Hahaha, thanks for the warning/heads up. Most of the us that I'll be hanging out with are married and or in relationships, so I'm likely safe. Can't speak for the general con population however. Plus I'm hardly worth fighting over when there are hot chicks running around in COSTUME!


IT is done. I have a 4-day badge coming my way. It'll be awesome to see the old gang again (at least in part) I think my plans involve spending most of the con with the LITS/DITG kids like I was supposed to last year, but we'll definitely have to cross paths!

4-day tickets are sold out now. Glad I got mine when they had them!
I hope to see anyone from the boards there, maybe via a game session or two!

Wait... what? Sold Out?

*blink*

That's... new. Wonder if they're limiting registration somehow, because of the loss of space this year or something.

Hrmmm...

BUll

Ahh, yeah, that always helps Nerds are afraid to approach a female when she's in a pack. <grin>



Bah. My experience is that usually the ones worth fighting over are the ones that don't do the whole "Look at my boobs!" costume thing

Unless it's a really good Baroness costume (from GI Joe). Then I'm doomed

Bull

I think there was a quick bit today when they thought the VIG regs were already sold out. They were not however, so I believe there's more than enough passes still floating about.

Are those VIG Packages worth it?

They're not a bad package really. YOu get abadge, access to a few exclusive events (I'm not sure exactly what), priority housing in the close, good hotels, and a pile of the Gen Con swag (T-shirt, backpack, etc).

But, it's $500. So it's a big investment, especially if you're not particularly interested in the swag or the exclusive events.

I would like that priority housing though. That's probably where a lot of the suites downtown went.

Bull

The only problem I have with it is that it just guarantees a hotel reservation to my understanding. I was wondering if anyone has ever bought it or know someone who has bought it before and how they liked it or didn't.

I hate to have stopped the momentum. So what does everyone look forward to when they go to Gen Con? I have never been, so I'm geninuely curious.

Here's what i look forward to...

Gaming with people outside of my "usual" group. Getting a different perspective of how other people play is always refreshing.

The general atmosphere...having all of those gamers together in one place.

Always love talkin shadowrun with the folks at the Catalyst booth...and they must have much better Social skills then i do as well, because they always seem to Con me out of money.

4 days of uninterrupted gaming heaven. No wife, no dog, no nothing. Just me and a few thousand of my fellow gamers.

oh yeah, and looking at all the half-naked chicks in their costumes sure does help. Good job on the Conan booth last year, and that pirate chick wasn't bad either.

Crit's secrets to a fun-ass GenCon.

1 - Being amongst "my kind" for four full days. As gamers go, mind you, I'm remarkably socially well adjusted. So don't misunderstand, and think I'm some sort of fugitive from reality who only feels comfortable while at 'cons...that said? There's just something fun about meandering through the crowds and listening to the snippets of conversation. Sometimes you'll hear things you won't hear anywhere else. Sometimes you'll feel like your amongst thousands and thousands of your social circle from college (no matter how long ago that was). Sometimes you'll hear lines from all your favorite movies, rules arguments from all your favorite games, and everything in between. You'll see your favorite t-shirt on someone else, play games with people that like all the things you like, you name it.

2 - Playing games I like with new people. There's something that's a lot of fun about sitting down at a table full of complete strangers, and in the space of several hours turning it into a one-shot gaming group. Maybe it's your chance to play an archetype one of your regular buddies always claims for his own, and finally see what it's like to be the Fighter instead of the Mage. Maybe it's a chance to show off your well painted wargaming army to a slew of new folks, instead of your friends back home who take it for granted. Maybe it's a chance to see how someone else GMs. Whatever it is, have fun. Share your knowledge of the game system with new folks, and pick up their secrets in the meantime. Every year, I sign up for one game I know and love, and ditch my friends to go play it.

3 - Playing new games with people I like. My buddies and I make a point of trying out a new game every year. It might be a brand new system, a new edition of a game we haven't played in years, a game we've all got books for but haven't ever tried out, or someone's home-brewed monstrosity, but we give it a shot. It's a blast. Two years, now, we've all ended up starting up a new campaign because of something we tried at GenCon and had fun with. Every year, I sign up for one game I don't really recognize, and do so with my friends.

