In an up-coming game I plan on creating an adept gun-fu type character that focuses on longarms and automatics (rifles ideally, but might go with SMG's)
So far I've come up with the following...
Human Adept
Bod 3
Agi 5
Rea 4
Str 3
Cha 2
Int 4
Log 4
Wil 3
Edge 1
Mag 5
Stealth Group 4
Forgery 4
Perception 4
Locksmith 3
Armorer (Firearms) 3
Automatics 5
Longarms 5
Dodge (Or Gymnastics?) 4
Adept Powers
Improved Reflexes 1
Facial Sculpt 1
Nimble Fingers
Traceless Walk
Wall Running
Enhanced Perception 2
Went with Invisible Way and uninitiated
No Cyber/bio
And for starter weapons assuming GM approval
Colt M22A3 w/ Ceramic components 1, personalized grip and internal laser sight for assault rifle focus.
Cobra TZ-110 with an additional top mounted laser sight and personalized grip for SMG focus
Ares Desert Strike w/ Manual breakdown, sound suppressor, personalized grip and ceramic components 1 for long arms
Ultimately what I'm least sure about, are the adept powers ... or whether some bio/cyber would be worth the sacrifice in magic capacity?
Full Version: Could use some build advice
there was a topic where someone built one of those with 4 arms and had a not too shaby pool to shoot each of his 4 SMG's in long burst i think . .
i can't search those boards worth drek, but you might have more luck . .
also: you're on the right board for this sort of thing . . if you don't tell people where to stop, you will have in two days a built with a dice-pool of 50 for the preferred weapon ^^
i can't search those boards worth drek, but you might have more luck . .
also: you're on the right board for this sort of thing . . if you don't tell people where to stop, you will have in two days a built with a dice-pool of 50 for the preferred weapon ^^
Good point about the dicepools... I'm not looking to have an ungodly sniper that can send a 7.62 round through a quarter at seven miles range, low-mid teens dicepool would be a good target to shoot for at present without pigeonholing myself too much.... I'd like to be able to utilize the few support skills i took as well.
Bioware is the more expensive option, but gives you a lot of bang for your buck. If you got synaptic booster: 1, muscle toner: 2 [alpha], and a reflex recorder for the firearms group [alpha], you would only lose one magic point, and in exchange would get the equivalent of your improved reflexes: 1, as well as +2 to Agility and a further +1 to both of your ranged skills.
Cyberware is cheaper, but cybereyes would be tempting, to get all of those visual mods, in addition to not having to rely on glasses or contacts for a smartlink. And an ultrasound or radar sensor would be good, both for getting past security (ultrasound in passive mode detects ultrasound, and radar sensor can see through walls), and for seeing invisible objects.
Specializations may be pricey compared to their cost after character creation, but they remain a relatively cheap way to get +2 dice for a commonly-used skill (SMGs and sniper rifles would be two good specializations for you).
For shooting, it is actually good to have a dice pool of 16+ if you can. Ranged combat has a lot of potential penalties, then the target gets to dodge, then the target gets to soak the damage. 16 dice in most things would be overkill, but for combat skills, it is just enough to be effective - most of the time.
Getting away from the combat side for a second, be sure to get a rating: 6 autopicker. It's pretty cheap for something that gives you 6 more dice for picking locks!
If you need to lose a point of Magic, I would say get rid of wall running. Traceless walk is expensive, too, but it gives you some useful stealth-related abilities. Wall running - well, you don't have running, so the power isn't that useful to you. I mean, you're defaulting to Strength - 1, which is all of 2 dice. It might be worth picking up later, when you pump up your Strength and/or get the running skill.
Dodge or gymnastics, hmm. Both are equally good for dodging ranged attacks, but dodge is much, much better at dodging melee attacks. On the one hand, gymnastics has other uses and is a very useful skill for an infiltration type. On the other hand, you don't have any close combat skills at all, so if you don't get dodge, you will be completely screwed if you get attacked at close range. Close call, but I would say get dodge. Reason? You really need it or you will be very vulnerable, and gymnastics can be gotten later - as part of the athletics skill group, which I would recommend that you pick up as one of your first things when you get a bit of Karma.
Cyberware is cheaper, but cybereyes would be tempting, to get all of those visual mods, in addition to not having to rely on glasses or contacts for a smartlink. And an ultrasound or radar sensor would be good, both for getting past security (ultrasound in passive mode detects ultrasound, and radar sensor can see through walls), and for seeing invisible objects.
Specializations may be pricey compared to their cost after character creation, but they remain a relatively cheap way to get +2 dice for a commonly-used skill (SMGs and sniper rifles would be two good specializations for you).
For shooting, it is actually good to have a dice pool of 16+ if you can. Ranged combat has a lot of potential penalties, then the target gets to dodge, then the target gets to soak the damage. 16 dice in most things would be overkill, but for combat skills, it is just enough to be effective - most of the time.
Getting away from the combat side for a second, be sure to get a rating: 6 autopicker. It's pretty cheap for something that gives you 6 more dice for picking locks!
