How many people have effectively used blimps in their campaigns, and how so? I've always thought this hasn't been terribly explored in Shadowrun, but they provide the rules, so somebody's got to have been up to no good with the suckers.

Many moons ago, I wanted to run a group of mercs who used blimps and/or zepps to carry a few light aircraft, as noted in the Shadowtalk of ye olde Rigger's Black Book. However, none of the other players were interested.

Since then, I've only constructed one or two with the Rigger 3 rules for self amusement, and I've never even used them when I GMd. I should do something about that...

I'm also prone to making giant zepps as the playthings of billionaires in other games but, alas, those never enter the storyline either.

I went on a run where the team used a stealthy zeppelin to infiltrate Aztlan airspace, but that's the extent of my experience with them. It was a PBEM game, and the rigger was run by somebody else, so I don't know anything about the vehicle itself.

If you're going to use LTA aircraft, I wouldn't suggest using R3's rules. They're just broken (too weak, too slow, too fragile). If you want some real world examples to go by, use www.worldskycat.com. A proper dirigible can be used as a mobile contruction crane, cargo carrier, emergency vehicle, passenger transport, floating antenna tower, and yes, a rich kid's yacht.

I once toyed around with a SR campaign where LTAs were the status quo for transportation. The balkanization of the North American continent left the interstate highway system and rail lines in varied states of disrepair. Pirates, poli-club militias, swarms of awakened animals, and back-to-nature activists made land-based transportation riskier than ever. The nuking of Chicago was the straw that broke the Iron Horse's back.

Dirigibles were seen as a safer alternative. Their mass production made them almost as cheap to build and maintain as trains. Fuel efficiency made them good economical alternatives to air freight. Their ability to ignore difficult terrain and perform S/VTOL anywhere made them popular with the smuggling trade.

Oh, and don't buy any of that 'but they blow up easy' crap. The Hindy blew up because the material engineers of the time didn't know any better than to apply flamable paint to a flamable fabric and stretch it across a metallic frame acting as a huge lightning rod. Being filled with hydrogen had nothing to do with it [EDIT] bursting into flames [/EDIT], and modern materials are far more durable (nevermind Dikote and Ruthenium ).

I use blimps all the time in my games, both as a GM and a player. I find that they are extremely usefull both in and out of the city. They are small, have a good signature (10 or even higher) and if you give them the SunCell options then you can use them continually! I usually use them for surveillance (put a big screen in the side to play commercial and not only have the perfect cover but make money on the side and a nice way to keep your SIN if you are a rigger!) but if you give them a grenade launcher then you have your very own bomb squadron (hell when used in formation but better leave that for a merc campaign or EVERYBODY will come after you.).They are also drek cheap (only 9000 for a LDSD-23) and you can find them everywhere (availability 2/24 hours). As for the big ones I usually use them as launch platforms for other aerial drones (AKA sky carriers).

One campaign I had started with the runners being onboard a huge Blimb Restaurant (that is, the Blimp was large for it's size - the restaurant was quite cozy). It gave great opportunity for descriptions of the city sprawling out underneath, and all in all, went over well as something different and exotic.

Had the idea to use one of the massive transport blimps as a kind of secure data storage. Well actually I thought of using a jumbo first but someone suggested blimps- and I nicked the plane idea from television years ago.

Make it electrical engine powered, throw in some solar cells to take care of power, enough supplies to last for an age, a host and satellite matrix link and you're set. Makes breaking into the place that much harder when it's practically always moving and is several miles up just for starters.

Are there rules for quickly inflating a blimp?

It could be interesting to carry a small say, two person, blimp on the back of a van (without the ballon part inflated) and then used compressed gas in cylinders to quickly inflate and take off. Great fun in a car chase.

-Strobe

My boyfriend and I have developed rules for all sorts of uses for blimps and zepplins. Lone Star paddyblimps! NAN intercontinetal blimp service! Blimp commuter buses! Blimps of all shapes and sizes! Blimps of DOOM!

Blimps are quiet and non polluting. They also are stable and safe as aircraft go. We do have rules and examples for several types of blimps you might encounter in our games. If people are interested I could post them.

I'm quite interested. The more I hear about their uses the more it gives me ideas

Don't forget using blimps as bases for survielence or as a relay for radio etc.
Slap some advertising on it and have it just float around in circles.

A blimp circleing at about 15000 feet or so would make a great relay station for TV crews filming in the city, and would be much cheaper than a sat to set up and maintain.

you could also throw in some sort of sterling-style blimp communes. a bunch of folks who got sick of the world, and set up a community up above corp/national airspace. they could make cred by exploiting their non-territoriality, maybe setting up pay-per-access data havens or something.

