as the topic describes, I have a player who, inspired by the new Shadowrun videogame, wants to write a teleport spell. another player mentioned that in the book it says no one has managed to teleport or bring someone back to life with magic yet - the question is: should I allow a minor version of the spell into the game? what do you all have to say on the matter? I told my player that whatever this forums consensus was would be my answer. have at it

No. The Mana Level has not risen enough as it was in ED where a mage could physically step into the NetherPlanes and step out in a new location. Do not allow the cheesiness and non SR of said video game to pollute your RPG. This is Shadowrun not a FPS wannabe.

I would also advise against it, since it is simply a too powerful effect.

Bye
Thanee

I voted no as this effect is specifically excluded from player characters, however

Also this is not <unnamed fantasy game>

Street Magic, page 159.

If the character has a high double-digit magic rating (sixty or more) then he should be able to pull it off. It would be best if he were trained by an IE.

...no, no, no, no, and no. At least not until tech has first found a means to successfully pull off matter transmission.

(...just hope there's no "fly in the ointment..." )

Tell your player he is fail, then burn him for being a heretic to boot.

The absolute MOST I would allow them to do would be create a 'walk through walls' power, but the drain could would be in the +2D area and it would be instantaneous, allowing you to travel through a single wall, limiting you to a distance based on your travel speed. But that's only after he bought me a LOT of beer and pizza.

I'd rather just have the wall temporarily (Sustained duration) be rendered insubstantial rather than opening the doorway to teleportation effect. No pun intended.

Big problem I see is that - for the type of work performed in Shadowrun - Teleport-type effects will become 'must-haves' if allowed. I don't like must-haves that can't be accomplished in any other way.

As for IEs... in my games they are just Free Spirits with Realistic Form that choose to appear as elves. Sure, they can 'teleport' by going through their 'metaplanar shortcut' - see Street Magic - but it's not really a teleportation effect.

To many editions....

I'm pretty sure in one of them at least some things had the power to take physical bodies into the astral, and then out again at a different point. That would be a nerfed teleport in effect.

In ED players could get that ability. But it was not easy, and your campaign would have to go a loooooong time.

A player getting the ability in SR would be pretty epic and probably involve an immortal elf or dragon.

I voted for the nerfed version actually, 1 of the 2 people.


First off, there are some pretty spectacular spells. Stacking an Improved Invisibility spell with some sort of speed increase and levitate and you have a sort of Macgyvered teleport spell.

I don't see it being too unbalancing if it were:

A. Absolutely D level drain.

B. Meters limited by force. Here's a tricky one. Some well cybered individuals, or adepts, or simply people with a great stat and Athletics skill can probably JUMP several meters. Athletes today, non cybered, can jump pretty amazing distances with a running start. But, you're teleporting THROUGH things, so perhaps it should be a reasonable limit, Meters=to Force or Magic Attribute, whichever is lesser(casting it at force 8 but only a 4 magic would result in physical drain for a 4 meter teleport. But hey, you got through that wall.)

C. Teleporting into things and getting stuck would be very, very, very bad.

D. Teleporting through things meant to block mana-like barriers, could likewise do some serious disrupting of your body. If not simply vaporizing you, to prevent this from happening. A more kind approach might be to simply say ''this spell cannot penetrate astral barriers'' and make a reason why.

E. It sort of balances itself if the people don't check to see what's on the other side of that wall.

With all of these in mind, i don't see it breaking the game. Perhaps what might be in order, if i for some reason were to introduce it(i had or have no plans to do so, im just not against a weak version...but i admit it would take some thought into the whole ''why'' thing), is a playtest to see just what it could do. Perhaps im not missing something.

The issue isn't balance. Teleport can be very balanced. The issue is flavor and precedent.

It has always been impossible for normal characters to teleport. only IEs could possibly do so. Allowing a teleport spell drastically changes the flavor of the game.
More importantly, if you allow one spell from the video game it weakens your ability to reasonably deny other spells, such as Resurrection.

It warms me cockles to see DS so united on an issue.

Just say NO to teleporting.

(though I would allow a phase thru walls spell).

