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CanRay
I mean, no benefits, the job enviroment sucks, and the customers are pure scum (And that's not even including the Johnsons!).

Sure, the pay scale is great, but it's very illregular, and the expenses are attrocious!

Not to mention getting shot at.

So, why do it?
Stahlseele
FOR THE HORDE!
*ahem*
more or less, yes . .
because they did not learn anything else most of the time, because they have to hide some times . . for fun, for money, for ponies . . for friends and familiy, for personal reasons, because they believe that One Man Can Make A Difference . .
Pendaric
Because the alternatives are worse.
Nightwalker450
My technomancer currently runs because Renraku has good suspisions of his ability. So he abandoned his old identity and took to running, his goal to build a new identity, and eventually get back to a normal lifestyle.

I've also had a rigger that spent all of his off time (and during some runs as well) participating in street races. The nuyen.gif was all for upgrades, to his racing car to get him into the high-rollers league. This was before arsenal, so we were winging most of it. I need to recreate him now that I actually have upgrades for a vehicle. (I priced his primary car at over 300,000 nuyen.gif when it was complete, probably more since some of it is "over-modification")
Kerberos
My runner runs because he needs to finance his agmentation addiction.
DocTaotsu
Doc T runs because it lets him "work out" his PTSD and feel like he's making a difference in the world.

That and betaware clinic don't buy themselves and a real hospital wouldn't let him use an AZ-120 to "calm down" a psychotic patient.
Leofski
Because once you're in its hard to get out, and its easy to be sucked in by the glamour when you grow up watching shadowrunner movies. How many people wanted to be a spy when they were younger because they thought it was like James Bond movies? Only with shadowrunning, the guys look to hire hire you tell you that the girls will love you, you will get in to the high stakes games and that theres no real danger.

J.D was already on the outside of the shadowrunning circuit looking in before crash 2.0, so in terms of work conditions and benefits it was a step up from his current position working as a gang level fixer and negotiator. When he "learned" to hack in the aftermath, he could start stepping up to real jobs. He'd been to young to get much work as a face, but people have fewer qualms about hackers and experience.
CanRay
Here's my own answer.
Fuchs
Because when you're owing money to the Mob, you do what you are told to work it off.
Shiloh
Because he was a petty criminal before the Crash and had seen working for The Man kill his father and mother in spite of all the shiny promises of security and care and jobs for life. Cynicsm drives him, and as a mage he's seen the cancer of background count eating away at Gaia; running the shadows offers more opportunity to stop that kind of thing than slaving for a wage does.
Crusher Bob
A picture explains is all. Do you like my hat? It's made of money!
Ed_209a
...Because he can't do anything else.

400BP characters don't grow on trees. They are highly trained, with extremely special abilities. I describe shadowrunners to new players as the Navy SEALs of the criminal world.

Shadowrunners stay shadowrunners because the can't or won't be hired by a corp or government agencies. I think every 400+ BP character who would be more of an asset than a liability will be courted by some corp or agency. That level of talent is just too rare not to. Something similar is happening today with special forces personnel being recruited by various companies, typically private security contractors.

This would be especially true of mages. You can spend 250k on implants, 250k on training, and make anybody a street sam. You can't buy a magic rating. Corp recruiters would overlook a LOT to get a new mage into the fold.

EDIT: To clarify, unless there are legal/personal reasons, corp/gov employment is VERY tempting. More pay overall for less risk. What's not to like?
paws2sky
Why run? It varies from character to character.

My Shark shaman was freakin' crazy (really, he was certifiable), couldn't deal with authority, etc. He didn't care to join a gang or a syndicate. He was half Sioux, so he ran into prejudice frequently (that was a big deal in the early 50's)... He just wasn't capable of functioning in normal society, holding a more conventional job. But he was a damn terrifying combat magician, a good summoner, and pretty good with his machete weapon focus too.