4 - Play something really fucking out there. I already brought up our "one random LARP a year" tradition, but it's really a lot of fun. We don't LARP. I mean, ever. We're tabletoppers, wargamers, video gamers. But for six hours, once a year, we hang out with the melodramatic kids, fake accents, get into character, play rock paper scissors, and generally just have a good time. Some years it works out great (if someone in one of our games falls over, dead or dying, my friends can count on me to shout "It's okay, I'm a doctor! Make way!" in a horrible Irish brogue and then scurry over to them and pick their pocket. Why? Because my Irishman con artist did so in a Shadowrun LARP, about five times in the space of one game). Some years it works out not so great (we caused some drama about two years ago, as half the players in a particular Firefly LARP went home and bitched about the runners of that LARP and their "give us money and we'll give you more points" scam). Some years we just have a solid good time, taking a break from our normal playing style and our normal GenCon routine. Hell, last year I did a speed painting contest (and I'm NOT that good a painter, as wargamers/hobbyists measure things). For you and your buddies it might be a LARP, but maybe a wargame is really weird to you, or a board game, or a new card game. Whatever. Just broaden your horizons, once, while you're there. Play something you'd never look at twice from your local shop.

5 - Leaving time to do nothing. Especially if you've never been before, leave time to just wander. Explore the Hall Of Cool Stuff For Sale (don't even buy anything, necessarily, just roam through it!). Try out the free sample games people give. Chill and hang out with game designers in their booths (especially for Spinespur, we don't bite, plug plug plug), have conversations with booth babes who secretly hate you and all your kind, look through old comics and ancient Dragon magazines. Budget time for getting lost (especially this year since they're down 30,000 feet or whatever, so games will be scattered), and don't be scared to ask anyone else you see with a badge for directions -- odds are they've been there more than you have, and will try to help out. As fun as it is to leap in with both feet and sign up for a zillion games, don't do it! Leave yourself several hours a day to just relax, eat, hang out with your buddies, wander the mini's hall and look at paintjobs, whatever. GenCon is a vacation, treat it as such!

I think I will just take the 4 day pass and do the hotel.com/expedia hunt for some good deals. I'm just going with my best friend from College, so little need to really go all out since he likes to be frugal and he is a graduate college student. I can pick up the VIG pass when there is more people going or just my girl. It also occured to me that if I got the VIG pass and got a really sweet room, since I would want to go all out. The only person to enjoy the expensive company is my best friend. I'm not any kind of phobic, but it would feel awkward and my friend didn't help.

His line was, "I'll bring the strawberries and champagne!"
My reply, "You Son of a Bitch!"

I'm not a LARP person and I've had plenty of bad experiences with LARP in Iowa and I seem to suck at Paper, Rock, Scissors. Does anyone have a range of how much hey spend. I want to give my frugal friend an idea of how much he would need to bring.

My earmark for a room is ~$500 total (hotel tax in Indianapolis is retarded), split that however many ways are needed. I know some places are more, some places are less, but when doing my rough budgeting for any given year I start with 500 as a good round number. Or, in your case, two-fifty (since from the sounds of things there's two of you).

Games are $2 an hour this year, I think. A four-hour brick is the default game length, so tell yourself ten bucks a game (see how you budget in extra money, cleverly? I R GENIUSCAT). Figure out how many games you want to play, and call it ten bucks a pop, there's your gaming cost.

Do you have any planned shopping? Lots of games drop big products at GenCon, so if you know of something that's hitting shelves there, make sure to budget it in. I can safely say, for instance, I'll drop a $50 on whatever Privateer Press launches at GenCon (even if this year it's their $50 that I'm just giving back to them, suckers!), so I just go ahead and budget that puppy right in there.

Then, you've got to budget in casual purchases, meals, taxis (depending on how far your hotel is), and a billion (or maybe fifteen-twenty) bucks a day for parking. Depending on where you eat -- I do suggest trying SOMEplace cool in downtown, like The Ram or something at least once -- meals can vary insanely. Ditto, casual purchases. Most places (in my experience) run a "to the convention center, $5" special as far as cabs go, but sometimes it varies by hotel and stuff like that. So, really, this "everything else" category is the wildcard that's all up to your friend.

