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bishop186
I searched and couldn't find what I was looking for in regard to internal commlinks, so perhaps I'm just missing something that's just understood and asking a newbish question. Perhaps the ForcEarch is weak with this one. In that case, humor me plee-yaz.

Okay, so I've been reading through the BBB again, and I've been looking at headware commlinks. I can't really find a good description of how they function aside from "same as commlink on p. 3XX," "see Commlinks on p. 210," or something like that.

So down to my actual question(s): what exactly can an internal commlink do? What does the DNI allow it to do? Can I, for instance, think about speaking and have the commlink pick it up, if I so desire? Can I think out text messages? Does it communicate through the DNI with image and soundlink, or is that dealt with wirelessly?

With regards to integrating hardware with my commlink, if I cannot *think* about speaking with a commlink, must I integrate a subvocal microphone if I want to speak covertly without relying on text messages (if that's even an option)? Can I use a skinlink to keep my wireless traffic down to a minimum and still have it (for example, a skinlinked subvocal microphone) communicate with the internal commlink?

Am I going about commlinks all wrong?

Thanks, yous guys.
Mistwalker
You can mentally text message and transmit by radio.

If you have cybereyes, you can mentally take an image and send it to a buddy.

If you have other cyberware, you can "talk" to it mentally, and disable all the wireless (hackable) parts, so that they have to hack your commlink to affect your cyberware.

Does that answer your question?
DireRadiant
Both references to DNI, P 215 and

"DNIóA connection between
the brainís neural impulses and a computer
system, allowing a user to mentally interact with
and control that system."

P 330 "direct neural interface (DNI) that
allows the user to mentally activate and control their functions."

Indicate you have some means of making the implanted commlink work. How that manifests I would leave to your imagination.

How they don't work is through simsense. For that you need to add the sim module to the commlink. With a sim module you can get that sound, sight, smell, touch overlay to interact with your commlink.

Personally, without the sim module, I would have the implanted commlink driven through mental command menu and responses, making it realtively awkward compared with using a sim module or a trode set.
bishop186
Alright. I think between the two of you, you've answered all my questions. Thanks!

So, really an internal seems like a good bottleneck, however you're royally screwed if that thing gets hacked? It seems like it'd be beneficial to buy another commlink and use it as a dummy commlink, and run the internal on hidden mode.
Jaid
QUOTE (bishop186)
Alright. I think between the two of you, you've answered all my questions. Thanks!

So, really an internal seems like a good bottleneck, however you're royally screwed if that thing gets hacked? It seems like it'd be beneficial to buy another commlink and use it as a dummy commlink, and run the internal on hidden mode.

well, yes...

but then again, that's equally true for non-implanted commlinks.
Fortune
What exactly can a person do with an internal Commlink that they could not accomplish just as easily with an external one?
Lord Ben
You wouldn't leave it at home accidentally!!

Butterblume
Skinny dipping rotfl.gif.
bishop186
Well, other than surgery (or skull cracking) it'd be hard to physically get to it. Plus. It's a phone. IN YOUR BRAIN!

You can think "Becky" and she'll be all "Yeah?" and you'll be all "Oh my god, Becky, look at her butt." and she'll be "It's so big... It's all round and out there!" etc.
Fortune
QUOTE (bishop186)
You can think "Becky" and she'll be all "Yeah?" and you'll be all "Oh my god, Becky, look at her butt." and she'll be "It's so big... It's all round and out there!" etc.

You can think those things with a normal Commlink (and either trodes or a datajack) as well.
bishop186
But trodes are visible and datajacks require cables. Cables are retro, and trodes can be removed?
Fortune
Datajacks do not require cables in SR4.

Trodes can be hidden under (or even built into) has or wigs ... or even painted on with nifty decorative paste.
bishop186
Datajacks don't require cables? o_O Well... then my BBB lies to me. Or does not tell me all the information I need condensed into one place. Which I've noticed it doesn't do, so I suppose I'll believe you on that one. EDIT: Oh. Right. Skinlink. I'm stupid -- I even mentioned the damn thing.

Trodes, including nanopaste trodes, can still be removed and screwed with pretty easily. A lot more easily than, say, something that's in your brain.
Fortune
QUOTE (bishop186 @ Nov 29 2006, 11:16 AM)
Well... then my BBB lies to me.

Really? Can you give me the quote that specifically states that Datajacks need cables?

Why would you think that they do need them, when pretty much anything, including items a lot smaller than a datajack can and are wireless as standard? The name is merely a legacy, in that it performs the same function as the tech 20 years ago ... just better.

edit: They don't even need to be Skinlinked, as they come wireless as standard issue.
Jaid
QUOTE (bishop186)
Datajacks don't require cables? o_O Well... then my BBB lies to me. Or does not tell me all the information I need condensed into one place. Which I've noticed it doesn't do, so I suppose I'll believe you on that one. EDIT: Oh. Right. Skinlink. I'm stupid -- I even mentioned the damn thing.

ermmm... no... it has a device rating.

device rating means it has a signal rating.

signal rating means it's wireless.

wireless, by definition, means it doesn't need cables.

of course, you could always choose to use cables (it is even more secure than skinlink), but that's generally a little excessively paranoid imo.

anyways, other feature of implanted commlinks: immune to AOE damage.
bishop186
Gah. That doesn't make any sense. I mean, the description says that it uses fiberoptic cables to communicate, so then why would it be wireless? That seems to remove the usefulness of it.