On the other hand, my decker started (pre-game) as a SINless ganger and worked his way up, picking up knowledge and eventually building his own deck and coding his own programs. He didn't have a SIN, didn't want one, and just enjoyed being a free spirit (something no corp could give him). Plus, he raked in fat cash doing shadowrunner shit. In that campaign he was one of the few non-corp deckers of any skill in Seattle. Since no one wanted to learn the SR1/2 Matrix rules, the GMs at the gaming club actually let me hop from group to group providing Matrix support for the different teams as long as there wasn't an in-game time conflict.
kanislatrans
Hugh,my mage , hit the shadows because he is looking for someone.

She's human, about 5' 7" tall and athletic. Auburn hair and flashing Green eyes. last seen wearing a red Pleather jump suit and holding a predator IV to a corp cops head. He thinks her street name is Muse. It was love at first sight.

So tell me, was he crazy to throw away a cushy corp career to chase an angel from the streets who probably doesn't even know he exists? Yeah, but in a world with so little happiness, even the glimmer of hope is enough to make people do crazy drek.

Keep lookin', Omae, Keep lookin'. smile.gif smile.gif
ArkonC
As others said, reasons vary wildly...

My current character is running because she has led a very sheltered life and ran away from it, simple as that...

My last SR3 character ran because he was paranoid to the max, and not existing seemed the best way to not be found...
Screams "SHADOWS!" to me... smile.gif

I have a streetsam (Mason) that I play occasionally, when I don't feel like being the face/doc, and he runs because no one else wants him, hell, the other members of the team don't really want him, he managed to turn his hobby into his job, namely, torture and murder for their own sake...
*BLAM!*
Team member: "Is he dead?"
Mason: "Not sure, lemme check..."
*BLAM! BLAM!*
Mason: "Yup, he's dead..."
Janice
My current character isn't a runner, he's an elf pit fighting adept, and he does it for the simple pleasure of being able to turn his fists on people and see just what kind of harm having a punch with the same damage and AP of a Ruger Super Warhawk can bring upon the next boob that steps into the ring.

Edit: A reason I could see for runners in general is the freedom such a job offers. You don't have to punch the clock at 9 and 5 and wear a suit all day, you don't have to pay taxes to the man, if you want to enjoy the simple pleasures of watching a monkey knife fight while wearing a speedo and slathering ice cream all over yourself, you're welcome to.
Starmage21
IRL, I am falling more and more into the beleif that its downright easy to get away with crime as long as you dont half-ass it. Too many people around me have not only have done things casually, but actually make a living off theft. In the last 10-15ish years of my life(the years after which I understood the repercussions of such work), none of those people have ever done time, nor talked about so much as a phone call from a detective.

Now imagine that someone with already questionable morals gets introduced to that kind of work, and certainly have the skills to make quite the successful career out of it. It pays decent, usually, but you really dont have much to worry about in terms of authority.

Hell, if I had the know-how to get away with the shit, I'd probobly do it myself.
ElFenrir
To make the long story short, Kaiser, my former company man, does it in a way of breaking out of his old corporate life. He's a martial artist that's probably killed more people-including shadowrunners, with his bare hands than he cares to think about; he's 25 years old, and his level of talent is indeed insane. He was trained since youth, used as a killer on command for his uncle from the ages of 18 to 23(as far as we are concerned, you probably start young), and while the beginning of his job felt like prestige and reward, he grew more and more disgusted with it.

He hated fighting these lower-end shadowrunners-the ones obviously doing it to eat, with poor gear, and they still fought him with everything they had, to the end, despite being outclassed. He was an honorable fighter at heart and felt like he was at an unfair advantage-there were ones, naturally, that were quite good too. He eventually met a couple of people willing to help break him out(if he wanted it). The final straw was when he killed three obviously underfed, outclassed runners, beating them to death, and seeing the final one-a small, thin, hacker girl whom this paydata would obviously buy her a way to eat and maybe a better place. Even looking at him with his gloves and boots covered in the blood of the others(she was more of a freelance hiree than longtime teammate), she was afraid but told him he didn't have to be there, since she saw the absolutely disgusted look on his face. He forcibly ejected her from an area with no guards, who were sweeping drones out of the rest of the place, and tossed her the commlink which he grabbed off her head. It was the first time he defied orders, and after that, he was gone about two months later by his own accord.