Just be prepared when you hit that dealer hall, you can find some VERY cool deals there, but even while you're "saving" money by getting stuff for so cheap, your wallet can empty out pretty fast.

There is usually always 2 or 3 of us going, so that figures out to be almost 200 bucks a person for the hotel after you factor in getting raped on hotel tax and parking fees (we like to stay really close to the convention center)

I try to factor in about 20 bucks a day for grub. Reason being is because i make LOTS AND LOTS of sammiches, and eat them as i do my daily Con activities. However, there is that occasional Pop i must drink, and then the Con is not complete without a trip to The Ram.

Depending on how many games you wanna try to get into, that's 10 bucks a game.

The vendor area can get scary. I dropped 200 bucks in there in like 5 minutes, and didn't even realize what i had done until i went to purchase the item i was actually looking for and had no more cash on hand. If you have a 1 Willpower like i do, leave credit cards with a friend so you can beat him and take it in case of emergency.

Seeing that i'm poor guy myself, i usually budget about 5 to 6 hundred bucks for the whole trip, and i have a pretty good time. The grocery store, and a backpack can be your best friends...

Yes... you must budget time where you aren't scheduled to do anything... and you will not have time to sample everything! You can spend four days at Gencon Indy, and spend 72 hours watching the anime running in 6 different rooms. Oh wait, can't watch 6 anime streams at once. And that's just one activity. You can spend 8 hours a day in the vendor hall trying all the new games in 1 and 2 hours sections, oh wait, there are more games to demo then you have time! You can spend hours roaming the art section, shopping, watching movies, reading game materials, talking to film and tv stars, listening to state of the industry speeches, meet the people that actually write these games, watch the costume contests, get thrown into Klingon Jail, play live chess, watch a band concert, play the prerelease video game, play the current release video game, play play play.

And somewhere in all of that you need to eat, sleep, go to the bathroom, and actually play a game of Shadowrun, or LARP, or explore the True Dungeon, or attend the Castle Falkenstien LARP Fancy Dress Ball.

I think the one thing you don't have to worry about is finding something to occupy your time.

If you are bored at Gencon, it is no one's fault but your own.

I think if it is going to be my first time. I really doubt it would happen.

Gen Con is posting for chapter 11. Does anyone think it'll impact this year's con? Will it scare anyone away?

Gen Con Press release

Doubt it. Gen Con Indy itself is always profitable and growing. It's some of other things the company tried that didn't work out.

I think the biggest impact to the Con will be the loss of convention center space due to the remodeling.

Def not scaring me away. Lookin forward to goin this year.

The loss of space for the next year or two (DOn;t remember how long construction is gonna last) sucks, but it'll be worth it in the long run.

I'm not sweating it too much, but I am hoping that Dunner will be able to get a dedicated game room this year. Having everything all scattershot last year really sucked.

In unrelated news, my four Dark Heresy games have been submitted, and are pending approval. I'll post the full data if/when I get 'em all back -- the more players, the merrier.

How the hell could they need to file bankruptcy when a 12 ounce pop at Gen Con cost $3.50? And there are thousands of people there!
Plus the fact that each person wandering around paid good money to be there.
Still gonna go, myself. Especially since I live only about 55 miles away and don't have to worry about hotel rooms.

The Bankruptcy is really a chapter 11 protection, and is a response to Lucasfilm suing them for something like a million dollars. I suspect there's a lot more going on there than Gen Con "stealing" money from a charity auction, but at the end of the day, it's Lucasfilms. They have a lot more money and a lot more lawyers to throw at this, regardless of who's in the right.

Gen Con doesn't control the pop or food prices at the con. That's all handled by the Convention Center themselves. AFAIK, GC doesn't receive a dime for any of that overpriced pop. And that's fairly "normal" pricing for a stadium or convention center, sadly.

And lastly, GC brings in a lot of money, but they also spend a TON on the con. At the very least renting out that convention center, promotions, and hotel rooms for the staffing (And there is a lot of staffinG), plus paying all the temps they hire to run the registration booths, the maintenance folks, and security (Which I believe is all an extra cost beyond the space rental)... I won;t say that Peter Adkison doesn't make a decent living off Gen Con LLC, but he's not exactly raking in piles of cash off each convention either.

