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psykotisk_overlegen
There's a volcanic Island that was first(I think) mentioned in Dunkelzahn's will in this paragraph:
QUOTE
To Federated Boeing, the land and mineral rights to the volcanic island that will erupt 301 kilometers due west of Petrolia on October 3rd, 2060.


It was mentioned again in YotC, on page 86 under the header "Unnamed Island".


Has it been mentioned in any other books? Have anyone used it in their games? Any ideas for who/what might still be there in 2070?


Edit: Also, it's due west of Petrolia, California right? So that would place the island in the eastern pacific.
HappyDaze
How does one grant land and mineral rights to something that doesn't even exist at the time of death? dead.gif
psykotisk_overlegen
Wuxing asked the very same question when they were discovered "squatting" on the island, mining orichalcum. I think they were kicked of in the end though, damn squatters.
Jack Kain
QUOTE (HappyDaze)
How does one grant land and mineral rights to something that doesn't even exist at the time of death? dead.gif

Being the first to know the island's existence allows him to stake a legal claim over the island.

That or when the island rose there was a clear sign from Dunkelzahn saying "This is my island!"



Here's a question where are all the conspiracy theories that Dunkelzahn isn't dead? shouldn't those be all over the SR world. You have a clear start with Dunkelzahn's body never having been found.
Ravor
I don't know, I'm with HappyDaze on this one, the island didn't exist at the time when Big D was an entity capable of filing legal actions so being the first to 'discover' it doesn't cut it.

However, I supose that since the Draco Foundation IS still around and capable of filing legal claims at the time the island existed then its all good provided that they file the claim and then turn it over as per Big D's request.

*Edit*

As for a conspiracy about Big D not being dead, well I think that the lack of such conspiracy theories might in itself be 'proof' of such an conspiracy. cyber.gif
HappyDaze
300 km out is way beyond national boundaries. That means that if an extraterritorial corp (like Wuxing) is there first, it's pretty much theirs. Sure, you can opt for "negotiation by lightsaber" or even other methods, but there's no real way a will (even of a Great Dragon) is going to be binding in this case.
lunchbox311
QUOTE (HappyDaze)
300 km out is way beyond national boundaries. That means that if an extraterritorial corp (like Wuxing) is there first, it's pretty much theirs. Sure, you can opt for "negotiation by lightsaber" or even other methods, but there's no real way a will (even of a Great Dragon) is going to be binding in this case.

Unless he happened to own the waterways around that area. Then when said island popped up he would own that as well. Then he could surrender rights to someone else if he so chose.
HappyDaze
QUOTE
Unless he happened to own the waterways around that area. Then when said island popped up he would own that as well. Then he could surrender rights to someone else if he so chose.

Is it even possible under our current laws to own a stretch of open ocean 300+ km offshore?
iron mouser
All it takes is a small chunck of land to be a meter above the surface for it to be claimed. It could be that this small chuck is what the claim of ownership was originally on and when said new 'Nameless Island' appeared it was close enough to be part of the territory of the original speck.
lunchbox311
QUOTE (HappyDaze)
QUOTE
Unless he happened to own the waterways around that area. Then when said island popped up he would own that as well. Then he could surrender rights to someone else if he so chose.

Is it even possible under our current laws to own a stretch of open ocean 300+ km offshore?

I dunno, but maybe you can own the floor mineral rights for the area like oil companies probably do for oil rigs.
Jack Kain
The pirate bay torrent site was looking to buy Sealand an man made island.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principality_of_Sealand.

"It comprised a floating pontoon base with a superstructure of two hollow towers joined by a deck upon which other structures could be added. The fort was towed to a position above Rough Sands sandbar where its base was intentionally flooded so that it sank to a resting place on the sandbar. The location chosen was in international waters, approximately six miles from the coast of Suffolk, outside the then three-mile territorial water claim of the United Kingdom."

The reason being they'd be in international waters.

So i'm sure Big D could have found away
mfb
maybe Dunk didn't care if it would be legally binding. maybe he was just making sure someone found it, and had other machinations in place to make sure it ended up in the hands of the people he wanted to have it.

which, for all we know, may have been Wuxing.
Jack Kain
QUOTE (mfb)
maybe Dunk didn't care if it would be legally binding. maybe he was just making sure someone found it, and had other machinations in place to make sure it ended up in the hands of the people he wanted to have it.

which, for all we know, may have been Wuxing.

Except Wuxing was kicked off.
Synner667
Hmmm

Well, if the landmass rose to the surface..
..Who'se to say it hadn't been above the surface at some other time and had sunk ??

And at that time, it was owned by the Big D, or his representatives ??


There are islands that rise and sink, according to geological shifts..
..So they must 'remain' there even when not visible ??


Not forgetting, that he could have done a underwater survey of that area for a different purpose and noted that it would rise at some point [tho, his knowing the exact time and date would need something unusual to be that accurate - a bound elemental, with unusual instructions ??]


Just my thruppence..
Ancient History
Y'all miss the obvious solution: the Draco Foundation squatted on the area until the island emerged, claimed it, then filled the bequest.
TheRedRightHand
Or maybe it was just his Dragon nature showing through. He was Telling everyone who could use/have this island. Legality be damned. And if someone didn't listen to what he said then they would pay the price.
mfb
QUOTE (Jack Kain)
Except Wuxing was kicked off.

before or after finding whatever it was Dunk wanted them to find? assuming that's what was going on.
psykotisk_overlegen
So apart from the legal headaches of the whole thing, no one has any thoughts on this? No one have used it?