Now, all of that deadly corporate trained ability is available for the streets, and they aren't complaining. He takes a small pleasure, though, in busting open heads of those corporate monkeys that treat the runners like dirt and abuse them, trying to get his past off of him as if it were filth. He's got more friend now, and even a budding relationship with a magical scientist his age, so he's glad he made the decision to say the least, even though he still lacks some of the 'runner' skills like dealing with the streets and stealth, which he did't need as much. But he's learning.
SprainOgre
I'd imagine that for many a mage and adept, it's a chance to test your skills every day.

In general though I'd say for many it's freedom. Freedom from the soul crushing corporate grind of 50+ hour workweeks for table scraps or living in a gilded cage. It's being able to say "yes" or "no" to a job, because you want to. At least, ideally. Sometimes, you're just a sociopath with a lot of skills and abilities to earn an obscene amount of money doing things you have no possible objection to. I believe it goes "find your own truth" and that is probably the best answer of all.
DeusExOneiro
Prometheus runs because he's disgusted with the corporate life, he's pissed at his corp parents, and he's severely addicted to two very expensive street drugs (Psyche and Zen). And, while he's an incredibly smart and freakishly talented Chaos Mage, he's also 19 and dumb as hell. He sees Running as a grand adventure, and his nativity will one day turn him into a stain.

It's strange. I hear a lot about runners doing it because of the "freedom," but being SINless and "erratically paid" doesn't make the sky your limit. Someone else already mentioned that any Runner with a remote chance of fitting in at a corp would be bought out & brought in faster then they could scream "Freedom," Braveheart-style. (That to the tenth power for Mages.) I think that the majority of shadowunners are working either a) because they really CAN'T get any Up & Up job (meaning they did something really terrible), or b) they're insane/retarded/on a completely different trip than anyone around them; for whatever reason, they can't function (emotionally, psychologically, socially, etc) in the corporate, government, or "organized" sectors.

As to the "SINless and poor" thing, a fake SIN at Rating 6 costs $6k - not just pocket change, but not impossible. Granted, they're a bitch to actually get (availability 24), but that's just a matter of time. So, if you're SINless and poor, teh question becomes "why run more than once (or twice)?"

For the record, any character that would "fit in" at as corporate schmo wouldn't be as fun to play as the one who can't IMO.
Speed Wraith
Most of the players in my current group have characters that had been hung out to dry by their former employers. I suspect that is the case with the vast majority of runners out there. Many others, like my namesake for instance, became tired of the paperwork and bureaucracy and office politics to the point where no matter how many cool toys were thrown at them they just couldn't deal with it anymore. Freedom is freedom, even if it is a day-to-day existance with bullets constantly whizzing past your head.
last_of_the_great_mikeys
Mostly because of that Flock of Seagulls song...

cool.gif
CanRay
QUOTE (last_of_the_great_mikeys @ Apr 28 2008, 01:14 PM) *
Mostly because of that Flock of Seagulls song...

cool.gif

This one?
last_of_the_great_mikeys
That's the one. of course I could also have been influenced by this song, Blinded By the Light Heh...reminds me of the good ol' Street Samurai Catalogue.
Speed Wraith
QUOTE (last_of_the_great_mikeys @ Apr 28 2008, 01:14 PM) *
Mostly because of that Flock of Seagulls song...

cool.gif


What, not Pat Benatar? Every damned time I hear Shadows of the Night I think SR, just 'cause of the title nyahnyah.gif
ElFenrir
For me, the Pat Benetar song that says SR is 'Invincible', for some reason. Unsure why. biggrin.gif

http://youtube.com/watch?v=uJLCypVk1uQ
Speed Wraith
QUOTE (ElFenrir @ Apr 28 2008, 02:08 PM) *
For me, the Pat Benetar song that says SR is 'Invincible', for some reason. Unsure why. biggrin.gif

