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CircuitBoyBlue
There's an example geas in Street Magic where you can only use magic in "the city." I don't have my book on me right now, so I can't quote the exact wording, but I do know it's vague about whether this means one particular city, or cities in general (as opposed to "the countryside"). This is about to come up in a big way, because my group is relocating from Seattle to Denver, and my character is an urban shaman.

What does Dumpshock think? Will I be breaking the geas by being in Denver? My group seems to think not, but I have two sticking points with that: a) I'm not sure I'm convinced, and at the very least my character would assume his powers are Seattle-centric, just because that's where he's been since he developed them, and b) I can't say for certain that the other players aren't just letting my powers work so I'll go along with the move (I'm not sure they realize that I'm perfectly willing to forego my magic and start focusing more on non-magical street skills while still maintaining a "shamanic" view of the world).
Kyoto Kid
...well sounds a bit too broad considering most runs I've seen take place in a city. Now with a GM like myself who has the runners gallivanting all over the world sometimes, it would come into play more often.
Magus
You only break the geas when you are in the wilderness and not in an "Urban" setting.
Would your Mentor Spirit happen to be Rat?
CircuitBoyBlue
No. My mentor spirit's messed up. Did you ever watch Northern Exposure?
Mugzug
Sounds like you are ok.

It is similar to a ninja adept whose power only works at 'night.' When day occurs it does not prevent a future night of powers from occurring.

See the logical consistency?
CircuitBoyBlue
True. I'm just worried that like Kyoto Kid said, if it works in any city, it might be too broad. Night is only going to be there half the time (barring any weird arctic circle type situations). That said, of the 4 missions I've participated in so far, 3 have been in actual non-urban settings, so maybe I don't need to slap myself with any further restrictions.
Kanada Ten
QUOTE (CircuitBoyBlue)
True. I'm just worried that like Kyoto Kid said, if it works in any city, it might be too broad. Night is only going to be there half the time (barring any weird arctic circle type situations). That said, of the 4 missions I've participated in so far, 3 have been in actual non-urban settings, so maybe I don't need to slap myself with any further restrictions.

You could always role-play your character connecting with Denver sprawl. Finding the city soul beating the same under a different skin after wandering the midnight hours and redlight districts. Perhaps using magic almost accidentally, instinctually in some appropriate situation, thus feeling the intimate connection that he only consciously doubted. After all, plus ca change...
Stahlseele
or you could say that the magic DOES work in other cities but not as good as it should and would in denver maybe a -something dice pool modifier to magical tests?. . while it doesn't work at all outside of cities O.o
Moon-Hawk
QUOTE (CircuitBoyBlue)
That said, of the 4 missions I've participated in so far, 3 have been in actual non-urban settings, so maybe I don't need to slap myself with any further restrictions.

Geez, you are some kind of glutton for punishment.

If your GM says it works in any city, fine, let it work in any city.

If you really want it to only work in one city but you don't want that to interfere with the campaign moving, fine, have your geas broken for the next run or two while you "re-attune yourself to a new city" and then have it work in Denver instead of Seattle.

Or get seven circa 2052 headware radios and be a burnout, I don't care. nyahnyah.gif
ixombie
Any city might be pretty broad, but one particular city is also too narrow. Just because some gaesa migh screw you over does not mean they all have to. And city limitation can be pretty harsh. Most runs stay in the city, but some force you to travel. You'd be without your powers when moving between cities, whether by train, plane, or car. Probably the most common scenario of a run taking place outside a city would be a job breaking into a complex out in the wilderness.

I would say that, on balance, any city is not excessively broad. While most runs will not break your geas, it's not outside the realm of possibility. It's not required that a geas totally screw you over, only that it places a limit on your powers. Talismans are the best example of that - you will probably not be placed in a situation where you lose your talismans, but in case you do, you're in big trouble. Same goes for a location(city) geas.
Kanada Ten
Manus, the Amazonian capital, might be one of those cities where the geas is broken, or perhaps a submarine/space based arcology - depending on development.
Stahlseele
also if you wanna rules lawyer on the definition of city
CircuitBoyBlue
These are some good suggestions (even the 7 headware radios from 2052--when I think Denver, I think Tom Waits, and being a burnout shaman somehow seems like a song he'd write...).