If you need to lose a point of Magic, I would say get rid of wall running. Traceless walk is expensive, too, but it gives you some useful stealth-related abilities. Wall running - well, you don't have running, so the power isn't that useful to you. I mean, you're defaulting to Strength - 1, which is all of 2 dice. It might be worth picking up later, when you pump up your Strength and/or get the running skill.
Dodge or gymnastics, hmm. Both are equally good for dodging ranged attacks, but dodge is much, much better at dodging melee attacks. On the one hand, gymnastics has other uses and is a very useful skill for an infiltration type. On the other hand, you don't have any close combat skills at all, so if you don't get dodge, you will be completely screwed if you get attacked at close range. Close call, but I would say get dodge. Reason? You really need it or you will be very vulnerable, and gymnastics can be gotten later - as part of the athletics skill group, which I would recommend that you pick up as one of your first things when you get a bit of Karma.
I'd be scared constantly playing a character with only 1 Edge, but that may just be my bad luck. Still, it means if the drek hits the fan, it will hit it, no rerolls allowed.
For a combat char I'm always fond of taking the complete firearms skill group. Small pistols are a lot more subtle and easier to hide than SMGs, even. It'll cost you one die, but costs the same BP-wise.
Traceless walk and wall running are really stylish powers, but they are absurdly overpriced. An adept has to pay multiple power points to mimic a simple levitation spell. It would actually be cheaper to go mystic just for that spell than to take the powers. Sad, really...
The way the system is set up, sacrificing a point of magic for cyber/bio is always worth it, as some stuff is a lot cheaper to get the mundane way. The only reason not to is a clash with your character concept, basically.
Facial sculpt is nice, but while disguising as someone to look like him is part of stealth, putting up a believeable show of actually being that person is con and your social skills are... lacking. Thus, you'd only be able to use the power to hide your real face, which throws away half the use of the power and could be gotten with a skying mask on the run or a latex face mask off the run.
Those are the first points that came to my mind while looking over the char, may have time later for a more indepth look.
For a combat char I'm always fond of taking the complete firearms skill group. Small pistols are a lot more subtle and easier to hide than SMGs, even. It'll cost you one die, but costs the same BP-wise.
Traceless walk and wall running are really stylish powers, but they are absurdly overpriced. An adept has to pay multiple power points to mimic a simple levitation spell. It would actually be cheaper to go mystic just for that spell than to take the powers. Sad, really...
The way the system is set up, sacrificing a point of magic for cyber/bio is always worth it, as some stuff is a lot cheaper to get the mundane way. The only reason not to is a clash with your character concept, basically.
Facial sculpt is nice, but while disguising as someone to look like him is part of stealth, putting up a believeable show of actually being that person is con and your social skills are... lacking. Thus, you'd only be able to use the power to hide your real face, which throws away half the use of the power and could be gotten with a skying mask on the run or a latex face mask off the run.
Those are the first points that came to my mind while looking over the char, may have time later for a more indepth look.
QUOTE (Dragnar @ Dec 19 2008, 10:50 PM) 
I'd be scared constantly playing a character with only 1 Edge, but that may just be my bad luck. Still, it means if the drek hits the fan, it will hit it, no rerolls allowed.
I was going to bring this up, but totally forgot about it until Dragnar mentioned it. Humans start out with Edge of 2.
Yes, my mistake.. that meant that I was putting a point into edge above the human norm...
I would drop the Improved reflexes and grab a rating 2 synaptic booster. The magic will be lost due to essence, but you get an extra point of reaction and an extra initiative pass... on the down side its gonna cost you 160k or or 32 BP of cash.
First question: Gun-Fu or Invisible Way?
Skills
Stealth Group 4
Forgery 4
Locksmith 3
Perception 4
-> The invisible way adept should have some social skills and at least the Hardware skill. Try to find the points for a solid athletics group, mobility can be the key to successful intrusion.
Armorer (Firearms) 3
Automatics 5
Longarms 5
Dodge (Or Gymnastics?) 4
-> Consider Firearms 4. One die less, but you get to use pistols with a decent pool.
Adept Powers
Improved Reflexes 1
Facial Sculpt 1
Nimble Fingers
Traceless Walk
Wall Running
Enhanced Perception 2
Went with Invisible Way and uninitiated
-> What do you loose (for the invisible way) if you restrict yourself to Facial Sculpt 1 and Traceless Walk?
Skills
Stealth Group 4
Forgery 4
Locksmith 3
Perception 4
-> The invisible way adept should have some social skills and at least the Hardware skill. Try to find the points for a solid athletics group, mobility can be the key to successful intrusion.
Armorer (Firearms) 3
Automatics 5
Longarms 5
Dodge (Or Gymnastics?) 4
-> Consider Firearms 4. One die less, but you get to use pistols with a decent pool.
Adept Powers
Improved Reflexes 1
Facial Sculpt 1
Nimble Fingers
Traceless Walk
Wall Running
Enhanced Perception 2
Went with Invisible Way and uninitiated
-> What do you loose (for the invisible way) if you restrict yourself to Facial Sculpt 1 and Traceless Walk?