http://youtube.com/watch?v=uJLCypVk1uQ


That was our group's DnD theme back when 3e first came out wink.gif

Speaking of that song though, where the hell can I find a copy of the Legend of Billie Jean on DVD? sarcastic.gif
Kliko
Easy nuyen, nuff said
WeaverMount
Yeah I don't think it's that hard to keep the PCs criminals. This issue is keeping them flying all over the global and killing (meta)humans for vast sums of money. I 400bp rigger ought to be able to steal a parked par whenever they feel like it. I magician ought to be able to influence + alter memory to get most anyone to clean out there account and move to Guam before they remember that anything happened. And the only real difference between a 400bp Face and a Fixer is there rolledex. IMO proper shadow runners need to be extremely well compensated for what they do.
CrystalBlue
Crystal runs because he actually has a vision of a better future, one not run by corps and governments. See...getting into the shadows is like having a new perspective. You're no longer looking at the wrold through rose-tinted glasses anymore. You realise why being a stray is better then being kept on a leash made of gold. You see the world for what it is. Selfish, greedy, egotistical, and rapidly dieing from it's own evil. The world's been tainted by too many people thinking that they know what's right. And among all of this, we have to deal with the threats of dragons, spirits, and The Horrors.

Just knowing that much and accepting that it's not right is enough to be a runner in the Shadows.
Stahlseele
Van, a Troll like a . . . "Why i'm running? so the Elf does not get too close!"
sorry, i had to, seeing as how nobody else made the joke yet *g*
Tabula Rasa
The reasons for my runners vary but I admit my favorite is the need for more money/power/prestige. I know a lot of people seem to gripe about why a runner would keep runnig after being able to afford a permanent high or luxury lifestyle, but I think that's a very silly question.

Plenty of the rich, powerful and criminal keep trying to accumulate money well past where they and their family would be comfortable till the end of their existence. Hell, some freakishly rich people with legitimate money will commit criminal acts at the risk of everything they have so they can get more and one up their associates (see Tyco, WorldCom, Enron, etc...).
Mickle5125
reasons vary amongst my runners.

Mars, my troll with MPD, runs because he has nothing else. Yeah, he could stick with just being a bouncer at Venus's bar, but that would leave him restless and makes it more likely that one of his more violently inclined personalities would take over while at the bar and that, my friends, would be a Very Bad Thing.

Cami, on the other hand, runs for more. More power, more money, more freedom. More excitement. She's one of those runners who, given the chance to buy luxury lifestyle forever and retire from running, would decide that it wasn't worth settling. She'll be running until the day she gets in over her head and can't talk her way out of the mess.
Stahlseele
usually, they just run because they are on the run from something
Synner667
QUOTE (Tabula Rasa @ Apr 28 2008, 09:54 PM) *
The reasons for my runners vary but I admit my favorite is the need for more money/power/prestige. I know a lot of people seem to gripe about why a runner would keep runnig after being able to afford a permanent high or luxury lifestyle, but I think that's a very silly question.

Plenty of the rich, powerful and criminal keep trying to accumulate money well past where they and their family would be comfortable till the end of their existence. Hell, some freakishly rich people with legitimate money will commit criminal acts at the risk of everything they have so they can get more and one up their associates (see Tyco, WorldCom, Enron, etc...).


Not "silly" at all, if you actually live in the real world.

Rich, powerful criminal don't run around shooting people, stealing things and risking life'n'limb...
...Their position, influence, wealth means they hire people to do those things.

People who have a luxury lifestyle, and continue, weren't doing it for the money, power or influence..
..Because running around and getting shot at isn't part of any of those things.


As for your example of Tyce, WorldCom, Enron...
..,They don't involve people having mucho money, mucho influence or mucho power and going out and doing armed robbery [unless your version of those events is very different from that reported in the press ??], so are actually very bad examples.
Keita Haruka
Chava, my 19 year old elf joyboi (that's his "dayjob"), runs because he doesn't know anything else. He's still very much stuck in "survival" mode and literally hasn't realised yet that there's more to life that taking it day by day. He has a LOT of growing up to do. Taking the step from being merely a toy to a 'runner is his first step in that direction...if he doesn't get himself killed in the process.

