Security should have an edge in knowing the 'battlefield'. But, how strong should they be? You can't just give them attributes and skills around the players. I don't feel they should be all 3's either, as they aren't the same as, say, the accountant or secretary.

What does everyone here think the average security guard should have along the lines of attributes, skills, and equipment?

Do you mean "run of the mill rent a cop"? Honestly, they should be a cake-walk for a decent shadowrun character with a 6 in pistols.

The only knowledge that they might have over the characters is their own company security prodedures, and a team with a decent decker should know that if possible.

I might give them fours in billy club and pepper spray, but that's pushing it.

Now, a step up from rent a cop is an actual armed, trained (sorta) security guard. This is the guy that the company cares enough about to give him an armored vest and let him have a gun. Heck, he even gets to go to the range twice a month.

Actually, now that I get into this post a bit, it occurs to me that my answer is "as powerful as you think they should be, given the situation, the talents of your runners, and the goal you have in mind when bothering to include them".

I mean competent security, not the guy in the mall with a flashlight, whistle, and smoky the bear hat. The guy thats posted at an important site.

i tend to give them mostly 3s, with Str, Bod, and occasionally Will of 4-5. that's, like, chump rent-a-cops, though. guys at more important sites tend to be statted like starting-level runners.

It depends on what they are guarding. If they are protecting a new Ares prototype that is going to be unveiled in the morning and is the only one of its kind, kept in the same room as all the records of its design and operation, then we are probably talking about people who know what they are doing.

If they are looking after the tech-lab at Renraku, making sure nobody makes off with the Fairlight Excalibur equivalents, then they are probably not quite so perfect.

As a general rule of thumb, I gear it to the run. If runners are doing a run which is paying better than normal, the security will have stats almost as good as them. If they are doing a low-paid run just to top-up their earnings enough to pay the rent, the security will probably not pose a risk.

If you have made it clear that they are out of their depth, have them face a team at the same level of expertise as them or higher....

You could have them be weaker than the PCs on a one to one level but then pelt the PCs with at least 20 of them.

What about ware?

If you're talking regular corp guards, I rarely give them anything above Smartlinks (or Smartlink-2s) and Cybereye enhancements (sometimes not, as smart goggles and thermo goggles are cheaper if slightly less effective). Headware like radios would also seem common. Maybe even Boosted Reflexes Rating 1. Anything like dermal plating would be unsightly out of the workplace and other ware is pretty expensive to invest in one person unless they're important.

If it's a secure site, I tend to give guards very good gear over ware, since it's more cost-effective and easy to transfer plus no installation. Security armor, of course, and a good SMG or shotgun. Maybe access to heavier weapons as backup. Depending on the corp, things like tasers, smoke grenades and neuro-stun are low-cost and very effective.

I use the BBB stats for your average non reta cop guard. I also useTHIS.

in SR3, i agree with odei--very little ware, in general. in SR4, though, or if you're using SR4 prices (guideline: 25% of the SR3 monetary cost), even the low-end rent-a-cops should pack some ware.

If I were a cop, I would spend some funds to get myself decked out with some basic 'ware even if the corp won't foot the bill, primarily in the interests of self-preservation in a dangerous line of work. It could also be considered an investment, since more ware leads to better coppering, which leads to faster promotions, which leads to more money.

mfb: You could actually argue that both ways, since the basic pieces of 'ware in SR4 are no more effective than their goggle equivalents.

In my milieu: Except for major research locations or data havens, on site security tends to be 3's, and there are gun-armed (pistol, etc.) and not gun-armed types (net-guns, sticky-foam bombs, telescoping batons).

IMO, it's impossible for even ultra-wealthy megacorps to staff all locations with major threat response teams equipped with all combat armor and gyro mount packs fitted with miniguns.

Most megacorps have a couple of such teams in their major cities, and use contract coverage out to an owned susidiary security service for other locations. If the alarms go off, the cavalry thunders in. Of course, it can take a few minutes to show up.

SR3: Assign stats values to appropriate values as given by Corp Download. Little to no cyber/bio. Rely on chemical enhancements.

SR4: Enhancements in the form of equipment. Lower cost cyber/bio available.

Rent-a-Cop = 2s and 3s across the board, 3 or 4 in one weapon, mundane, no combat 'ware except maybe a smartlink, maybe some senseware, armored jackets, and maybe some combat drugs.

Standard security = 3s and 4s , 4 or 5 in multiple weapons, mostly mundane with maybe one aspected magician, smartlinks, combat drugs, a security decker/building rigger and armored jackets or light security armor, nonlethal grenades.

Elite Security = 3-6 in stats, 6 in one weapon and 4-5 in others, one (full) or two (aspected) magicians, smartlink, wired reflexes, and kevlar bone lacing standard for the mundanes with possibly some dermal armor or muscle replacement, a decidated secirity decker and a dedicated security rigger, security armor lethal grenades.