I guess I'll go at it from the standpoint that any city will work, after I've had some time to get the feel of Denver, and do some crazy shaman thing like try to talk to the local spirits without actually using the summoning skill. Without going too into it and getting off topic, my character (StreetGod) has some magical illness that's temporarily left him without a MAG attribute anyway, and I need to address some spiritual issues there before worrying about the geas (well, I hope--if the only possible solution ends up being medical science, I might be boned, because I'm not sure my shaman would think to go that route). In the meantime, I'm looking forward to playing a non-magical shaman for a while. This should be fun.
mfb
the city geas has always been a bit of a freebie. i don't have a problem with it, because it's easy enough for the GM to make it an issue, but i also wouldn't have a problem making it more restrictive.
Ravor
Personally I would rule that it would work in any city after the Mage become accustomed to that city, which woudl take about a week or so, just enough time to throw them into a run with the broken geas. (And of course, I would only allow it to apply to one city at a time so the Mage has to endure the pain all over again upon returning "home".)
toturi
Perhaps a city needs to be of a certain population size before it can be considered to be a city - see Jack Hawksmoor of Stormwatch.
deek
I don't know, several of my runs have required some decent travel...not like jetsetting, but creating an ambush in the mountains, traveling to a nearby town for information, or simply traveling a couple hours to get to the location of the run.

In all those scenarios, the mage would lose all magic and astral recon, right? I suppose if your game never leaves the confines of a city, then this is a freebie, but I know that our resident mage would be a lot less useful with this restriction.
BFaolan
I thought you only lost the points of magic attached to the geases when they were broken?

(ie, if you had three geases and broke one of them, you temporarily lost all three points until all three of your geased were fulfilled again)
Ravor
Correct, and if a Mage has enough geas that she is going to lose all of her magical abilitity when one is broken then she had better have a backup plan. cyber.gif
stevebugge
Slightly off topic, but what do you guys think of Kosher Diet and Sabbath for Gaesa. I'm building a character and I'm thinking of using those two.
djinni
QUOTE (stevebugge)
Slightly off topic, but what do you guys think of Kosher Diet and Sabbath for Gaesa. I'm building a character and I'm thinking of using those two.

since everything is soygene anyway I don't think the diet comes into play.
you would have to use the idiot's guide for the sabbath (no work at all!) instead of just a reminder its a holy day.
hyzmarca
Both are potentially debilitating in certain situations. Obtaining kosher food can be difficult in extreme circumstance such as captivity and wilderness survival. The Sabbath geas makes a character extraordinary vulnerable on Saturday, since he'd be unable to so much drive a vehicle, turn on a comlink, pull a trigger, or cast a spell. Unless, of course, you mean the other Sabbath ... Dun dun dun dun dun dundundundundun dun dun dun dun Has he lose his mind? Can he see or is he blind? Can he walk at all or if he moo-ooves will he fall?
CircuitBoyBlue
For extra badassery, take the Sabbath geas, and an allergy to soy.

I've got a friend who is gluton-intolerant (I can't remember the name of the disease at the moment), lactose-intolerant, has a few food allergies, AND chooses to abide by kosher dietary restrictions.

And both those geasa sound great. You didn't say where you're going with that character, exactly, but I think I get the idea. Which is the great thing about geasa that makes me love them so much: they go a long way toward making magical traditions distinct from each other, and add a ton of flavor to the game.

Just be careful with the Sabbath geas. I don't know exactly how it would work, but the only way I can really think of would be that if you break the Sabbath, your geas counts as broken until the next Sabbath that you keep. Which could suck, because you need to be down for a whole day, and if you aren't, it's a whole week of being penalized. That's doubly bad if you've got a second geas, because it also counts as being broken, even if you've been staying kosher.
ThreeGee
It's seems to me you could take these geasa a long way depending on how Frum you want the character to be. Heavily orthodox jews might refuse to use Trid and Commlinks, they might even refuse to talk to other PC's unless absolutely necessary, there are so many mitzvahs that could be converted to geasa.
stevebugge
QUOTE (djinni @ Jan 31 2008, 12:31 PM)
QUOTE (stevebugge @ Jan 31 2008, 03:10 PM)
Slightly off topic, but what do you guys think of Kosher Diet and Sabbath for Gaesa.  I'm building a character and I'm thinking of using those two.

since everything is soygene anyway I don't think the diet comes into play.
you would have to use the idiot's guide for the sabbath (no work at all!) instead of just a reminder its a holy day.