Mind you, he may be a 400BP character, but I didn't make him for gaming purposes...or at least...not expressely for that purpose. He's more intended as an experiment in fiction.
fool
so you can play the game.
Fortune
Because the game is called Shadowrun, not Shadowretire. wink.gif
CanRay
QUOTE (fool @ Apr 28 2008, 06:19 PM) *
so you can play the game.

That's why *WE* made Shadowrunner Characters...

I asked about the Character's reasons...
Siege
Because normal is not the word my therapist uses to describe me.

Because shadowrunning is as much a lifestyle and an ideology as it is a career choice.

I liken it to the 60's - a lot of people dabbled and enjoyed the moment, but a select few embraced the lifestyle as a way of life and made it work.

Security contracting in Iraq is dangerous work - but the money pays well enough to lure ex-police and ex-military. Between the pay, adrenaline and select job skills - it appeals to a very select cliente
Tabula Rasa
QUOTE (Synner667 @ Apr 28 2008, 04:25 PM) *
Not "silly" at all, if you actually live in the real world.

Rich, powerful criminal don't run around shooting people, stealing things and risking life'n'limb...
...Their position, influence, wealth means they hire people to do those things.

People who have a luxury lifestyle, and continue, weren't doing it for the money, power or influence..
..Because running around and getting shot at isn't part of any of those things.


As for your example of Tyce, WorldCom, Enron...
..,They don't involve people having mucho money, mucho influence or mucho power and going out and doing armed robbery [unless your version of those events is very different from that reported in the press ??], so are actually very bad examples.


Except I'm not talking about the real world. I'm just showing examples of real life mentality where it's never enough and you can always use a little more at any risk. In a world where running around shooting people in the face is an "acceptable" criminal activity with it's own support system and small microindustry supporting its needs I'm sure there would be plenty of them who would keep doing it to get that last thing they wanted. You know, it was that badass ¥300k supercar last month but now you are gonna get your ¥1.2m yacht and you'll finally quit... yeah right...

All I'm trying to illustrate is that for many of this criminal class, it'll never be enough, so greed can serve as a perfectly valid motivation for even a very long campaign.
CanRay
Tony Montana: "Me, I want what's coming to me."
Manny: "Oh, well what's coming to you?"
Tony Montana: "The world, chico, and everything in it."
- Scarface
Nigel
My Social Adept/Driver runs because nothing else allows him to manipulate people and fix situations to the degree that he does. Also, he has a mercenary personality, and this is the highest pay he can get for doing his hobby.
Cantankerous
Why do I run? Look at me. I'm 9'2" tall and look like something from a dystopian nightmare. Children, especially human children sometimes STILL look scared when I walk in to the Stuffer Shack they're in and get in to line behind them. I hold two doctoral degrees and yet I could never really be content in the society I spent my entire youth preparing myself for. I feel out of place in my own skin... so how the hell does a guy like me fit anywhere but square peg in a round hole world of the Shadowrunner?

I look around at the world and ask myself if anything else I could do would make a tenth as much of a difference to ME as what I am doing now. I'm not naive enough to think I'm changing the world, or even Seattle, or even my part of Puyallup in to a better place for everyone... but it sure as hell is better for my presence for me and a few people like me who want to pretend we still live free.

Why do I run? Because I'm afraid not to run.


BB
Serial_Peacemaker
Well, you run because once you have hunted armed meta-humans everything else pales in comparison?
Fuchs
QUOTE (kanislatrans @ Apr 28 2008, 05:21 PM) *
Hugh,my mage , hit the shadows because he is looking for someone.

She's human, about 5' 7" tall and athletic. Auburn hair and flashing Green eyes. last seen wearing a red Pleather jump suit and holding a predator IV to a corp cops head. He thinks her street name is Muse. It was love at first sight.

So tell me, was he crazy to throw away a cushy corp career to chase an angel from the streets who probably doesn't even know he exists? Yeah, but in a world with so little happiness, even the glimmer of hope is enough to make people do crazy drek.