I wouldn't do the "poof!-hole-in-space" type teleport, if at all. I might be okay with an approximation of teleportation that transforms the target into an immaterial energy, moves them, then reforms. This would explain disallowing teleports going through mana barriers (or at least forces them to fight the barrier with the spell's Force).

Of course, there's another limits you can place on it: target location must be in line of sight. Maybe ritual magic would allow you to go somewhere in the spotter's line of sight. Maybe.

It's moot, really, because I don't really want that in my game. Not our style.

Long ago in first edition I introduced few things that came to pass anthroform drones the infamous R.O.C 13 project hehe and long involved south american run that ended up a gun battle deep in jungle over some confusion over who was gonna hold the important "chip". I digress hehe during this run groups mage a equally famous charecter due to his ability to roll handfulls of dice and get no six's. Came across a spell formula in a ratafarian dragons bunker, this spell was limited version of teleport.

The could move you from point a to point b with such speed to as appear to teleport. Could not move thourgh solid matter and could not lose momentum from casting. ie Wormwood struggling with south am rebel on small prop plane, rebel turns out to be werewolf, Wormwood "Teleports" out of the falling plane, Wormwood impacts the jungle floor at incredible speeds. ;;) Spell limited 10 meters per force pnt. Havent used it since but was tons of fun at the time.

I've been toying with adding a spell that looks like teleport. It is LOS only and the character doesn't teleport, he is just moved so fast that it appears to be instant. They also have to be super careful of objects in between points A and B. Going through walls is out of the question in my game.

no, a) because it's too powerful, b) because god in heaven i don't want to see the rules debates that would spring up over it. and c) because no! just no, dammit.

see, the funny thing is? i really am showing restraint.

I don't mean literal energy. Some type of magical stuff. Ether. Ectoplasm. Whatever floats your boat.

Ok so then wouldn't it rip the very fabric of Astral Space into so many tatters?

...


Oh and for my vote, you can have your fragging teleport over my rotting corpse...

Actually, I do have a brilliant idea. Let him have his teleportation spell but stipulate that it was taught to him by a powerful magician called Nemesis, apparently the cybered vampire magician from the First Edition adventure Total Eclipse, and it requires that he shed his own blood, taking inflicting 1 box of physical damage for every 10 meters traveled.

The catch is that the magician who taught him the technique was not the Nemesis from Total Eclipse. He was, in fact, the Nemesis from Earthdawn. The Spell works be creating a shortcut between Earth and the deepest of the Deep Metaplanes. Every time he uses the spell he leaves a piece of his soul there and he brings something back with him.

While you're at it, give him a free Force 4 Power Focus that doesn't have to be bonded.


I'd also let the Resurrection and Tree of Life spells work. Of course, the resurrected individuals would possess regeneration and have an unquenchable thirst for human brains while the Trees would actually be uncontrolled Toxic Plant Spirits.

No to teleport. Yes to increased movement spell.
Base the spell off of Telekinesis with Self-Only effect.
Perhaps increasing movement speed per hit.

If my GM allowed a teleportation ability, the first thing I'd do is roll up a character twinked just to break that spell wide open, because deep down inside, I still have a bit of evil power gamer in me. Even just the ability to move without ever leaving cover in a combat situation could be ridiculously awesome. Merrily skipping past security checkpoints is already heinously easy with proper use of Spirit Concealment powers, the last thing you need is for mages to just bypass those areas entirely. If teleporting were at all possible, I'd actually make it a ridiculously high PP cost adept ability, because I'm sorry, anyone with that capability would be horribly overpowered if he was really skilled at other tasks as well.

thanks for the responses, especially the alternatives offered - that has really made it easy to respond to my player in a way that offered some modicum of the ability he was trying to go for (phase thru walls spell) while allowing me to respect the current limits of magic as written in the shadowrun books (which is important to me since I'm studying to become a commando and thus a practicing SR purist rulewise).

to quote street magic,

As for going through walls he could employ use of the spell Shatter (pg 197) or a touch version of the Acid Stream Spell (DV = (F/2) +1) to create a hole in the wall through which everyone could step.

Not just hell no but hell fucking no.