Actually the fact that most food is synthesized from Soy, Fungal, or Krill protien probably makes it not Kosher. Kosher is about preparation and sanitazation practices not just ingredients. At the very least it imposes a need for a high lifestyle just to have access to the proper food. Keeping the Sabbath does in fact mean that from Sundown on Friday until Sundown on Saturday activity would be severely limited or his ability to perform would be severely limited.

The character in development is an Adept whose background is in the LA entertainment industry, and until the flooding of LA was more or less just a B or C list Hollywood guy who happened to be from a Jewish family. When LA flooded, seeing as there was no real logical or scientific explanation for millions of cubic feet of water to suddenly flood uphill, the only possible explanation (at least in this characters mind) was God's displeasure with the multitude on non-practicing Jews in LA. So he went back to practicing, and was rather outspoken about it which subsequently got him booted from Hollywood society and employment. He's working Seattle as a perfromer with whatever gig his shady talent agent (also a low level fixer) can get him and street performing and being a bit of a con-man on the side (Can't totally erase that flexible Hollywood morality altogether).

Still a work in progress but I think it's got some potential
bibliophile20
Of course, this talk of a Sabbath geas is overlooking the fact that the laws state that, in the event of a life-threatening emergency, once must assist in healing (so, technically, not only is the Heal spell not forbidden on the Sabbath, it is required when the situation is life-threatening.

QUOTE
Actually the fact that most food is synthesized from Soy, Fungal, or Krill protien probably makes it not Kosher. Kosher is about preparation and sanitazation practices not just ingredients.


Too true; there are logistical reasons that Jews live in communities; living here in Rochester has been really difficult, because the Jewish community is so incredibly small compared to where I'm from. As a result, I have to cook nearly all of my own meals; as my parents commented, my apartment kitchen is better equipped than those belonging to many married-for-years couples.
Magus
I have a summoner/adept in the Order of St. Sylvester (sp?) who is Seattle as a missionary and some other secret means. His geas is based on the Roman Catholic Calendar. He cannot use do any magic on any Roman Catholic Holy day.
Cthulhudreams
Instead of getting a geas as your 'ordeal' when you initiate, you can sit in a box for a week (meditation) and carry forward no disadvantage and these two things are viewed as equivalent.

I figure that geas should be about as adversely impactful on the character as "During some downtime, I smoke some weed, eat cheetos, watch M.A.S.H reruns and make some extended test until I get it right' and given that, a DM is being a bit of a bastard if he won't let it be 'any city' - and game balance is presumeably totally okay with it being 'any city'

Given that, it's your RPing decision and yours alone. Maybe the guy is like batman, particularly at home in gotham, but one decaying urban dystopia is much like another.
Moon-Hawk
QUOTE (CircuitBoyBlue)
I've got a friend who is gluton-intolerant (I can't remember the name of the disease at the moment), lactose-intolerant, has a few food allergies, AND chooses to abide by kosher dietary restrictions.

Wait, gluton-intolerant? That's one letter away from a couple of meanings.
Did you mean he's allergic to a protein found in wheat, rye, barley, and oats, in which case he would be gluten-intolerant?
Or did you mean he hates people who eat to much, in which case he'd be glutton-intolerant?
It's just one letter either way.

I'm thinking you meant the former, but I initially read it as the latter.
And I'm a smart-ass. wink.gif
stevebugge
QUOTE (Cthulhudreams)
Instead of getting a geas as your 'ordeal' when you initiate, you can sit in a box for a week (meditation) and carry forward no disadvantage and these two things are viewed as equivalent.

I figure that geas should be about as adversely impactful on the character as "During some downtime, I smoke some weed, eat cheetos, watch M.A.S.H reruns and make some extended test until I get it right' and given that, a DM is being a bit of a bastard if he won't let it be 'any city' - and game balance is presumeably totally okay with it being 'any city'

Given that, it's your RPing decision and yours alone. Maybe the guy is like batman, particularly at home in gotham, but one decaying urban dystopia is much like another.

