Full Version: New Equipment: Wrist-mounted pistol reloaders
This was inspired by the movie Equilibrium. In the badass gunfight at the end, Preston reloads his pistols by using little machines mounted on his wrists. I would say that they make reloading pistols a free action.
...KK wants a pair.
Doesn't everybody?
I don't mind the way Lara Croft reloads in the first Tomb Raider movie either.
Don't remember that movie, don't want to.
It was actually quite a slick method, the Lara Croft way... clips set right in her belt so she just drops the existing clips (Smartlinked with ease), then slaps the pistols down onto the ones on her belt to reload... very SR-friendly, that...
And even if the move was schlock I value my Angelina time...
And even if the move was schlock I value my Angelina time...
Though I am ever impressed by the subtle CG to enhance her breasticles.
Well, you could certainly have auto reloaders in the 2070's. I don't think they'd make reloading a free action though - smartlinked ejecting the clip is a free action, since you do it mentally and the clip falls out of the gun in the blink of an eye. But a reloader device would need to take the time to fully insert the clip and lock it home, which seems unlikely to be nearly as fast to me.
Anyway, you only get one free action in an init pass so even if you could reload as a free, you've already spent your free ejecting clips. So it really, in most cases, wouldn't matter if you had an auto reload or just used your hands, since it would still eat up a simple action, whether the auto reload cost a free or a simple.
Anyway, you only get one free action in an init pass so even if you could reload as a free, you've already spent your free ejecting clips. So it really, in most cases, wouldn't matter if you had an auto reload or just used your hands, since it would still eat up a simple action, whether the auto reload cost a free or a simple.
| QUOTE (ixombie @ Nov 30 2006, 02:43 PM) |
| Anyway, you only get one free action in an init pass so even if you could reload as a free, you've already spent your free ejecting clips. So it really, in most cases, wouldn't matter if you had an auto reload or just used your hands, since it would still eat up a simple action, whether the auto reload cost a free or a simple. |
Unless, of course, a person was to use their Free Action from the Pass before to eject the clip after having emptied it, thereby leaving his full allotment of Actions to use from his current Pass.
Seems really the only time saved is that you can load two pistols simultaneously.
Neither example showed the person involved taking much less time than it normally does to smartlink-eject a clip and slap in a fresh one.
-karma
Neither example showed the person involved taking much less time than it normally does to smartlink-eject a clip and slap in a fresh one.
-karma
Most persons have a device for reloading, called The Other Hand™. But it would come in handy for those gunfu types, since their Other Hand™ isn't free at the time 
.
.| QUOTE (emo samurai) |
| This was inspired by the movie Equilibrium. In the badass gunfight at the end, Preston reloads his pistols by using little machines mounted on his wrists. I would say that they make reloading pistols a free action. |
SR4 does already feature forearm-mounted system that puts it's content into your hand at a free action. It's called a 'Hidden Arm Slide', imagine.
The only thing left to do is to install a clip as a pistol-sized weapon (which is ok as you can throw clips, making them improvised thorwing weapons)... and a bit of training.
| QUOTE (KarmaInferno) |
| Seems really the only time saved is that you can load two pistols simultaneously. Neither example showed the person involved taking much less time than it normally does to smartlink-eject a clip and slap in a fresh one. |
But it's COOL!
Or even, if Emo will excuse the infringement, AWESOME
| QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig) | ||
SR4 does already feature forearm-mounted system that puts it's content into your hand at a free action. It's called a 'Hidden Arm Slide', imagine. |
...Yeah but In actuality, it should only work with light pistols. After debating this topic on another thread, it does seem ridiculous that a 10" barrel Super Warhawk could be stuffed under someone's sleeve (unless they were a Troll wearing a caftan - now there's a scary thought). KK has since dumped the arm slides and gone with the standard holster (fits her "bushido cowgirl" image better)
However a wrist mounted auto speed loader, now that sounds neat. At least gives her two more loads for those extra long fire fights.
it never ceases to amaze me that people can think the fight scenes in equilibrium (or ultraviolet, for the same reasons) are anything but laugh out loud comedy.
