't fly in your GM's world (we're kind of operating in uncharted territory in terms of the rules) and you have the nuyen to do it, buy a third, POS RCD to be slaved to both the cranial and master deck, and hook a computer up to it just big enough to hold emergency commands. If this is not allowed, or too expensive, and your GM enforces a penalty saying that all data needs to go to the retrans unit, then the satlink, then the master, and back, ask if you can write a program to bypass the satlink when operating in capt chair mode (because all you really need the C&C center for is when you use your high tech equipment. BTW, don't put anything in there that needs to broadcast directly, like ECM, because you can't do that through satlink). If that doesn't work, keep the C&C van in range of the retrans unit, and if penalties become a problem, bypass the unit and transmit off the hard-wired master deck, and be prepared for a HARM to wipe out your precious investment, but hey, that's part of what playing a rigger is about.

As to drones, you'll need the decoy previously mentioned, as well as one or two other retrans units, and maybe signal boosters on them too. I normally put one on a rotodrone with a signal booster, one on a skimmer, and carry a signal booster on my back. You could put it in a cyberlimb, but it depends on your character's strength. Choose one or two types of drones to specialize in, as these will be the only place you spend skill points for Vehicle skills, and maybe take the RC specialization in them. I usually go Rotocraft (RC) and Car, but I rarely jump into drones.

When planning your drone list, figure out what you want the drones for. I usually go for 2 cheaper combat drones (like the roto I talked about before) and then one really good combat drone (with a full auto and recoil comped heavy weapon, and a pilot rating so that it can actually hit with regularity. Autosofts are great for this if you can afford them), a hedgehog if I can afford it (because I have a friend in the Air Force Research Labs who once showed me the fun you could have with one of these little buggers, if they actually existed), a condor for overwatch, and a couple of custom drones tailored to the party or the type of game I'm in. Another thing I like to do is make a custom drone, use the cheapest micro platform I can, and stick an electronics port in it big enough to hook up to a microcomputer and microtransciever (I figure the size of a wristwatch and an earset, maybe .2 CF). Even after you add IVIS, these get to be pretty cheap. Theoretically (again, an unexplored part of the rules) another player could plug into the drone, call up info from the sensors, communicate over your drones network (which can only be decrypted by another rigger with a rigger decryption module) and you can control information swapping with either a simple (? I don't have my rulebooks with me) action or even a program.

Your rigger should be using any leftover cash on cheap cyber and bio that can make them a poor man's sammy, because really, the idea is to have a combat drone rigger (in the same way you would have a combat decker). You should have an exceptionally high electronics skill, and can pour all your karma into combat and technical skills (as you rarely operate your drones directly).

This type of system takes a long time to put together, and your GM has to be open to taking a good deal of time working with you, allow you to do some very creative things on which there are no clearly defined rules, and probably like Riggers. Also, don't sit down and expect the system to fit easily into 1 million nuyen, I've managed to do it, but I've gotten very creative with in order to do it, and even then I had to leave off the bells and whistles like IVIS and only had about seven drones. A drone network takes a while to put together, so while the mage is initiating, you can be programming your drones. Finally, it takes a long time to put it together exactly as you want in terms of time sitting around with M&M, R3, and the BBB (I've spent whole days with a calculator and notepad working on riggers).

Sigh. Just my two cents.

FYI, Seville, you should never ever go with a C-RCD, WAY too essnce heavy. Get a CyberLeg if you want it internal, then you can stick it in and still have room for an internal signal booster, a datajack (in the leg instead of in the head so you have a router already for the RCD and Booster), even gives you left over room and port for a CyberDeck if you start to diversify later.

Sphynx

Sphinx, its actually cheaper in terms of essence (because you have to pay 1.0 essence for the limb, as opposed to .3 for the Deck). It also works out (sometimes, it depends on the exact set-up) to be slightly cheaper if you have all standard components (as opposed to alpha grade) because very little equipment is actually inside you. If you went alpha, there are compatability issues if you upgrade with standard (I'm not sure of the exact rules, as I said, my books are a thousand miles away right now). I know an obvious limb is 75K, which has other advantages (but also other complications) and although it will save you money if you go standard, it won't save you much at alpha grade (like I said, there are a lot of factors). And then there will still be the issue of style, as there is a big difference between getting something put inside your head (traumatic, but all riggers already do for their VCR) and hacking off a limb.