EDIT: Where is it's device rating listed, anyway? I can't seem to find iit.
Fortune
Why would its being wirelss remove its usefullness?

It's a permanent plug in your head that facilitates DNI-interface with machines. If you want more security, you can then add on a Skinlink, or even use those fiber-optic cables to prevent hacking, but it isn't necessary. Even more functionality than a trode-linked Commlink, and way more than one that uses a manual interface.
bishop186
Okay, you're right. A better word would be counterintuitive, or the description is not a complete one. When something is described as "allow[ing] a user to directly interface with any electronic device via fiberoptic cable" I don't expect it to be wireless unless it's explicitely stated.
Fortune
But that is exactly what it does .... in addition to its normal wireless functionality.

Nothing else gives you the ability to use cables in this manner, as the default for pretty much everything in SR4 is wireless. The Datajack could have evolved, but it must have been deemed beneficial to keep its plug-like capabilities for those people that actually need to be hard-wired.
De Badd Ass
QUOTE (DireRadiant)
Both references to DNI, P 215 and

"DNIóA connection between
the brainís neural impulses and a computer
system, allowing a user to mentally interact with
and control that system."

P 330 "direct neural interface (DNI) that
allows the user to mentally activate and control their functions."

Indicate you have some means of making the implanted commlink work. How that manifests I would leave to your imagination.

How they don't work is through simsense. For that you need to add the sim module to the commlink. With a sim module you can get that sound, sight, smell, touch overlay to interact with your commlink.

Personally, without the sim module, I would have the implanted commlink driven through mental command menu and responses, making it realtively awkward compared with using a sim module or a trode set.

Note: A sim module is one way. It converts simsense data to neural signals. You need a Simrig to record simsense data. So while a sim module lets you smell "simsense odors", it doesn't convert odors to simsense. It lets you experience "pleasure" or "disgust" but it doesn't let you transmit those emotions.

A typical commcall will not involve simsense, as most people don't wear simrigs. The reason you connect your commlink to a sim module is to experience Virtual Reality. Sim modules also convert virtual reality to neural signals. Again, this is one way. You participate in Virtual Reality via your Persona Program.

You don't need a sim module for Augmented Reality. Your commlink will transmit Augmented Reality directly to your image link or display.
bishop186
Alright. I see where the normal wireless functionality comes into play. I forgot that all cyberware is assumed to be wireless. What IS it's device rating, though, anyway? I've been looking all over, and I can't find it. Is it 3 since it's headware?
Fortune
Dunno! I've stretched my limited knowledge of SR tech to the max with this thread already. biggrin.gif
Jaid
QUOTE (bishop186)
Alright. I see where the normal wireless functionality comes into play. I forgot that all cyberware is assumed to be wireless. What IS it's device rating, though, anyway? I've been looking all over, and I can't find it. Is it 3 since it's headware?

headware or "personal electronics" imo. (doesn't get much more personal than being a part of your body wink.gif )

so yeah, probably rating 3.
bishop186
Haha. Well, there's only two signal ratings that it could have: 0 because it's a pretty short-range tech, as far as I could see, or 3 because it's headware and headware, generally, has a Device Rating of 3.

Device rating would seem to be 3 if it's a regular headware, though, referring to the table on 214.
De Badd Ass
QUOTE (bishop186 @ Nov 28 2006, 08:47 PM)
Alright.  I see where the normal wireless functionality comes into play.  I forgot that all cyberware is assumed to be wireless.  What IS it's device rating, though, anyway?  I've been looking all over, and I can't find it.  Is it 3 since it's headware?

Cyberware has a signal rating 0, range 3 meters. See the Signal Rating table on page 212 of the BBB. Don't mix device rating and signal rating; they are different.
Fortune
Signal Rating does not necessarily equate to Device Rating, does it? I mean Signal is only one part of the entire rating.

As an aside, isn't 1 the default device rating for various miscellaneous non-cyber electronics?
bishop186
Yeah. I didn't think the signal rating could possibly be 3. I mean... commlinks' signal ratings are 3. Why the hell even have a commlink if you can DNI with everything wirelessly? XD

Fortune: Yeah. Default device rating for handhelds is 1, or 40m. Again according to that table.
De Badd Ass
QUOTE (Fortune)
Signal Rating does not necessarily equate to Device Rating, does it? I mean Signal is only one part of the entire rating.

As an aside, isn't 1 the default device rating for various miscellaneous non-cyber electronics?

Signal rating is the important rating with regards to wireless.
Fortune
QUOTE (bishop186)
Why the hell even have a commlink if you can DNI with everything wirelessly?

Because you need the Commlink to interact with the rest of the Matrix. And a Sim Module fits into the equation somewhere as well. Getting out of my (very small) tech comfort zone now. biggrin.gif
RunnerPaul
Although no one's mentioned it in this thread, depending on what version of the hard copy or PDF you have, you may have a line on p.228 that mentions cranial commlinks coming with sim modules standard. Per the powers that be at FanPro, this is an error that was corrected in the second hardcopy printing, but somehow got missed in the latest version of the PDF and was not called out in the corresponding errata. When it comes time for the third printing, the PDF and errata will be updated accordingly.
bishop186
I have a first printing hard copy, so I've been trying to consult the errata as much as possible.
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