Towards the end of a particular campaign, we needed transport to a remote area of Northern Saskatchewan. Our initial means of transport had been shot down, so we needed a replacement. After some debates, we decided that a zeppelin offered us the most effective means of long range travel with a good sized crew and several vehicles. Worked out quite well. They have awesome cruise ranges and a good lift.

What about storms? I thought that blimps are difficult to control in poor weather.

I really have little knowledge on them. If they're so spiffy, why aren't they used more IRL?

speed, more than likely. that, and the inertia of infrastructure--it'd cost a lot to set up the facilities necessary for using blimps on a large scale, not to mention the cost and time involved in training personnel to man them.

A friend and I use to play riggers all the time, and one night we decide to screw with the GM and showed him a blimp we wanted to build. It had a light naval gun and the best sensors in the worl including all the other electro gizmos, we had this kitted out so sweet. We told him we were going start shelling corporate high rises and just make a mess with his world. Ever time he said I'll do this or that we show him hwo the blimp would be defended from such a thing. He damn near wet his pants. Then we let him in on the joke, and showed him the price tag for the blimp-o-doom some were near 100,000,000 if not more.

But in our games we use blimps for just about ever imaginable purpose, we just like the look of a busy sky over a trash filled dirty street sort of like in blade runner. We even hijacked an ad blimp for fun and blasted hard core porn all over the seattle sprawl. We later thought that would be a good distraction for the gurds at our next job.

Some notes:

A blimb is a non-riggid airship, relying on gas pressure to keep it's form. Basically an ovid ballon (a ballonet IIRC) with a engine/crew module. They are cheap to build (basically the same tech as normal ballons) but relatively strongly affected by weather (specially wind) compressing / distorting their hull. Add problems with heating / cooling of the gas and a rather limited maximum size due to their construction. A weak connection between hull and gas cell limits carring capacity.

A Zeppelin™ is a specific type (Build by Zeppelin Werke Luftschiffbau) of rigid airship. Since the other series (i.e. British R-Series) were less well known, it's common to call all rigids a Zepplin (it's like calling all cars a Model-T)

Unlike blimbs the outer form of the Zeppelin is held up by a internal skeletton that serves as an anchoring point for a number of gas cells. Also part of the structure is the engine/passenger space. The often seen nacelle under the body was originally added due to the dangers of hydrogen lifting gas. The "Hindenburg II" plans called for all cabins in the cigar shaped body with the nacelle only for crew/engines/storage. Zeppelings keep their form even under high winds. Since they also have stronger internal bearings, they carry far more powerful (and bigger) engines, allowing them to deal better with wind. Shielding the gas cells from heat/cold also helps.

Zeppelin has build a new craft (Zeppelin-NT) that uses the mid-late 1990's material and engine technologie. The current ship is used as a sightseing craft but can be easily enlarged. Lifting gas is helium, the skeletton is a lightwight composite framework. All engines can tilt to add maneuverability, bringing ground crew down to less than ten. The craft, like the Zeps of old, is build along the lines of rugged and usable rather than technical "bleeding edge" and "maximum power"

The Macon/Akron (the two US Zeps) suffered from multiple problems. Based on an outdated model the US demanded massive modifications to the original design and then decided not to use Zeppelins offer to train the crews. The combination made for a weak ship with a non-optimal crew operating in extreme conditions => Disaster. Similar craft with better crews faired well under equal conditons. In fact, most of the german Zeps greatest tricks (round the world etc) are attributed more to crew quality than the rather average construction of the craft.

Pockets

More notes regarding Birdys post.

I know they had on Discovery a few 1-hour long shows that discussed the building of zeppeliners. Like that Zeppelin-NT as well as a Brittish project that were a competitor. Some of the stuff there was very interesting.

I never used any blimbs or zeppeliners in my games earlier, but hey, it does give nice ideas.

/Ulfgeir

Futurologists commonly predict the return of the lighter-than-air gas-filled blimp as a popular and reliable means of mass transportation. I am also considering, however, that they originally evolved in a far more climatologically stable part of the world. I suspect regular routes could not operate in certain storm- and tornado-prone parts over the appropriate times of year. With what was suggested about the climatological extremes over NAN/Ute and Sioux territory, I don't know that it would be feasible to run a route over it at all ... always assuming the governments were amenable.

But Seattle, the Tir, and the west coast generally from Athabaskan down to the Aztlan border should make for a steady run - and (presumably being a tad more inland or over water) you'd not get the worst of all those fun up- and downdraughts airplane-skipping between ocean and land. You also wouldn't have quite as much fun landing at Vancouver and Victoria airport either. (K-splash)

In our game, blimps and miniblimps are used for advertising, since they can go to where the people are.