While I will agree that the largest limit on designing a rigger character and network is cash, the other one is essence, and .5 essence (the difference between a cyberlimb and an Cranial RCD with encryption) is something the character can never get back. Unless you plan to use the cyberlimb to house more gear (such as the cyberdeck, or a signal amp), then the answer isn't so clear. For example:

Rod the Rigger wants to someday be able to survive a fire-fight without his drones. He figures there are certain things he can do with cyber, others with bio. The things he absolutely has to do with cyber (i.e. bio can't replicate) are a smartlink, eyes, & his VCR. The bio he wants (trauma damper, enhanced art, Mneumonic Enh III and Cerebral Booster II) will come out to 2.3 (IIRC, I don't have the books here) so essence index isn't a problem.

So he starts to put in his cyber... he'll go standard to save a little bit of cash, after all, its money for essence, not performance when you upgrade. A VCR II, Smartlink II, and cyber eyes lower his essence to 2.3, and lower his essence index to 3.0... Hmmn, a whole room for much, unless we start cramming, or doubling the cost of his equipment. Now, if Rod wants to have an internal RCD, he has to make a tough choice. Right now, he's not too obvious, he may not get through a high security airport without permits, but his ware is difficult to spot, most of it is legal. He probably wouldn't draw a second glance, and Rod likes it that way. Maybe he could up his reflexes some, but to do that, he has to make some stuff (probably his VCR) alpha, and he's getting close to a real bind in terms of essence. Note that this is over his entire career, because while you can get more money and karma, you can't get the soul you sold to get more chrome.

My point? The cyberlimb is only head and shoulders above the cranial if you want more than one point of stuff that can fit in either your head or your arm. If not, then you have to consider cash, essence, and other factors.

Ok, yeah, if you want 'just the basics' then it is cheaper essence-wise to go with a C-RCD, but start adding the enhancements you -need- to be a Decker.

RCD: 0.30
ECCM: 0.30+
Decryption: 0.20
Protocol Emulation: 0.20 (You can skip this if you never plan to do Security work)
Encryption: 0.20

Then resources:
Remote Deck: 150,000 vs 60,000
ECCM: 210,000 vs 90,000
Decryption: 105,000 vs 45,000
Protocol: same price
Encryption: 60,000 vs 30,000

Cost difference: 300,000
Obvious AlphaLeg: 150,000
Essence 0.8

Saved 0.2 to 0.4 essence and 150,000 via a leg.

Not to mention enough ECU to expand without needing cybersurgery, such as a nice internal Signal Booster (A must for any drone rigger).

The problem isn't so much the starting character, it's the lack of thinking-ahead. You don't want a C-RCD if you need to upgrade later.

Sphynx

Rigger skills:

Piloting Drive skill for each vehicle type (can be ignored if need be)
Gunnery (everything except GLs, rockets, missiles)
Launch Weapons (GLs, rockets, missiles)
Electronics (Electronic Warfare concentration is usually good)
Computer (if you're drones will be getting a lot of programmed actions)
Various B/R skills

Everyone skills:
Etiquette
Stealth

For combat drone load outs, I've always been partial to LMGs. A mini-blimp with a good sensor package is also a personal favorite.

For decks, I've always favored a low rating cranial deck as a backup and a regular external deck for most stuff.

Agreed that if you want to put all the stuff in your body, cyberlimb is far cheaper. The systems I like to put together, however, rely on an external hub, and (depending on the GM) don't need to have ECCM or Protocol Emulation in the cranial/cyberlimb deck.

An interesting thought I had the other night... rather than a full-blown cyberlimb, can you fit a deck and encryption (the only accessory that definitely has to be on every component to work) into a cyber forearm? I'm not sure of the ECU, but I think that the essence cost is .6 to .7, and the cost is about 40K... probably the best of both worlds.

The alternative to the van is a bit more pricey, but considerably more difficult to counterattack. Drone deploying aircraft. With a r/c deck hardwired into a medium helo or fixed wing a/c and drone racks. The drones can be quickly inserted (as well as the rest of the runners in the case of a helo) then the mothership quickly moved off to a standoff position.

Bonus: Most aircraft already have an advanced autonav system so that most of the flight can be preprogrammed allowing the rigger to concentrate on the drones. An aircraft can also achieve the "high transmitter bonus to the flux range"

(IRL the range a VHF/UHF transmission is a distance in miles equal to 1.23 multiplied by the square root of the transmitter's height above the ground)

The mothership being mobile can also aid the drones with its own firepower, ECM abilities and sensors if need be.

Lastly your decker buddy can hopefully file a bogus flightplan for you to cover your aircraft's activities in an area.

The big downside to this plan of course is cost. Aircraft aren't cheap, and are hard to come by especially after SI and availability are applied.

Height in what units?

~J

Sorry 'bout that. Feet.

For the Gunnery and Launch Weapons, it's said :

I'm at a loss for a better source on the two skills. An e-mail to Fanpro is probably in order. Or just ask your GM

Gonna do that, thanks

There is still recoil. No perfectly-accurate miniguns for you.

~J