According to the Genetech chapter of Augmentation, you can have your entire genetic structure altered how you see fit, for a cost (& Essence).

With the RAW, you can remove Allergy qualities via Transgenic therapy, at the cost of Essence. However, there are no rules for adding a quality normally available at Character Generation, such as Type-O System or Biocompatability.

As this should be possible with how genetics work, I am asking for suggestions on rules to do so. Obviously Awakened qualities would be unavailable this way, as although it is believed they are genetic, it is still unknown what DNA sequence is repsonsible.

For reference, Allergen Removal has a Nuyen cost of (BP Value) x 5,000 & 0.1 Essence.

I don't think genetic technology is at the point where they can genetically enhance luck, unlock magical capacity, teach you martial arts, or get a mentor spirit to take interest you.

If you wanted to house rule it you could go through the qualities and determine which could be fostered by genetic enhancement, but I think the game balance upset wouldn't be worth it. Type O is huge, and the sacrifice of not being able to buy any other qualities is part of the price of it's awesomness. Making it accessible after chargen for a hundred thousand nuyen would make it commonplace and cliche like what happened with diamond coating.

My intent is not to allow genetic augmentation to give a character Learned qualities, but Innate qualities. The character creation Build Point limits for these qualities is for balance, true, which is why they would cost Essence if obtained through augmentation, so as to maintain that balance.

A quick list of qualities that would normally be character generation only, but available through genetics are as follows (there are a few more available through genetics or cosmetics, but not *normal* advancement):

• Natural Hardening
• Photographic Memory
• Natural Immunity (already reflected with Genetic Immunization)
• Quick Healer
• Biocompatability
• Type O System

Now, if we, for example, decided that the cost for such a treatment would be (BP Cost / 5) x 0.1 Essence & (BP Cost) x 5,000 Nuyen, this may be doable while still maintaining game balance. Sure, being able to take Type O System after character creation is powerful, but is it really worth using up 0.6 Essence for a reduced cost on your bioware? For some characters, yes, and they would shell out the 150,000 for it. For others, not really.

Also, I already said that, for reasons presented in the Augmentation fluff, Awakened qualities & Technomancer should not be available this way. And I never mentioned using it to increase attributes, special or otherwise. Those are to be increased with Karma normally, and are not a genetic feature anyways - maximum potential for Physical & Mental attributes is, but not their actual level.

Note there are also a few negative qualities that normally could not be removed, but would be able to with genetics, such as Sensitive System - for the negative qualities, I would rule a fixed 0.1 Essence cost, but you also must pay Karma as normal to buy off the quality.

Hmm, are you saying there is still a cap on qualities after char creation? Ie, that you cant buy new qualities after creation, if you sunk 35 bp into qualities during creation?

So, if I bought Type O, I could never spend karma on qualities?

By a strict reading of the rules it says "Characters may not spend more than 35 BP's on qualities." Following the strictest version, that would mean that you could spend as much karma on qualities as you want...as long as the GM lets you.

You should also conscider adding bioware like bone density and muscle augmentations as genetic enhancements, or soft/hard nanite systems.

as long as the GM lets you,. you can start as a dragon cyborg with the body of an aircraft carrier and using t-birds as drones . .
but you're about as much Canon/RAW as you would be with more Qualities than the 35 Points worth *g*

and i'll give you the point of bone density and muscle stuff, but not nano systems . .
maybe something similar, like poisonous blood O.o

The rules are vague when it comes to allowing purchase of qualities with Karma. It says how it can be done, but it states specifically (IIRC) that you must have the GM's approval.

you need the GM's approval for EVERYTHING so who cares?
the GM could rule that your character with 8 attributes with 8 1's in them and 8 skill-groups with 8 1's in them is not allowed allthough that character is so below the rules that it could be a canon NPC . .

You're nitpicking, Stahly. I was quoting book text. Of course the GM can overrule the book, but in a tournament the official rules bind the GM, thus giving us a baseline to work with. Stop being a twerp.

First, I never stated there was a limit on how many qualities you could obtain after character generation. I only said there was a limit on what qualities can be obtained after character generation, and that is what this thread is about.

Most qualities are a learned trait, and so can be purchased with Karma normally. Some qualities, however, are genetic - things you are born with and cannot later learn. Some of these, such as Blandness, can be obtained through cosmetic augmentation. Others, such as Type O System, would require genetic modifications to obtain, which Augmentation says is possible, but does not provide rules for. Determining a suitable set of rules for it is the purpose of this thread.

Nah nah nah, I am objecting to genetically fostering qualities that are not quantifiable on the genetic level. I suppose with the drastic nuyen and essence costs Type-O and perhaps a few others could be done, but I believe it would take a very long time and repeated visits for long, possibly painful procedures to shift your bodies bio-compatibility to the desired state. But I don't think that by 2070 they will have understanding of the human genome enough to genetically foster the 'Guts' quality.

Buy whatever you like buy with Karma. Karma's limitations are fully outlined in the books what you can and can't purchase.

I like your formulas, Muspellsheimr, they look good. Just tack on there long excruciating procedures that might require good old edge tests to 'take hold' without further inforcement. Make em pay till they make the roll or something. It should be a rough deal getting the big'uns like Type-O.

okay, okay ._.
party-pooper <.<
ok, i will give you the part about OFFICIAL RULES in a TOURNAMENT *grins*