Our rigger has a mini blimp with advertising on it so that he can blend it in and escape detection.

We always joke that it says: A new life awaits you on the off world colonies! (from the blimp in bladerunner)

The point is that an amphibious S/VTOL aircraft (such as a blimp) wouldn't have the problems for which both those airports are notorious, even today. I was being (apparently unsuccessfully) ironic.

LOL.... sorry. My mistake .

np

Another personal favourite, although not a people-carrier, was the LTA surveillance drone with its single firmpoint. Stored and set up well, virtually invisible in the air.

Jet-prop mini-blimp: max load: 400, can hold one hardpoint.

Light naval gun: 250kg + 25kg per shot

At least two shots after the neccessary remote control gear is in place. (didn't verify, but those don't weigh much)

One of the earlier books Into the Shadows talked about travelling by blimp as a luxury travel, not just for the ammenities but also because it is slow compared with any other form of mass transit. So only those powerful enough not to sweat the time factor would use them.

Some evil GM, who will remain nameless since she posts here, had us on a blimp in a campaign set in the 1920's but she failed to tell us that they were prone to extreme failures.

Quoting Cray74:

Can a Spirit of the Sky offer protection from natural storms using the Guard power?

Also, magic, particularly weather magic, might help protect luxury blimps. Spells like Armor (Lightning) or Storm Barrier quickened to the top lightning rod would require high force or extended range options, but should provide adequate support and eventually pay for themselves.

The massive cargo blimps that will carry around 130 tons from point to point could be remote controlled by satellite and carry major ECM and ED for missile defense. Too bad R3 only goes up to passenger zeppelin; cargo blimps would be great pirate air ships.

Hell, throw in some air-to-air and air-to-ground missiles not to mention some combat drones as well - nothing like a proactive defence - just to really make the place secure. Add a shaman with spirit help as well and you're set.

Work in progress: zeppelin-based airborne data haven/mini-arcology
Don't have my books on hand at the moment, but I'll fix this up with some stats when I get the chance...

* Chassis: largest LTA (zeppelin)
* Engine: whichever allows for highest load rating + secondary engine
* Piloting: Primary and secondary rigged controls
* Internal security: CCSS rigged internal security systems, cricical sub-networks failover to an external security rigger in case of tampering/emergencies
* External security: rail-mounted anti-aircraft weaponry + airborne drones (probably fixed-wing)

5 riggers total may seem like a little overkill, but I'm tending towards the mini-arcology/extraterritorial domain side, meaning AAA involvement and hence high security.

It's not uncommon for current-day high-end/mainframe systems to weigh in at a metric ton or over, hence the nead for a high Load rating. Any remaining CF is to be gobbled up mostly by high-class (business) living amenities, a few luxury-class amenities (executive suites and so on) and a small medical facility thrown in for good measure.

Now, for a good plot hook...

The Hindenburg is the most famous Zeppelin lost because of the film fottage made of it, but it was rare that a Zep would explode. most broke up.

American:
The Shenandoah was launched in 1919 and broke up in 1925 when a violent storm broke up the ship's frame. 14 crewmen were killed, 25 survived.

The Akron was launched in 1931 and broke up in a storm off of the New Jersey coast in 1933. 73 of 76 crewmen died.

British:
R38 launched 1921. on her maiden vovage the gondola split open and 44 of 48 men on board fell to their deaths.

R101 Launched 1929, one year later in a storm over France she started to come apart, went for a safe touchdown, came in too hard, broke up and exploded! 48 dead, 6 survived.

Italian:
Roma launched 1921. In 1922 traveling to the US, 4 or 6 engines failed and the strain of the remaining engines broke up the craft, which then exploded. 34 dead, 11 survived.

French:
Dixmude, german built in WWI, given to France in 1920. In 1923 over the Med it was caught in a violent storm, repeatedly struck by lightning and exploded. No known survivors, only 1 body found. 51 others missing, presumed dead.

The reoccurring theme was that the fames couldn't take the strain and broke apart. The Hindenburg was the exception to the rule of great failures.
Most Zeps were about 700 feet long. The R101 being 777, the Hindenberg was over 800 ft.

Here is a link about a semi-rigid airship that was under construction in Germany. Until financial problems halted he project.

Even after the Hindenberg german Zeps kept doing civilian air travel to south america for several years, until the war came. It was a great job for the staff, because space limited the ship to only one galley, so everyone got the same high quality food.