The Guys Who Kick Butt = 4-6 in stats, 7-8 in one weapon and 4-6 in others, built like a shadowrunning team, multiple security deckers, one dedicated security rigger and one or more captain's chair riggers, at least one full magician with multiple aspected magicians, smartlinks, trauma dampners, wired reflexes or synaptic acceleraters, dermal sheathing or orthoskin, kevlar bone lacing (titanium for the melee guy) security armor with gelpacks or hardened military armor, assault rifles, grenade launchers, cannons, missile, combat drones, mounted gun turrets, and maybe snakespine whips with hull cutters.

Run! = The Guys Who Kick Butt with access to a Delta Clinic and Cybermancers.

I use the basic stats in SR4, normally. Any security guard that was an actual match for the shadowrunners wouldn't be working as a security guard. The danger of them is when they're mishandled and they're allowed to gain cover, circle around the team and come at them from two sides, locate the get away van and block off the escape route, that sort of stuff. For that, it's less what their stats are, and more how they're organised.

The Homeground quality is a great way to boost the (on-site) guards without actually raising any stats.

The average guard might have strength and/or body higher than average. but few cyber. hand guns, maybe an smg in more industrial areas- MP5.

Most facilities also have a response team that is usually better quality response team, or maybe better armed with assualt rifles.

This is just off the wrack types in sites that don't need extra sec, just enough to hold off the street people and occassional go ganger.

Unlike shadowrunners, guards would usually be low-paid contractors that spent most of their time standing around - they'd hardly ever see real combat. They'd have average physical stats, and average to slightly below average mental stats.

I would think that most of the 'equalizers' that corps would give their guards would focus on cost efficiency, and would be things that the guard wouldn't take with them if they left the company or died.

So they'd get goggles with smartlink, display link, and sensory enhancements. They'd all wear biomonitors, and have externally-mounted autoinjectors full of cram and kamikazee (combined bonuses of +1 Reaction, +2 Init Passes, +1 Body, +1 Agility, +2 Strength, +1 Willpower).

Most would also have equipment that caused stun rather than physical: Neurostun grenades, flashpaks, stun batons, drones with freeze foam cannons, etc. These are often more effective in bypassing armor, leave you with a prisoner to question afterwards, and minimize collateral damage to their facility. From a GM perspective, it also allows your players a chance to escape, cut a deal, etc. in order to save their character.

Assault rifles and home rules for determining what stray rounds hit.

And then there's the occasional bank guard like this fellow. He was a bank guard for 17 years...

Personally, I try to go with what makes the most amount of sense given the setting, location, and threat level. There are some things to remember when designing realistic security measures in SR games.

1. (Meta)Human bodies are expensive and inefficient. They need salaries, benefits, breaks, 8-hour days, weekends off, vacation, etc. Most security would be the electronic type. Likely said electronic measures would be monitored off-site, probably by someone or some group of people who monitor several locations at once. (Meta)Human physical security is most often found during business hours and is more worried about watching the company employees than about outside threats.

2. Any non-security company short of the Megas will likely be outsourcing it's security needs. Likely the security contractor will be handling the offsite monitoring, and will have preset response tiers based on the nature of any security issue, also likely influcenced by how much they are getting paid.

3. Most onsite, physical presence security will likely be primarily for deterrance purposes, and will not be likely to directly engage any intruders. As first responders, it's these guys who report the location and nature of the intruders to those doing the monitoring, and also engage any manual security-breech measures the site may have. Only the suicidal ones will be duking it out with runners.

4. Off-site response teams. These are the people the runners have to worry about. These guys are usually well trained, fantastically equipped, and ready to move at very short notice. Once the intrusion level has escalated enough to warrant their activation, they will be on-site in short order, ready to lock down the facility and root out the runners.


Look at this paradigm like a law-enforcement approach. Beat cops don't really handle the rough shit. They call SWAT.


Now before anyone blasts me, I'm going to say that there are plausible exceptions to this rule. Here are some.

A. Military posts. The military is already paying it's people, and most of what they do is down-time. So placing bodies into security roles is pretty natural for them. Expect military security to be better armed and better trained (only slightly) than "rent-a-cops".

B. Government offices with VIPs. See item A (Military Posts).

C. Corporate VIP visits/meetings. These events will likely involve a signicant amount of increased physical security. Said assests would likely be skilled, equipped, and professional.

There are other examples, but they aren't endemic to routine 2070's corporate security.


Metagame considerations:

Here is where things get sticky. The GM wants the players to encounter challenges during a run. Combat with corporate security is one of those things that most SR players enjoy, and is very often an integral part of each run. Often times, the level of challenge the GM wishes to present to the players determines how physical corporate security is statted/equiped. Doing so usually makes a fun game, if not a terribly realistic one.