If it isn't mentioned in any other books, we might as well make something up. I'm having a hard time deciding what's on the island in 2070. I'm thinking it'll still be the property of Federated-Boeing. There's bound to be some signs of it having been mined by Wuxing nine years ago, but with the natural orichalcum vanishing after the year of the comet there probably isn't much point in mining there any longer.

So, to what use might F-B put what is essentially a small, little known, out of the way island? It would be great for a villain's secret lair, but I'm not sure that would fit with F-Bs style.
Ancient History
You've never read Year of the Comet, apparently. It has been used. Wuxing's "squatting" consisted of strip-mining the island of the natural orichalcum that criss-crossed it before they were driven off.
psykotisk_overlegen
QUOTE (psykotisk_overlegen)
So apart from the legal headaches of the whole thing, no one has any thoughts on this? No one have used it?

If it isn't mentioned in any other books, we might as well make something up. I'm having a hard time deciding what's on the island in 2070. I'm thinking it'll still be the property of Federated-Boeing. There's bound to be some signs of it having been mined by Wuxing nine years ago, but with the natural orichalcum vanishing after the year of the comet there probably isn't much point in mining there any longer.

So, to what use might F-B put what is essentially a small, little known, out of the way island? It would be great for a villain's secret lair, but I'm not sure that would fit with F-Bs style.

I added some emphasis to my own quoted post there wink.gif

Yes, I know Wuxing mined there.

My question about anyone using it was aimed at GMs, as in, have anyone used this island as a setting or plot element in their game?
Ravor
Well I haven't, but if I did I would go with the angle that Big D wanted the island strip mined in order to further whatever his real goals are. (If you buy the idea that his ultimate goal is to wander the metaplanes for all time leveling out Mana Spikes and delaying the next Scrouge then I've got a bridge to sell you.)

Personally I think I'd plant an enterance to a corrupted Kaer on the island and the 'volcanic eruption' was more akin to Mother Gia expuling a cancerous tumor then a natural event.

Then the only question becomes, why did he want Wuxing to be corupted? After all, Whatever his will may have said, Wuxing is the corp that has funky Astral Space around their HQ, so it stands to reason that he wanted them to have whatever was on the island without alerting the other Imortals...

psykotisk_overlegen
What's with all this Wuxing-Dunkelzahn conspiracy talk?

Dunkelzahn gave the island to Federated Boeing.

When the island first appeared the orichalcum hadn't shown up yet, and FB didn't think the island was worth the hassle. Then, later during the orichalcum rush they went back, and found Wuxing mining on their property.



Are you saying that Dunkelzahn somehow knew that FB would simply ignore the island, and then secretely tipped Wuxing about something interesting there? Why wouldn't he just give the island to Wuxing in the first place then? The nuyen.gif nuyen.gif nuyen.gif he left Wuxing in his will already showed that he was supporting them, so why not throw in the island?

Or is this just a misunderstanding. To me it would make more sense if Dunkelzahn really wanted Federated Boeing to have something on that island, since he gave it to FB. But whatever Dunkelzahn wanted FB to have might have ended up in the hands of Wuxing, seeing as they mined it before FB took a close look.


What's a Kaer by the way?
Edit: Searched some old threads. If anyone's interested they were discussed in this thread.
hyzmarca
Dunkie is of like Captain Kirk in that he can bend or break any rule or law he wants without any consequences. He probably has green women falling all over him, too.
FrankTrollman
Giving it to Federated Boeing may have been simply a way to make sure that Wuxing's orichalcum finds became public knowledge.

Or it could be that Duynkelzahn's plans don't always work.

-Frank
mfb
incontheivable!
X-Kalibur
QUOTE (mfb)
incontheivable!

Never start a land war in Asia and never bet with a Sicilian when death ith on the line!
psykotisk_overlegen
If there is something really old on that island that Dunkelzahn knew about it's probably from the 4th world.

So, what existed in that general area in Earthdawn?
I haven't played ED so my knowledge is a bit limited.

What could have been placed there for safekeeping, or hidden there, or lost there, or been killed there, or whatever that Dunkelzahn knew would re-emerge and would want Wuxing/FB to have?
NightmareX
QUOTE (psykotisk_overlegen)
If there is something really old on that island that Dunkelzahn knew about it's probably from the 4th world.

So, what existed in that general area in Earthdawn?
I haven't played ED so my knowledge is a bit limited.

The area beyond Europe, some of the Middle East, and India was never detailed in Earthdawn.
psykotisk_overlegen
I'm guessing there's no "canon" answer to what that island might contain then.

I'm not sure how big I want this to be, but I'm pretty sure I'll include some weird magic background there, and maybe have my PCs come across a manastorm.
My problem is what Federated Boeing could be doing there. AFAIK they are mostly into metallurgy and aerospace, none of which really fits on a small volcanic island. Maybe they're using the locations for one of their joint projects with one of the greats. Hm.
Jaid
"meteorology station"?
ShieldT
Airport?

Extraterrestrial Airport? grinbig.gif
Jack Kain
Some times it was Big D. is explanation enough.
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