| QUOTE (Kyoto Kid) |
| ...Yeah but In actuality, it should only work with light pistols. |
Why? Why couldn't it be adapted to hold clips? Or a Stun Baton? Or a club sandwich. Seems to me that the wording is deliberately left vague (pistol-sized object) in the description to facilitate this very thing.
| QUOTE (2bit @ Nov 30 2006, 10:50 AM) |
| it never ceases to amaze me that people can think the fight scenes in equilibrium (or ultraviolet, for the same reasons) are anything but laugh out loud comedy. |
I love the part where he spins the guns in the dudes' hands and then shoots them in the face with them. It is AWESOME, so AWESOME that I headbutted my dog in the face so hard we both cried. And then the captains like "What?"
| QUOTE (Fortune) | ||
Why? Why couldn't it be adapted to hold clips? Or a Stun Baton? Or a club sandwich. Seems to me that the wording is deliberately left vague (pistol-sized object) in the description to facilitate this very thing. |
I think KK meant light pistols as opposed to heavy pistols, rather than light pistols as opposed to a variety of other small and useful-to-have-up-your-sleeves objects.
| QUOTE (emo samurai @ Nov 30 2006, 06:59 PM) |
| I love the part where he spins the guns in the dudes' hands and then shoots them in the face with them. |
IIRC, this scene is performed by Bale himself, as the stuntman wasn't able to do it.
| QUOTE (Moon-Hawk) |
| I think KK meant light pistols as opposed to heavy pistols, rather than light pistols as opposed to a variety of other small and useful-to-have-up-your-sleeves objects. |
Extendable batons.
| QUOTE (Moon-Hawk @ Dec 1 2006, 04:04 AM) |
| I think KK meant light pistols as opposed to heavy pistols, rather than light pistols as opposed to a variety of other small and useful-to-have-up-your-sleeves objects. |
Yeah. I kinda figured that when I re-read the post after I made my response, but I didn't edit it just in case. My excuse for any misunderstanding ... I just got up!
| QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig) | ||
IIRC, this scene is performed by Bale himself, as the stuntman wasn't able to do it. |
The whole scene is done by Bale, from the initial spinning rifles to the upside-down-twin-pistols somersault (assisted by a springboard) to the close combat fire with a half dozen troopers.
He did most of his own stunt work for the movie.
-karma
Dude, how did they make the rifles spin?
My guess would be midgets.
| QUOTE (emo samurai) |
| Dude, how did they make the rifles spin? |
I think they just hung the rifles by fishing line, so when the barrels get smacked they spin around to point at their former users.
The DVD commentary wasn't too specific about HOW they did the scenes, just that Bale did much of the stuntwork himself. Partly because he wanted/was willing to do it, partly cos they had like hardly any budget.
-karma
Magic!
| QUOTE (Fortune) | ||
Yeah. I kinda figured that when I re-read the post after I made my response, but I didn't edit it just in case. My excuse for any misunderstanding ... I just got up! |
Well, considering what I did yesterday in the basic magic questions thread, I think I can forgive you.
Magic midgets?
| CODE |
Auto-loader The auto-loader is not so much an accessory as a modification to a weapon. A master gunsmith can add it to any pistol or machine pistol that uses a removable clip. The auto-loader replaces the magazine and the grip of the weapon. The auto-loader allows a clip to be inserted in to a weapon as a free action, either via the press of a button, or via smartlink. Using an auto-loader introduces a slight element of of instability - the threshold to glitch with a weapon that has one installed is decreased by 1. An auto-loader can combine with a hidden arm slide to allow a gun to be reloaded even if the user's hands are full with a successful agility+firearms (3) test. Note that it is still a free action or standard action to remove a clip before the auto-loader can be used. Firearm Accessories Mount Availability Cost Auto-loader — 14R 1,500¥ Adding an auto-loader to a weapon requires an extended logic+armorer (10) test. |
I'm imagining something similar to the Cleric's weapons, from what I remember.
