Hi,
the rules say, that EVERY TIME you buy a dress (or something like that), you have to make an opposed test with your fake ID... ("Using a forged ID", page 260, Core Book)
The big question: Does this make sense?
It means, that you make dozens of tests every day... Which means, that even a level 6 fake ID will lose a test (even if all scanners are only level 1) at least once a week (much more if higher level scanners are involved). And this would (should?) probably lead to a big mark "FAKE" on your SIN...
Somehow I don't think that RAW makes sense here...
Full Version: Using a Forged ID
Price of living in a wired world. That, and if you keep multiple fake IDs and switch 'em out regularly, things move smoother.
I have a housrule that Fake SIN's auto beat any scanner that is more than 1 rating lower than the SIN rating.
So a rating 6 fake SIN automatically beats any scanner of rating 4 or below. A rating 5 SIN auto beats any scanner of 3 or below. etc.
So a rating 6 fake SIN automatically beats any scanner of rating 4 or below. A rating 5 SIN auto beats any scanner of 3 or below. etc.
| QUOTE (Ancient History @ Oct 4 2007, 04:03 PM) |
| Price of living in a wired world. That, and if you keep multiple fake IDs and switch 'em out regularly, things move smoother. |
It's hard to pay thousands of Nuyen every week just to get a new fake SIN, because the old one got burned when you wanted to buy a soyburger
Somehow I don't like the idea...Nice Houserule, Tippy.
| QUOTE (Emperor Tippy) |
| I have a housrule that Fake SIN's auto beat any scanner that is more than 1 rating lower than the SIN rating. |
Works for me. Any guidelines on the scanner ratings at...
...Stuffer Shack
...toll gate at major bridge (eg Golden Gate bridge of San Francisco)
...airport
...Weapons World
...City Hall of Seattle
...reception desk of Draco Foundation office
...processing of new arrests at Lone Star/Knight Errant
Alternately, a Rating 4 SIN can buy a hit and always tie or beat a Rating 1 scanner.
(tie results in verification questions eg mother's maiden name)
that depends on the consequences of failure. if you only fail by a hit or two, you probably just go "what? check it again", and when they rescan your ID (and reroll the test), it works. if you glitch, then maybe your ID gets marked as fake.
| QUOTE |
| Stuffer Shack |
1
| QUOTE |
| toll gate at major bridge (eg Golden Gate bridge of San Francisco) |
Depends on the bridge, a 1 or 2 usually (if its a border crossing its higher)
| QUOTE |
| airport |
5 for local flights, 6 for international flights.
| QUOTE |
| Weapons World |
4 to 5, I usually go with 4 but if you try to buy real heavy ware or a large number of guns I usually use the rating 5 scanner.
| QUOTE |
| City Hall of Seattle |
Just getting in the door is a 3, meetings with higher level people or getting into restricted areas can be as high as a 6.
| QUOTE |
| reception desk of Draco Foundation office |
Anywhere from 3 to 6 depending on whats going on in that office.
| QUOTE |
| processing of new arrests at Lone Star/Knight Errant |
Misdemeanors are usually a 3-4, felonies are a 6.
I also increase the time it takes for each check depending on the level.
Rating 1 scanner : Instantaneous
Rating 2 Scanner: 3 seconds
Rating 3 scanner: 12 seconds
Rating 4 scanner: 1 minute
Rating 5 scanner: 5 miniutes
Rating 6 scanner: 10 miniutes.
And a scanner can be used at a lower level than its rated for. So if you are friends with the secretary at city hall she might just run it at rating 3 while if you piss her off it might be rating 6, just to waste your time. Likewise, if the airport is backed up security might only run rating 4 scans and run say 1 in 5 people through the rating 6 scan.
My assumption is that the only thing a retail establishment cares about is whether they will get hit with the bill. So as long as you really have money in the account and are not doing anything exotic it's no problem. They just don't care.
Rating 1 is fine for buying a burger or a power tool. Don't try to buy guns or rent cars using a rating 1 fake, as the store really does will care who you are as they have legal responsibilities and/or significant financial implications from fraud.
Rating 1 is fine for buying a burger or a power tool. Don't try to buy guns or rent cars using a rating 1 fake, as the store really does will care who you are as they have legal responsibilities and/or significant financial implications from fraud.
Tests against a fake ID are made when it's dramatically appropriate. Hint: buying a soyburger at McHugh's, or a pair of flats from the machine on the corner isn't dramatic.
| QUOTE (eidolon) |
| Tests against a fake ID are made when it's dramatically appropriate. Hint: buying a soyburger at McHugh's, or a pair of flats from the machine on the corner isn't dramatic. |
Gotta agree there. Unless the character has the Bad Luck quality or wanders into high sec zones/buildings he should be more or less ignored.