The biggest strength of the adept is the Improved Skill power. Invest in that at least a little, it's relatively cheap and highly effective.
Adepts can be good at two things, but it's easier for them to specialize. Do you want Invisible Way or Gun-Fu? You'd be better off picking one, and staying with it. If you want an Invisible Way sniper, then I'd drop automatics by one, raise Longarms, and then specialize. You'll be throwing 15 dice for sniping, while keeping a good dice pool in automatics. Add in some Improved Ability, both in Longarms and in Infiltration, and you'll make an excellent sniper. Your remaining combat skills will be adequate, but your sniping will be solid.
Oh, and the gymnastics vs dodge? If you have no melee skills, dodge is generally the better choice. However, technically Gymnastics with a specialization in Dodging is legal. If you intend to use full defense against melee a lot, though, Dodge is still better.
Adepts can be good at two things, but it's easier for them to specialize. Do you want Invisible Way or Gun-Fu? You'd be better off picking one, and staying with it. If you want an Invisible Way sniper, then I'd drop automatics by one, raise Longarms, and then specialize. You'll be throwing 15 dice for sniping, while keeping a good dice pool in automatics. Add in some Improved Ability, both in Longarms and in Infiltration, and you'll make an excellent sniper. Your remaining combat skills will be adequate, but your sniping will be solid.
Oh, and the gymnastics vs dodge? If you have no melee skills, dodge is generally the better choice. However, technically Gymnastics with a specialization in Dodging is legal. If you intend to use full defense against melee a lot, though, Dodge is still better.
This is just me, but I wouldn't buy longarms and automatics to 5. I'd just buy the Firearms group to 4 (it's 40BP either way). Then use your adept power improved ability to add more dice to the automatics skill. Spend your first block of karma then to break the skill group (probably upping automatics to 5), then you can specialize all the gun skills individually. Some GM's will let you bust the skill group into individual skills by specializing one right away and not requiring you to raise one first, ask and clear this though. This also frees you up to pick 2 more individual skills to raise to 5 or one to 6.
If you're a gun adept little reason not to be proficient w/ all of them. (especially if you find yourself in a situation where you can't smuggle in something as large or larger as a SMG).
Also I'd put 1 rank into heavy weapons. That way you're not defaulting on things like underbarrel grenade launchers or a LAW when you need it. Do you REALLY want to risk glitching a test when a grenade is involved (or worse critically glitching). You're not a physad. When things like spirits and drones come out you have no choice but to break out the big guns like your local street sam.
In terms of adept powers... since you're not going cyber/bio... extra IP's are good. I'd get 2 extras (you can always spend an edge point for a 4th IP in a round then if it's really necessary... things rarely go past 3 though for most fights). That's 3 points of magic. I'd look at the improved ability power and pick a gun type you really want to specialize in (say automatics), that could gain you an extra 2 dice on that skill for 1 more magic. Facial sculpt is usefull for infiltration and keeping your face off the cameras (as is melanin control), though they can also be duplicated w/ paste and disguise. Nimble fingers is also slightly usefull (for palming things as well as reducing action costs for your gun, though smartgun has most of those benefits as well).
Go with dodge, since you don't have a melee skill. Gymnastics can substitute for dodge in ranged combat, but doesn't really help you in melee much (but not for vehicle dodging during piloting tests). Gymnastics is also easier to boost w/ cyber/bio, but you're not going that route.
Another thing I notice... your min edge on a human is 2, not 1. So you have a little more than you thought you did there. Elves or orcs also tend to make good gun adepts (always amusing when you spend 5BP for the 'human looking' quality on top).
If you're a gun adept little reason not to be proficient w/ all of them. (especially if you find yourself in a situation where you can't smuggle in something as large or larger as a SMG).
Also I'd put 1 rank into heavy weapons. That way you're not defaulting on things like underbarrel grenade launchers or a LAW when you need it. Do you REALLY want to risk glitching a test when a grenade is involved (or worse critically glitching). You're not a physad. When things like spirits and drones come out you have no choice but to break out the big guns like your local street sam.
In terms of adept powers... since you're not going cyber/bio... extra IP's are good. I'd get 2 extras (you can always spend an edge point for a 4th IP in a round then if it's really necessary... things rarely go past 3 though for most fights). That's 3 points of magic. I'd look at the improved ability power and pick a gun type you really want to specialize in (say automatics), that could gain you an extra 2 dice on that skill for 1 more magic. Facial sculpt is usefull for infiltration and keeping your face off the cameras (as is melanin control), though they can also be duplicated w/ paste and disguise. Nimble fingers is also slightly usefull (for palming things as well as reducing action costs for your gun, though smartgun has most of those benefits as well).
Go with dodge, since you don't have a melee skill. Gymnastics can substitute for dodge in ranged combat, but doesn't really help you in melee much (but not for vehicle dodging during piloting tests). Gymnastics is also easier to boost w/ cyber/bio, but you're not going that route.
Another thing I notice... your min edge on a human is 2, not 1. So you have a little more than you thought you did there. Elves or orcs also tend to make good gun adepts (always amusing when you spend 5BP for the 'human looking' quality on top).
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