Of all the money that we spend to go to the convention every year, the only thing GC LLC sees very, very little of it.

http://www.adamjury.com/2008/gen-con-sued-by-lucasfilm-llc/

Thanks for the info. Please ignore my bitching about the cost of Mountain Dew (ambrosia! ) at GenCon. As if Lucasfilm doesn't have enough damn money. Lord.

Thanks for the response Adam, lots of good info there.

Y'know, I'm just sort of thinking out loud here -- but have you ever thought of maybe buying food and drink somewhere else, and taking it with you to the convention center? You're already lugging around a bunch of books and dice and various swag and loot...why not grab a bunch of sodas at a Wal Mart or something on your way to Indy, and be all set?

I mean, no one's making you pay $3.50 for a can of Dew.

Camelback. Hydration and it makes you feel hardcore.

But yeah, if you're buying drinks at the Con you're only screwing yourself.

I rarely buy anything at the convention center if I can help it. There are exceptions (like when I've been chained to a demo table for 6 straight hours), but on the whole... This is why I like having a hotel room close by. I'm a big fan of being able to run back to the room every few hours to drop off swag, swap out books, change and shower before dinner, etc.

To be fair, you're not supposed to bring in food and drink. Doesn't really stop anyone, and AFAIK it's not really enforced, but still... I can see why some people don't want to do that.

I'd also highly recommend getting water or Gatorade (or equivalent sports drink) instead of pop. I'm a big fan of my Mountain Dew Livewire, but a cold 32oz bottle of Gatorade is amazing after trudging around that hot, sweaty convention center for a coupe hours.

Plus, Gatorade makes a great mixer for Vodka or Everclear

Bull

Plenty enough reason for me...

yeah.. remember that when 11 am rolls around and you have to cut back... holy shit can that stuff keep you rolling though (as the people who dropped by "Who's Run?)

Ah yes... the old standby of fader-ade.

Has anyone seen a "sport" related injury at a con? Like someone who actually passed out from dehydration or some such? I haven't been to GenCon in quiet some time but I hope to be able to go again once I get back stateside. Hopefully I can pay part of my way by doing some medical support

Yeah, they have a lot of money, so Gen Con totally should be allowed to take their stuff and sell it!

Hey, we'll have low cal G2 this year (so far its tasty good) so it'll be healthier.

I've seen a few people get pretty sick from dehydration at cons. More often in the marathon sessions where people forget things like eating and drinking (and breathing sometimes). Its not dreadfully common as most geeks prepare well for these events, but it'll still happen from time to time.

Personally I pack several bottles of water and trail mix to keep blood sugar and hydration at proper levels.

Gave up the Everclear a number of years ago....

Yeah, but I've seen it happen more at DragonCon (where more folks are tromping around in the Atlanta heat, in multi-layered costumes) than at GenCon.

The fact everyone tries to rehydrate by drinking soda instead of water doesn't help, though.

No, that's not what I meant. I don't know anything about the case at all, beyond the bit of the lawsuit you linked to earlier. I just assumed that GenCon did give the money to the charity like they were supposed to. But I don't know, maybe I'm wrong. I seem to be sticking alternating feet into my mouth, so I think I'm gonna just move along to another thread.

If you read my summary, it's pretty clear -- or should be -- that Lucasfilm is accusing Gen Con LLC of not only auctioning the Lucasfilm memorabilia and not giving the money to charity as promised, but of also not paying other fees/royalties associated with the convention. That's actually the first point of the lawsuit and the most sizable one, to the tune of $500K+ in compensatory damages.

Obviously, this hasn't gone to court yet, and we may never know the whole truth, but the accusations are pretty damning, and Gen Con LLC filing Chapter 11 and Peter's admittance that they made some bad decisions trying to grow the company certainly make it sound like the accusations are valid.

Well, i would like to think that Gen Con LLC didn't screw up intentionally; however if Shadowrun has taught me anything it's that corporations cannot and should not be trusted.

But then again, doesn't LucasArts have a reputation of being pretty stingy when it comes to their properties and the rights therein?