You can take Geasa at character creation for a few extra build points too, and if done properly it can add some good RP depth. Of course if done poorly it just adds to GM annoyance.
mfb
QUOTE (bibliophile20)
Of course, this talk of a Sabbath geas is overlooking the fact that the laws state that, in the event of a life-threatening emergency, once must assist in healing (so, technically, not only is the Heal spell not forbidden on the Sabbath, it is required when the situation is life-threatening.

plus, if you run across any asses in any pits, you know your day off just ended early.
CircuitBoyBlue
QUOTE (Moon-Hawk)

Wait, gluton-intolerant? That's one letter away from a couple of meanings.
Did you mean he's allergic to a protein found in wheat, rye, barley, and oats, in which case he would be gluten-intolerant?
Or did you mean he hates people who eat to much, in which case he'd be glutton-intolerant?
It's just one letter either way.

I'm thinking you meant the former, but I initially read it as the latter.
And I'm a smart-ass. wink.gif

Nyuk, nyuk, nyuk smile.gif
In her case, both apply, I think. But yes, I suppose I did mean "gluten."

@Cthulhu dreams: I took the geas at character gen. And yes, I am thinking of my character as Batman-esque. But then again, whenever he goes to Star City, he's still more of a bad-ass than Green Arrow, so that line of thought can go either way. I'm thinking of role-playing him as a fish-out-of-water at first, though.

Also, as far as initiation goes, my group has a house-rule where magicians and adepts (we have a total of 4) that initiate can't repeat ordeals until they've done them all (if any of us manages to initiate that many times, I'll probably have screwed up by living past 30). We made that rule precisely because some of the ordeals seem a little harsher than others. Since the idea of a shaman "hanging himself from a tree for 9 days" or whatever the book uses as an example is such a cool idea, we figured there should be at least some reason to do that rather than, say, meditate for a week.
Cthulhudreams
QUOTE (stevebugge)

You can take Geasa at character creation for a few extra build points too, and if done properly it can add some good RP depth. Of course if done poorly it just adds to GM annoyance.

Oh yeah, but it should still 'logically' have the same impact as mediation even if you take it at character generation, because Geas (Chargen) = Geas (Initation) = Meditation.

Basically you get some BP and write some back story and thats good all round.

As for the different ordeals thing, yeah the ordeals are a bit all over the place in terms of 'impact' but a majority of them are impact free. Coincidentally, why wouldn't hanging yourself from a tree for 9 days be anything other than a flavorful meditation ordeal?

hyzmarca
QUOTE (mfb)
QUOTE (bibliophile20)
Of course, this talk of a Sabbath geas is overlooking the fact that the laws state that, in the event of a life-threatening emergency, once must assist in healing (so, technically, not only is the Heal spell not forbidden on the Sabbath, it is required when the situation is life-threatening.

plus, if you run across any asses in any pits, you know your day off just ended early.

Pulling the ass out of the pit would probably be excessive. You could just as easily throw down a bucket of food and water and leave it there until tomorrow, unless the pit was about to flood or a hoard of army ants were about to descend upon it or something.
CircuitBoyBlue
QUOTE (Cthulhudreams)
Coincidentally, why wouldn't hanging yourself from a tree for 9 days be anything other than a flavorful meditation ordeal?

Because you have to take a test for it. It's WIL+BOD or something. If I'm not mistaken, you don't have a risk of failure with meditation. Either there's no test, or it's extended, so it just might take you a long time. With asceticism, I'm pretty sure you can fail.
Method
QUOTE (CircuitBoyBlue)
...I've got a friend who is gluton-intolerant (I can't remember the name of the disease at the moment)...

Celiac Sprue if anyone actually cares.
Fortune
QUOTE (CircuitBoyBlue)
With asceticism, I'm pretty sure you can fail.

Which, as far as I know, has no consequences. You could just do it again, hanging around for another nine days, and then another, until you get it right.
Cthulhudreams
Fortune's pretty much where I'm at - meditation requires some test as well, but as there are no mechanical consequences for failure, you can just try again and I don't even care.

The other funny thing is that aside from random encounter style 'downtime' schennagians, you're always going to be finished in time for the next job because your GM is never going to say 'go sit in the corner this session, you're off hanging from a tree or whatever it is you do' It's just not going to happen.

Ravor
No, I say "The rest of the team calls your alternate character for the next run because your Mage is just hanging around." cyber.gif
Fortune
QUOTE (Ravor @ Feb 3 2008, 09:43 AM) *
No, I say "The rest of the team calls your alternate character for the next run because your Mage is just hanging around." cyber.gif


And that's fair enough as well. It is definitely a possible consequence of a failed Ordeal, of course, but it doesn't constitute a 'permanent' failure to Initiate on the part of the character.
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