I basically envision a pistol where the side of the grip slides open, the clip is shoved in, and mechnical gears roll the clip into place and lock it in.
I set it to 14 availability, because I envision this being a *very* custom item, and requiring a skilled armorer
| QUOTE (2bit) |
| it never ceases to amaze me that people can think the fight scenes in equilibrium (or ultraviolet, for the same reasons) are anything but laugh out loud comedy. |
I turned it off.
Twice.
I got to the part where they're checking his car for dogs, and he does the completely silly close combat fight. And I turned it off.
Then, a few hours later, I told myself "But, seriously - so many people love it. Maybe it's worth it. I'll try again, actually watching, not just having it on as background." I got about 10 minutes past.
I fast forwarded to the end, and was some what entertained by the final fight, but that's it.
I mean, how do you screw up a guy in black leather dual wielding pistols?
| QUOTE (KarmaInferno) | ||
I think they just hung the rifles by fishing line, so when the barrels get smacked they spin around to point at their former users. |
The shotguns were spun around on the foregrips - that was the main reason for them to have foregrips, IIRC.
| QUOTE (lorechaser @ Dec 1 2006, 05:27 AM) |
| I'm imagining something similar to the Cleric's weapons, from what I remember. I basically envision a pistol where the side of the grip slides open, the clip is shoved in, and mechnical gears roll the clip into place and lock it in. |
I don't see a need to modify the weapon itself.
The arm-slides would work independent of the pistols, and the clips that he threw down the hall and then later used to reload had just been modified to land the correct way up. No actual weapon mods would be needed, at least in my opinion. Just really decent accuracy in hitting the right spot for a reload, which would be represented by high agility.
See, I don't really remember the movie, so I was going off a half-remembered scene.
Now I have a vague memory of that - the clips landed facing up, and he somersaulted past them, reloading? Something of the sort?
That would be a completely different style than what I was suggesting, yeah.
My thought goes like this:
*blam blam blam blam blam blam click*
Free action, clips drop out of the weapon, and the slide on the grip opens, to reveal a small set of whirring gears.
Free action, shooter flexes his arm, and bends his hand to the side, and the clip jumps out of the sleeve, aligning itself next to the open slide. The shooter flips his hand around, and the clip lines up with the open slide, and the gears grab it, and whir it upwards, locking it in place. The slides close, and blamming resumes.
Now I have a vague memory of that - the clips landed facing up, and he somersaulted past them, reloading? Something of the sort?
That would be a completely different style than what I was suggesting, yeah.
My thought goes like this:
*blam blam blam blam blam blam click*
Free action, clips drop out of the weapon, and the slide on the grip opens, to reveal a small set of whirring gears.
Free action, shooter flexes his arm, and bends his hand to the side, and the clip jumps out of the sleeve, aligning itself next to the open slide. The shooter flips his hand around, and the clip lines up with the open slide, and the gears grab it, and whir it upwards, locking it in place. The slides close, and blamming resumes.
| QUOTE (Fortune) | ||
Why? Why couldn't it be adapted to hold clips? Or a Stun Baton? Or a club sandwich. Seems to me that the wording is deliberately left vague (pistol-sized object) in the description to facilitate this very thing. |
...hmm .5 litre cans of Whoop Ass Energy drink.
snap, chug, ahhhh...
now she's charged up & ready for that Saturday Night Firefight.
| QUOTE (lorechaser) |
| Free action, clips drop out of the weapon, and the slide on the grip opens, to reveal a small set of whirring gears. Free action, shooter flexes his arm, and bends his hand to the side, and the clip jumps out of the sleeve, aligning itself next to the open slide. The shooter flips his hand around, and the clip lines up with the open slide, and the gears grab it, and whir it upwards, locking it in place. The slides close, and blamming resumes. |
But that's what I mean. Why all the unnecessary adaptions to the pistol, when an arm-slide will just pop the clip into position, and you just turn your wrist the right way to slide it in?
If you ruled that there was no way to get a good 'seating' with the above method, then the gunbunny could always cross-load, springing the clip on his right arm and slamming his left pistol onto it, and vice versa.
