I had an idea for some metamagic that an NPC bad guy was going to have, which was sort of improved Channeling, allowing the bad guy to bind a spirit (its quite a hermetic idea, so probably an elemental) into a homonclus similar to an Ally spirit, but only for the year and a day that an elemental can usually be bound. The advantage being, of course, that you don't have to spend god knows how much karma for it. The spirit doesn't have any powers beyond the normal and unless its an earth elemental is also unlikely to keep its Engulf power so its not like there are any mental links or sorcery abilities to worry about. The mage would have to spend karma to bind the spirit AND to enchant the homonclus, as well, keeping the numbers to a reasonable level, not to mention the spirit counting toward the mages' total. I hadn't worked out the details yet. The idea was for the old 'statues in the corridor coming to life' trick with some magic effects thrown in for scare value.

Anyway, when I came up with it I also began to worry about the players. This is an ability they would no doubt love to get their mits on, and I'd equally rather not let them. The mage who was using it was going to be using it to defend his evil twisted den of vileness, not break into compounds and steal stuff, you know what I mean? It could be dealt with if they started abusing it, but I'd rather not have to. Its supposed to be a cool thing to encounter, not a magic-shop-u-like. I already plan on letting them inhereit the guy's foci for heavens' sake! Now, I'm not bothered if one of them has a good assensing roll, and figures out what the guy has done, and uses it for inspiration to design their own ability. I'll let players do that from time to time anyway, but it takes a helluva lot of investment from the character in terms of time, so I can live with it - they may die before they ever complete the work, and may not make the rolls I deem necessary to design it.

However, I found myself wondering if a good enough mind probe looking for information on that one specific thing might not turn up enough to qualify as a teacher for the learning of a new technique as part of initiation?

So, learned colleagues, I ask you this -

1, is the metamagic technique reasonably feasible in terms of what it does and how it works - and I'm happy to accept suggestions as to how the rolls might be worked out, as I've only thought about the vaguest details so far, and;

2, could a mind probe, used on an unconscious or willing subject, be used to gather enough information to justify the learning of a new metamagical technique at next inititaion?

Thoughts appreciated.

1. Sounds fine to me, but I thought elementals could only be bound for (Force)day.

2. I don't think so. Mind Probe isn't the be all end all of information gathering. Something that has to be remember when you read someones mind is that the information isn't run through the filtering and logic that it's run through before a coherent thought is spoken. It all symbolic and internal references. So while you can piece together a lot of information from a mind probe something as complex and exacting as a metamagic technique I think is beyond it.

Now I look, I can't find any duration for it, under either spirit services in the rule book or astral security in MITS. Remote service just says until the task is complete. I could've sworn I'd read a year and a day somewhere. Maybe SR2. H'mm. Can anyone find a page reference? That's rather a crucial part of this!

Went and looked it up, and I'm wrong. Every day that an elemental spends on the astral or physical plane uses a service (SR3 pg.186), but this metamagic could deal with that. You make the spirit more vulnerable to physical attack and in turn get to keep it for say a week per service. I know I'd opt for that instead of 100,000 a year I'm spending to keep a Force 2 elemental around.

I've heard the year and a day thing too in reference to SR spirits but I think its an ED thing....(for the talking I do about ED I should just buy the books)

Since youre already using some GM license (as you should) I don't see why you could all this to your house rules. It is your game and the idea doesn't seem "broken" or particulary unbalancing. Especially since you plan on using it for NPCs. They get to do all kinds of wacky drek. Make it real interesting: make him Corrupt or Toxic.

Mu-hahahahahah-ha!

Heyas, de-lurking... first post and all... went to look for that year and a day thing because I knew I had read it too. Found it:

MitS, p. 98

Binding Elemental Guards
As described under Astral Security (p. 88), a mage can bind an elemental to permanently patrol and guard a site by paying Good Karma equal to its Force. Once bound in this manner, the elemental no longer counts against the mage's Charisma limit for bound elementals. It will guard its site for one year and one day, until banished or killed in astral combat. Disrupted guard elementals will return to their guard post in 28 days minus their Force.

Cool! That also solves an arguement I had with one of my players. Thanks.

An elemental can be bound to guard a location for a year and a day, in exchange for (force) Karma.

Thanks for the feedback. I'm gonna keep it adding to the mages charisma total though, unlike normal sentinels. means once they've fought their way past the guards, the mage will only have himself and any other allies he may have got himself instead of having a full load of elementals as well. Unless the players walk the first encounter and I need to tweak upwards, anyway. Once I've playtested it, I'll do some proper rules for it and post them in case anyone is interested.