As Bull pointed out, the actual Convention Center has posted notices forbidding outside food and drink. Though, I too, have not seen it enforced.

That is why I like being stationed in a hotel when volunteering or GMing. Both hotels I have been at so far provided pitchers of free ice water and glasses.


What do you mean, like suing the original Battlestar Galactica and getting it cancelled.

If Tolkien or Gibson were as bad as Lucas, Shadowrun would have probably been sued soon after its release. Might be why SR is set on a future Earth and not some planet far, far away with space travel.

Sorry to be a little late to the thread but figured I'd kick in my thoughts on a couple of items.


Actually, the rooms used for the VIG participants are part of a seperate housing block that GenCon sets aside for itself. Granted it's probably still a part of the greater whole of all rooms available in the area but it's basicly a sampling of rooms in the connected hotels, and if you take them at their word, the GC coordinators have sworn up and down that it doesn't come from the pool of rooms that gets set up for the general attendees. The perk there is that you generally get the hotel you want and don't have to get lucky on hotel registration day. Personally, my corporate rate beats the pants off the gencon rate (I'm paying $117/night at embassy suites) so I generally reserve rooms outside of the block anyway and unfortunetly since this is a major perk of the VIG badge it makes it less valuable to someone like me.

Other than priority seating for the costume contest, they haven't announced what the VIG special event is this year. They may or may not still do the VIP area for the PitP (Ruckus on the Roof?) though I've heard that as an event it has never really been good. There is an interesting perk this year where for an extra $35 you can tag a friend to have access to the VIG lounge. This oddly enough is a pretty good deal for your buddy since the lounge features free beverages throughout the con, event registration (no standing in line, though they've also added a perk where VIGs can escort friends to the head of the line for registration), and since the SWAG beyond the VIG specific stuff like the backpack, con shirt, pin, etc are now a 'feature' of the lounge, they also get access to that. The lounge is located in the convention center so being able to stop off for some refreshment whenever you want on your way to and from stuff is pretty damn nice and while I wouldn't say pays for itself, it certainly is valuable.


Last year was the first year for the VIG program and it was a bit disappointing. Primarily because gencon failed to do some proper expectation setting and generally just over promised while under delivering. This year from a tangible benefits perspective doesn't really seem to be much better but the organizer they've got in charge of it now has been much more communicative and responsive so I expect less of the pissing and moaning about broken promises and the like. There's certainly plenty of potential for it to be good but right now I'd say that it's got marginal value, especially if you've already got your housing situation sorted, and there are probably better things you can spend your money on. In the spirit of full disclosure it's worth noting that I did re-up this year since I see potential for it to be worth it and apparently I have more money that sense and am willing to gut it out at least one more year to see if it clicks this time around.

Since I'm a horrible elitist asshole at heart, and now that my wife's out of nursing school I'm finally turning a profit on my financial investment in her -- which is to say I'm in charge of more money now that I'm used to, and could in theory afford it -- a big part of me approves of the VIG Package in theory.

The problem is that, as has been stated, it just really doesn't seem worth the tremendous cost compared to a plain old badge, etc, etc.

Just as a heads up, the CGL Shadowrun events have been submitted to the convention. Once we get approval from them, we'll make that information publicly available.

Well, my games are all officially "pending review," but they've got their numbers assigned and whatnot, and I didn't cuss or insult anyone's mothers in the write-ups, so I'm going to go ahead and assume they'll get the green light, and post the info.

They're not Shadowrun games, sorry, but all the reasons I posted earlier still hold true. I've leave the Shadowrun sessions to the guys that know the new edition better than I do, and I'll just have fun running no-brainer combat fests in the grim darkness of the far future. Warhammer 40k fans should appreciate the chances to gear up and get their hands good and bloody, instead of prancing around with the normal intrique and horror and stuff (which I just don't see there being time to do right, in a four hour one-shot game).

So, anyways. I know they're not Dumpshock's favorite game system, but if anyone wants to give Dark Heresy a shot, or just take a break from shooting people in the face in one game (to come shoot people in the face with a different die mechanic behind it), consider yourselves invited.