This is why god created fixers.
| QUOTE (Aaron) |
| This is why god created fixers. |
Not really. We are not necessarily talking about illegal, or even hard-to-find stuff. Just ordinary everyday clothing and the like. I don't tend to have my characters bug their fixer every time the need a new set of jeans or a refill for their nutrisoy machine.
I also don't roll for the phone call to see if the system determined, while you are calling your fixer, that you were using a bogus ID and reported you to the cops. Which it certainly can do. But that would be kind of mean.
| QUOTE (Fortune) |
| Not really. We are not necessarily talking about illegal, or even hard-to-find stuff. Just ordinary everyday clothing and the like. I don't tend to have my characters bug their fixer every time the need a new set of jeans or a refill for their nutrisoy machine. |
True, but a fixer can get stuff like that for you without the hassle of risking your fake. In the past, most of my characters' lifestyle payments went to their fixer. Sure, it meant no impulse purchasing, but it also meant no twenty-questions with mall security.
Oh, incidentally, here's a little system I use from time to time to determine the rating of SIN verification systems on the fly.
Roll 2D6, subtract the lesser from the greater, use the difference as the rating. If the result is zero, the place isn't checking right now for whatever reason.
For higher-security places, I roll 3D6 (or even 4D6) instead.
Roll 2D6, subtract the lesser from the greater, use the difference as the rating. If the result is zero, the place isn't checking right now for whatever reason.
For higher-security places, I roll 3D6 (or even 4D6) instead.
My thought is that the owner of a scanner may be billed not only for the scanner but for each check, depending on how intense it is to be performed. A rating 1 system might not even be permanently online but just keep a small database of its own with severly reduced data (like only the SIN itself and if the associated bank account is valid) and only perform a bulk check with the SIN-checking-whatever-institution once a day.
That way, even if a SIN check fails, it might take a while before it's recognized at the central agency and until then there's only a local entry on that particular rating 1 scanner which may be hacked and have the failed check removed from the logs.
A rating 2 scanner won't be checking for more complex data but it has a direct line to the central database.
Rating 3 performs more complicated cross-checks and so on...
That way, even if a SIN check fails, it might take a while before it's recognized at the central agency and until then there's only a local entry on that particular rating 1 scanner which may be hacked and have the failed check removed from the logs.
A rating 2 scanner won't be checking for more complex data but it has a direct line to the central database.
Rating 3 performs more complicated cross-checks and so on...
I don't understand why people think that airport security is going to be crazy tight in the shadowrun future. If you want to bring down a plane, magical attacks are Line Of Sight. For goodness sake, everything is privatized in the future. What kind of ID do you need to demonstrate to land at a flight school?
-Frank
-Frank
Flight schools live at airports...Where yes, security is tight.
| QUOTE (Penta) |
| Flight schools live at airports...Where yes, security is tight. |
Beep!
The correct answer is "none". You can land a plane on an international flight at a flight school and the passengers don't even have to show a passport.
-Frank
There is also the advantage of certified cred. As long as the item in question doesn't require a permit, you should be able to pay with certified and bypass the need for an ident-scan.
Buy a dress, certified should be fine. Obviously the upscale boutiques may not take certified.
Buy a gun, the store is going to run a scan. If you buy a gun from an arms dealer though, he probably won't run a scan because he isn't reporting the sale on his taxes.
Buy a dress, certified should be fine. Obviously the upscale boutiques may not take certified.
Buy a gun, the store is going to run a scan. If you buy a gun from an arms dealer though, he probably won't run a scan because he isn't reporting the sale on his taxes.
| QUOTE (BishopMcQ) |
| If you buy a gun from an arms dealer though, he probably won't run a scan because he isn't reporting the sale on his taxes. |
Crooks don't care who you are as long as:
1) you are not a cop
2) you are not planning to whack them or rip them off
3) your money is good
4) sometimes they want some idea what you are planning to do with weapons, as being the guy who sold a gun to someone who shoots up a kindergarten has a high probability of unpleasant consequences.
That was pretty much my point. As long as you shop off the grid, no one cares who you are and won't run your SIN.
Another idea is don't have it be an opposed roll have it be a strait roll.
In our group we use the SIN guide lines in the SR4 missions available online.
In our group we use the SIN guide lines in the SR4 missions available online.
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