So the meta-game answer to the OP is "whever presents the right amount of challenge and most fun encounters for your group".

However, I feel like my above assesment is a lot closer to how security would really be in a 2070's SR world.

...TheOneRonin has some good points here.

One of the best pices of equipment I gave to security personnel (considering they were usually dogmeat for the runners in a direct conflict), was a direct Panicbutton link to the Star or other local law enforcement. Most [smart] runners usually don't want to mess with the law (which can come down pretty hard on them if they kill an officer).

Now, if it was a high security area they are dealing with, the link would include the Corp's HTR unit (which are usually more paramilitary in nature). This may include some minor enhancements as mentioned above, and quite possibly a mage.

Of course in any installation there would be cameras, lots of little cameras taking little pictures. Some of these can be linked to standalone systems which will reduce [even eliminate] the risk of their being compromised from the outside. Most of this tech is quite affordable for even a small operation. Larger firms of course will have much more sophisticated systems which could even send real time images to law enforcement HQs in the event of unauthorised entry.

Then there are the active security systems, lots of fun toys to keep your place of business safe. Again these need not be lethal, just good enough to incapacitate or at least, slow down any intruder(s) until the cops/troops arrive. Even mages are not necessarily above the physical ICs. Simple things like dust or mist emitters, UV sensors, Sniffers, Pheromone sensors (Improved Invisibility doesn't mask BO).

Sec personnel in higher tech installations would usually be more the technicians monitoring sensors and devices from a safe-room instead of sticking their faces out in the open to get shot. Sure, they would have some means to protect themselves such as tasers, Narcojets, splat guns and light armour (jackets, forearms guards and maybe a standard helmet with a few vision mods).

In the end , there is always the law. Even fragging a rent a cop is still Murder 1 on the books.

So thats what a rent a cop with 15 karma pool looks like...

You are dead on, KK. I think biomonitors would be mandatory for all on-site security personnel, and would be monitored from some off-site installation. You geek, incapacitate, or so much as bruise a guard, and the Sec HQ guys know something is up.

And an extra-territorial corporate security response would be way worse than Lone Star. No due-process, no restrictions on use of force, none of the things that would protect you if it was just the cops after you. Honestly, if it was my corporate office, once a threat would be identified I would seal it up remotely and nerve gas the whole place. Any employees that die are simply "victims of a heinous act perpetrated by a group of terrorists". Then I'd spin the rest of it however I want. After all, it's MY territory.

Always make sure you add in personal touches.

Like the guard with a cute crayon drawing in his pocket, signed "I Love You Daddy!"

Or a secret love letter to another one of the guards that never got delivered.

Maybe a picture with an attached note, from a tracing service telling the guard "Good news! We found your biological mother!" - and it's a picture of one of the runner's parents.




-karma

I'd make most security guards fairly lame compared to runners. As has been mentioned, corp response forces are the scary ones. A guard dies, or hits the panic button... you get Renraku SWAT (or whatever corp you're invading). Better factor their response time into your run. As for the response team, they'll probably seal the facility first, then move in... which means you should probably try to have a secret escape route of some description, or some means that they can't counter easily (such as a heavily armoured VTOL flier that they probably won't be able to shoot down). Best accompanied by tactics that prevent them deploying properly (such as the troll with the minigun laying down suppressive fire to force them back, while your mage sends a few spirits around to distract the astral security response).

That, of course, is for a run against a major facility of a megacorp. Most runners will likely be attacking smaller targets, which will probably just call up the 'Star (who are almost as scary, but may have a longer response time).

(Edit: and yes, these guys would be professionals. At least soldier level, with the elite being special forces good. For the prime teams from megacorps, I'd consider using the stats for Ghosts, but that would be very, VERY rare and powerful.)

Bit off-topic, but I've got a mission lined up for later in my campaign where the PCs are in charge of security for a corporation. Basically, it's a private company that was founded by some scientists that left Aries to start out on their own. They've done well producing some valuable IP and they're about to take the company public. Aries is pissed and is looking for a private buy-out which they'll get if the founding directors can be compromised. Security was provided by Knight Errant but KE have decided not to renew their contract at the last minute (wonder why) and the word seems to have gone round to other security firms not to touch this company, leaving the fledgling corp in a pickle. Enter the PCs who are given a budget, legitimate channels to purchase equipment, an opportunity to be rewarded in valuable stock options, the opportunity to hire security staff wherever they can and the task of keeping these scientists alive and the corp in one piece for the next eight days until the floatation.

Basically, it's going to seem like Christmas. And then they'll see what they're up against. I give them a 2/5 chance of pulling it off.

So I'm going to let the PCs show me how they think security should be run. It's going to be interesting.