So, it seems the VIG package is approximately $500 and then for $35, your buddy gets all the perks (except having to buy another badge)?

So, basically, $535 + 4day badge / 2 per person? That's not so bad of a deal.

Eh, all that means is that SR games will be relegated to the basement meeting rooms of the Crowne Plaza and once more I will be forced to roam the halls in search of poor lost runners.

"No, ladies and gentlemen, the Hall Monitors are wrong, the SR Tournament is not in this room."

On the plus side, it does add to the seedy ambiance of criminals meeting in dark clubs for nefarious purposes. On the down side, it's a hell of a hike for food or drink.

So a quick question to all you GenCon Veterans (I myself have really only attended the smaller regional Cons), what would be the best way to spend a day (think 8-12 hrs, more is possible if that is just no feasible, but 8-12 is better for our schedule) at GenCon? My GF and I will be in the area for an unrelated event and would like to have a chance to swing by and hopefully grab a game (SR of course) and do some shopping and gamer networking, if possible. How hard is it to get not one, but two seats at a table? I'm not used to this whole pay for play thing, nor the lack of pre-registering for a game, so excuse me for being a complete noob. Also, since we will be coming from accross town, how hard is it to find parking? Does it matter what time we arrive (ie, is earlier better than later, miday it dies down for a small window, etc)? I guess the general, if this is your first GenCon, you should do ______.

And where is this Ram...cause I like food and think it should be part of the whole Con experience. NEXT STOP, DRAGONCON!!!

There are a LOT of answers to this. Keep in mind that with that little time you'll scarcely get a chance to see the convention.

First thing first -- the line for badges on Friday and Saturday can be bat-shit insane. Pre-register, even if you're only getting one day tickets. I believe you'll be able to pick up your badges or have them mailed to you. If you don't do this you may lose 2-4 hours of your day waiting in the queue.

Arrive early. The earlier you get there, the easier time you'll have finding parking and picking up your badges, if you have to do that. There's parking right across the street from the Convention center on multiple sides. The one time I came in on a Saturday, I had no problem finding a spot. However, I did make it a point to arrive before 9AM.

The GenCon dealer's room opens at 10AM and closes at 6PM on Friday and Saturday. (If you're only going for one day, it's got to be one of those two.) IMO, the dealer's room is the single most important item in a visit to GenCon. If your interests in gaming are broad, you'll have a hard time just investigating the dealer's room in those 8 hours. There's two reasons for that -- it's bloody huge and it's generally very crowded. Just walking through the entirety of the hall would take well over an hour. Actually trying to shop adds on to that time frame significantly. If you try and spend the time to play a few demos, look at the art exhibits, and take a lunch break, you'll easily spend your alotted 8 hours here. If you're trying to do it in less than 8 hours OR if there are any limited GenCon releases that you're trying to obtain, then get a map of the dealer's room before you leave and map out a path. Trying to just wing it in there just isn't feasible.

There is a myriad assortment of events. For folks who are interested in the entirety of RPGs, then the ENnies awards are a must see. (Conveniently held after the dealer's room closes.) The auction's fun, but you'll wnat to look at the schedule and see what types of items are going to be sold while you're there. There are endless seminars devoted to gaming styles, gaming companies, and anything else game related. Most of these are free to attend, and are a great way to find things out even before they hit the internet. There are many rooms showing films of all sorts. Frankly - if there's something you want to experience in gaming, it's probably happening at GenCon.

If you really want to play in some games, I'd recommend trying to find ones that are held outside of dealer's room hours. Then, pick something that's got a fair number of players. From the Shadowrun side of things, we have a number of events that we schedule for 12 players. Those are events where we've got extra GMs on hand, specifically to handle overflow. I'd recommend that you consider ones like that.


A couple of blocks away by the skyway from the convention center. If you head towards the shopping center, through the skyway, you take the stairs down next to the parking lot. The Ram's decent, but I think it's a bit overhyped. It gets a lot of coverage on the GenCon forums primarily because they host "The Stink" there on Wednesday.

So the quick answers are pre-reg (have to pick a day that weekend), get there early and plan on spending more time there. AWESOME!!! Thanks for the response Dun...more people feel free to post their opinions. I like ideas