I just don't see the need for all the gears, I guess.
| QUOTE (lorechaser) |
| I got to the part where they're checking his car for dogs, and he does the completely silly close combat fight. And I turned it off. |
Nonono, you got confused somewhere along the way. You turn the movie, any movie, off when there is a dolphin. Just to be on the safe side
.Dogs are fine, sometimes.
| QUOTE (Fortune) |
| But that's what I mean. Why all the unnecessary adaptions to the pistol, when an arm-slide will just pop the clip into position, and you just turn your wrist the right way to slide it in? If you ruled that there was no way to get a good 'seating' with the above method, then the gunbunny could always cross-load, springing the clip on his right arm and slamming his left pistol onto it, and vice versa. I just don't see the need for all the gears, I guess. |
True.
I guess I was aiming for something slightly more...realistic?
Popping out the clips and then slamming them home would be pretty dang cool, and could definitely fit. You could simply require the agi+firearms (3) test to do that properly.
| QUOTE (lorechaser) |
| I guess I was aiming for something slightly more...realistic? |
Stop trying to inject your realism into Gun-Fu™!
| QUOTE (Butterblume) | ||
Nonono, you got confused somewhere along the way. You turn the movie, any movie, off when there is a dolphin. Just to be on the safe side .Dogs are fine, sometimes. |
Is this a specific reference to Johnny Mnemonic or does it just happen to apply?
I think what irks me most about Equilibrium/Ultraviolet is the director's idea of a hero vs. henchman gunfight always seems to involve them standing in a perfect circle unloading their weapons into whatever's in the middle. Who the fuck does that!?!?!?
And that simply speeding up the camera will make it KOOL.
| QUOTE (2bit) |
| Is this a specific reference to Johnny Mnemonic or does it just happen to apply? |
Of course it is a reference to Johnny. But since I can't think of a movie with a dolphin worth watching, I just made it a general rule. Just to be on the safe side
.Standing in a circle, firing at someone inside isn't that good an idea.
| QUOTE (Butterblume) |
| Standing in a circle, firing at someone inside isn't that good an idea. |
Not unless your circle of henchman has the higher ground. Can't shoot your own dudes if they're all firing down at a 30* angle, right?
Height difference - that would work even when the target has the higher ground .
.
| QUOTE (KarmaInferno) |
| The whole scene is done by Bale, from the initial spinning rifles to the upside-down-twin-pistols somersault (assisted by a springboard) to the close combat fire with a half dozen troopers. |
the jump flip was done by a stunt man, on a trampoline. they couldn't risk bale breaking his neck doing a back flip.
You know, just checked, you are right, they had a stuntman for that one flip. He did do most of the other stunts himself, though.
-karma
-karma
waaaa waaaa I have to sacrafice a simple action to reload my gun. Nevermind the fact I have two simple actions every Init pass so I can still shoot once that pass.
My 18 dice pool shooter is ruined he'll be pumpled in the two thirds of a second he isn't shooting.
My 18 dice pool shooter is ruined he'll be pumpled in the two thirds of a second he isn't shooting.
Feh, if you really need that much ammo, just pick up a really high juggling skill. Carry 10 pistols and just juggle/shoot them. If you are using bog standard predators, that 150 rounds right there in your hands... 
| QUOTE (Crusher Bob) |
| Feh, if you really need that much ammo, just pick up a really high juggling skill. Carry 10 pistols and just juggle/shoot them. If you are using bog standard predators, that 150 rounds right there in your hands... |
Now thats a trick,
| QUOTE (Jack Kain) |
| waaaa waaaa I have to sacrafice a simple action to reload my gun. Nevermind the fact I have two simple actions every Init pass so I can still shoot once that pass. My 18 dice pool shooter is ruined he'll be pumpled in the two thirds of a second he isn't shooting. |
2 marks.
| QUOTE (Fortune) | ||
Stop trying to inject your realism into Gun-Fu™! |
Especially when it has anything whatsoever to do with Equilibrium!
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