Keep lookin', Omae, Keep lookin'. smile.gif smile.gif


That's great!
Screamin Demon
Know, oh Prince, that between the years when the oceans drank Atlantis and the gleaming cities, and the years of the rise of the sons of Aryas, there was an age undreamed of. When cities lay spread across the world like jeweled mantles beneath the stars- Tokyo, England, Atlanta, Denver, Chicago with it's ruined streets and towers of spider haunted mystery, Salish-Shidhe with it's eco-minded counsel, California Free State that bordered on the pastoral lands of Tir Tairngire, Aztlan with it'd blood-spirit guarded temples. U.C.A.S. who's soldiers wear cybernetics, and bioware, and plasteel armor. But the proudest metroplex was Seattle, reigning supreme in the dreaming west...

Let me tell you a story of high adventure!
*Que Music*

I imagine shadowrunning is the natural profession to the talented but chaotic individuals who chafe the bridle of lawful megacorporate oppression. "You try telling Coyote he only gets a half hour for lunch."
Criminals who cannot use their impressive skills elsewhere because of black marks on their SINs, readily apparent in this new informative world. People with illicit obligations they must fulfill on pain of death. All those talented but misunderstood people who slip through society's cracks... Those who have the means but no legal way of doing what they were born to do will always make themselves a way. These people have gathered together in the undercroft of society to form the caste of anonymous mercenaries for hire.
...
...
Yeah!
Rotbart van Dainig
QUOTE (Ed_209a @ Apr 28 2008, 03:32 PM) *
I think every 400+ BP character who would be more of an asset than a liability will be courted by some corp or agency.

Well, real-world outsourcing proved you wrong. nyahnyah.gif

Of course, any real corporate man is around 600 BP, see the grunts.
Leofski
QUOTE (Ed_209a @ Apr 28 2008, 03:32 PM) *
...Because he can't do anything else.

400BP characters don't grow on trees. They are highly trained, with extremely special abilities. I describe shadowrunners to new players as the Navy SEALs of the criminal world.

Shadowrunners stay shadowrunners because the can't or won't be hired by a corp or government agencies. I think every 400+ BP character who would be more of an asset than a liability will be courted by some corp or agency. That level of talent is just too rare not to. Something similar is happening today with special forces personnel being recruited by various companies, typically private security contractors.

This would be especially true of mages. You can spend 250k on implants, 250k on training, and make anybody a street sam. You can't buy a magic rating. Corp recruiters would overlook a LOT to get a new mage into the fold.

EDIT: To clarify, unless there are legal/personal reasons, corp/gov employment is VERY tempting. More pay overall for less risk. What's not to like?


You forget the demand side of the model. Sure there are clear gains for the corps for hiring the best and brightest to work in r n' d et al, but they also benefit from the existence of competent external deniable assets, because their existence allows corps to act in ways that would not otherwise be possible. There is nothing provably linking the corp to the runners once the cash has been split and run through a dozen dummy fronts and the shadowrunners ideally don't know who they're working for and don't generally keep good paperwork. There are no records of most shadow work linking them to jobs or paymasters and even the common use aliases used by recruiters for shadow work point towards a level of unofficial collusion.

Corps want to cherry pick the most talented and the most loyal, then hope to leave some good people in the shadows because, despite the potential reversals, they still consider it worthwhile to have the external benefits provided by the shadows to be worth the opportunity cost of the gains from employing them directly because, done right by competent operational command and Johnsons, it is completely anonymous for quite some time, while even corp black ops can be tracked back.
Phantastik
Go commit a crime of "moral turpitude", like theft or a couple of counts of shoplifting, and then try getting a decent job...

Examples of Things You Will Never Have if you have a criminal record: law license, real estate license, teaching certification, financial planner certification, CPA license, stockbroker license. You will never get a government job, or a job in law enforcement. Options are limited... of course, there's always flipping burgers. Right?

So what do you do if you have skills and ambition, but no one will hire you because of your background? Well, you might start a company, but then clients who check your background might not do business with you. So... that's when it's time to visit the shadows.

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