I like hyzamarca's idea best. If you're going to make an evil change to Shadowrun, you might as well do it right.

Alternatively, along the ideas of 'converting to energy' somehow, allow the person convert to some sort of energy... Just not back. I'd laugh for days with that one.

matter can be converted directly to energy. simply apply anti-matter, and the atoms will annihlate each other!

/useless

I believe the idea was to convert the body into energy WITHOUT annihilating the rest of the planet in the process.

Although I do think a 'teleport self and planet' spell would be pretty funny.

But....think of the ninjas! The ninjas shed silent tears not being able to phase through walls. Imagine, your players will finally stop playing pornomancers and start playing more ninjas instead!

...

Question:

If ghostwalkers physical form came out of the Watergate rift?

Would it be possible to have a spell that is not a teleport but moves one physical body to the astral.

I would see this as a possiblity:


Ascend to Heaven:
Type Physical +1
Range Touch -2
Duration instant +0
Major Change: +2
Elemenental Effect +2
----------------------------
Drain: (F/2) +3

Requires a voluntary subject.

The caster must achieve a threshold test depending on how thick the barrier between the astral and the mundane are (thought of 1 hit at say watergate rift, to 4-6 hits normally).

If sucessfull the spell pushes the physical body to the astral plane.

Note: Living bodies can not survive innately in the astral. Each turn in the astral they will suffer five physical damage to the ravishes of the astral space on the physical body. As a 'living' body, the entity keeps all of the physical stats (since body is actually here); however they are fully on the astral so movement etc is as per a projecting mage.

If the entity has astral projection it can manifest on the mundance just like a projecting mage, but barring 'Descend to earth' or the like is trapped on the astral.



Living Cocoon:
Type Mana +0
Range Touch -2
Duration: Sustained +0
Major Change +2
Elemental Effect: +2
--------------------------------
Drain (F/2) +2

This provides a means to protect a living body in the nothingness of the astral space. Each hit provides a die to soak the damaging effects of a living body in the astral.





Descend to Earth:
Type Mana: +0
Range Touch -2
Duration Instant +0
Major Change +2
Elemental Effect +2
-----------------------------
Drain: (F/2)+2

This spell will attempt to throw a physical body from the astral back to the physical world. It requires a voluntary subject and the caster must achieve hits equal to the threshold of the area. (ranging from 1 at say watergate rift to 4-6 for 'normal areas)

If not enough hits are achieved then the body stay on the astral.



-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Those three spells would provide something 'close' to teleporting, with some support from cannon information (ghostwalker physical form was in astral / came out of rigt).

The cost and drain is enough that very few save perhaps the IE and/or greater dragons would actually risk it, but it would provide an 'fast' means of travel (not exactly a teleport) for those wishing to avoid normal travel.

i would stat it as a metamagic, rather than a spell.

it's debateable whether ghostwalker's physical form came out of the astral rift, though, as i recall

he definitely wasn't physical when he came out of the rift--he was specifically described several times as being an astral form. the general assumption is that his astral form was trapped in the metaplanes, and that when he came out of the rift, he went and found his physical body.

Well soemthing 'physical' came out of it enough to fly to Denver and engage in air to dragon combat


So either he somehow can materlize (not manifest) while projecting, or he came out.

Also IIRC my Earthdawn wasnt he sentanced to go into the astral to fight the horrors for his crimes.

Actually if you want to be evil take hyzmarca's suggestion and add a time differential to the equation. rolling 2d6: 1 = combat passes, 2 = turns, 3 = minutes, 4 = hours, 5 = days, 6 = weeks; with the second open-ended dice determining number of time increments of travel taken..
This wouldn't be time travel just how long it takes the character to find his way through the Meta-Planes and back.

For added fun and confusion you can add a backwards possiblility, or increase the time differential on a glitch.

Trying to remember which book I read it in, but thought he was followed pretty much from the rift to Denver.


If the Astral Form went someplace picked up a body, then went to Denver seems like that would have been noted, but my memory says it was followed, watched, observed going straight to Denver.

they lost track of him before he got to Denver. he was travelling too fast to keep up. YotC, i think.