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The Jopp
Straightforward question:

Can a Pixie have Type-O quality and how would it affect implants? Since it say they must have Delta Grade Implants.

Considering the cost of Delta Grade Bioware 30 points seems useful.
Fortune
If I recall correctly, the Type-O Quality only affects the basic Grade of implants, and has no effect on Alpha, Beta or Deltaware.
The Jopp
QUOTE (Fortune @ Oct 27 2008, 09:48 AM) *
If I recall correctly, the Type-O Quality only affects the basic Grade of implants, and has no effect on Alpha, Beta or Deltaware.


Yes, but since Pixies and other such beings need Delta Grade in order to be able to have them Type-O essentially makes basic grade bioware into delta grade.

The only expensive ware will be the Cultured Bioware that isn't compatible with Type-O and basic Bioware already counts as Delta Grade with Type-O.
Fortune
Basic Bioware counts as Delta Grade with Type-O because type-O people can better utilize off-the-rack stuff. The thing about Pixies though, is that everything has to be custom-made for them anyway, as there isn't too much off-the-rack ware for them available.
The Jopp
Good point.

There are however some pointers regarding Bioware.

Since bioware must be grown regardless would the actual procedure be that different? Cultured bioware shouldn't have to be Delta Grade as they already require the persons DNA/Cells. There are already companies in SSR (allright, cutting edge but still...) that can introduce bioware into animals an the step between animals vs human and human vs pixie are rather different.

Shouldn't Cultured Bioware count as just that for anyone - something that uses the users own DNA to make a matching implant. The basics in how to grow them should be the same.

I have a problem with the so called game balance that i can create pixie adept that have increased initiative for far less cost BP wise than the fact that I have to pay 800K for ONE level of Synaptic Booster since it have to be Delta Grade.

Sure, there are optional rules for it and they seem appropriate but they doesn't really cut it at some levels.

I also assume that the cost for the optional rule regarding bioware would still have their full price.

Rotbart van Dainig
Personally, I don't think non-metahumans get anything out of Type O - Owen was human.
hyzmarca
QUOTE (The Jopp @ Oct 27 2008, 05:49 AM) *
Good point.

There are however some pointers regarding Bioware.

Since bioware must be grown regardless would the actual procedure be that different? Cultured bioware shouldn't have to be Delta Grade as they already require the persons DNA/Cells. There are already companies in SSR (allright, cutting edge but still...) that can introduce bioware into animals an the step between animals vs human and human vs pixie are rather different.

Shouldn't Cultured Bioware count as just that for anyone - something that uses the users own DNA to make a matching implant. The basics in how to grow them should be the same.

I have a problem with the so called game balance that i can create pixie adept that have increased initiative for far less cost BP wise than the fact that I have to pay 800K for ONE level of Synaptic Booster since it have to be Delta Grade.

Sure, there are optional rules for it and they seem appropriate but they doesn't really cut it at some levels.

I also assume that the cost for the optional rule regarding bioware would still have their full price.


The key difference between cultured and Delta bioware is simple. Cultured uses your cells as the basis for the bioware, but adds patented DNA, proteins, and other things as part of a standardized process to grow the 'ware. They probably use a standardized scaffold, as well.
With Delta, on the other hand, everything is custom made. The bioware's altered DNA is designed from the ground up to be the most compatible with you as is possible, the same is true of proteins, chemicals, and any other thing that goes into creating the bioware. Even the scafold that the organ is grown upon is custom made to best fit your body, ideally. (Though, you wouldn't get this with Type O so it isn't necessary).

The big problem with Type-O Pixies is a simple one, however. You can't install an organ if it's bigger than your torso. An off-the-shelf Human, Elf, Ork, Troll, or Dwarf organ, simply won't fit in the Pixie's body.


What the frag is that on your chest man?
Oh, that's just my new synthcardium
Isn't your heart supposed to be inside your chest?
They didn't have anything that would fit me, but they said that it wouldn't be a problem for them to leave it out, they just had to extend a few blood vessels and stick them through my skin. It works great, I just can't sleep on my front anymore.
The Jopp
Well, yes, for lots of the organ addition/replacement ware that is rather obvious but what about "nerve" ware? A good example is the Synaptic Booster:

QUOTE
Synaptic Booster: With this bioware, the nerve cells
making up the spinal cord are encouraged to replicate and
lengthen, providing a wider ‚Äúdatapath‚Ä? for the transmission
of impulses and decreasing the amount of time required for
the signal to traverse the distance.


Following the above description they add "something" to the character that improves cellular growth, and I would imagine that we are not talking about a specific length but rather as a percental increase.

So, WHY would such ware be more invasive and harder to use. I cannot imagine that they are THAT different in DNA even though they are not metahumans per se. Or as I would see it, not PROVEN metahumans...
Tarantula
I'd say it works, except for the aforementioned size issues.
Neraph
It works even better if you use the optional "Chrome Critters" sidebar rules.
Bobson
QUOTE (Fortune @ Oct 27 2008, 04:29 AM) *
Basic Bioware counts as Delta Grade with Type-O because type-O people can better utilize off-the-rack stuff. The thing about Pixies though, is that everything has to be custom-made for them anyway, as there isn't too much off-the-rack ware for them available.


As I understand it, Type-O doesn't change anything about the 'ware, either the way it's created/grown or the way it's implanted. All it does is reduce the essence loss because the replacement parts are "less different" from your body than normal, so you're "more intact" afterwards. To use an inanely simplified analogy: If you add a red circle to a blue box, it stands out really well. If you add a red circle to a purple box, it blends in much better. === vs. ===.
Fortune
While that is basically true, by canon the Type-O Quality still does nothing for people getting non-Basic Grade implants.
Tarantula
Aug, 20, "Off the rack, basic bioware is considered delta grade for purposes of interacting with a type O body (i.e., reduce Essence Costs by half, though nuyen prices remain the same)."
From that text, I'd say type-o pixies could utilize basic bioware with no problem at all, as basic bioware is treated as delta for them. Fortune is right, it would not help for cultured ware.
Platinum Dragon
It is reasonable, however, to house-rule that critters that require delta-grade can make use of cultured bioware, considering that it's custom-made every time.
Tarantula
QUOTE (Platinum Dragon @ Oct 28 2008, 05:56 PM) *
It is reasonable, however, to house-rule that critters that require delta-grade can make use of cultured bioware, considering that it's custom-made every time.


Custom, yes, quality? No. Delta-cultured represents the extra care taken to make sure there are no abnormalities in the thing to make it mesh with you as nicely as possible.
Fortune
Because I probably couldn't put it any better myself, I'll quote from hyzmarca's earlier post ...

QUOTE (hyzmarca)
The key difference between cultured and Delta bioware is simple. Cultured uses your cells as the basis for the bioware, but adds patented DNA, proteins, and other things as part of a standardized process to grow the 'ware. They probably use a standardized scaffold, as well.

With Delta, on the other hand, everything is custom made. The bioware's altered DNA is designed from the ground up to be the most compatible with you as is possible, the same is true of proteins, chemicals, and any other thing that goes into creating the bioware. Even the scafold that the organ is grown upon is custom made to best fit your body, ideally. (Though, you wouldn't get this with Type O so it isn't necessary).
Platinum Dragon
Considering it's basically sci-fantasy, I'm not going to argue the finer points of augmentation.

I stand by my comment that it's a reasonable house-rule, albeit not a necessary one.
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