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ravensoracle
I am gathering interest for a new PBP game. I have a few basic ideas for a game and also have a few requirements for the players.

First off I do want to say that GM'ing PBP isn't my best skill. I am not a verbose writer. In fact, I am not a writer at all. I can come up with some great stories but I am lacking when it comes to truely putting details on paper. That said, if you are willing to overlook that and try to tell a good story anyway then lets give it a go.

I am thinking I will limit the number of PC's to 5. This will not be the first 5 players to post their interest. I am wanting to pick from the characters submitted the ones that are the best fit for a team. Availability and posting regularity will play a big factor in my decision.

There have been a lot of games that have never really gotten started because of one or two players not keeping up in posting with the others. I am not saying that there has to be a post a day. But my personal threshold for this is one week. If it is over a week and there hasn't been any word from the player, then the PC will become an NPC or take a stray bullet. My choice. I try to be lenient but I don't want to see the game die that way.

This game will probably best be described as Cold Pro w/ Pink Highlights. I want to keep the "realism" in the game as much as possible. But I still want to have fun and skip over some of the monotonous details. If you add into your posts that you are taking steps to be discreet then I will probably handwave most of that to keep things moving.


I am thinking of going with Karma Gen for character creation with the following rules. Feel free to comment on any of them. All books are fair game.

1. 850 Karma
2. Race costs BP in Karma
3. Any race beyond the core races will have to be approved.
4. Attributes Cost X5 per Sr4A
5. Magic/TM PC's may Initiate/ Submerge twice, Mundanes got to spend up to 150 Karma on gear and Avail 16.
6. Knowledge skills are bought like in BP where characters start with a number of Knowledge skill points
equal to (Logic + Intuition) x 3.
7. The Karma cost of Contacts equals Connection + Loyalty
8. Matrix actions are Attribute + Skill with hits capped by program. Intuitive Hacking allows a player to default without the program limiting hits to 1.
9. Character Type (Mage, Adept, TM) do not count to the 70 Karma Qualities Limit. Nor does Martial Arts.
10. Only the last 100 Karma can be used to spend for improvements past the initial Character Gen Rules and must use the Advancement Table from Sr4A
10. Background Questionnaire is mandatory.


I am looking for professionals. I want a rounded build but you need to be good at what you do so don't over-generalize. Don't worry about starting location, you will be recieving a plane ticket to your first meeting. Be prepared to travel.

So what do you guys think? Is there any interest?

I plan on taking a couple of weeks at least to get characters approved and the game to start. I have to get caught up on the games I have joined.

Background Questionnaire

[ Spoiler ]
SleepIncarnate
Not to sound like someone completely out of it, but what do you mean by PBP? Is that a pre-built run or something? If not, what's the basic idea for this group?

EDIT: Looked it up, play-by-post. So then yeah, what's the basic premise? Seattle, LA, Tokyo, Hong Kong, etc
Critias
QUOTE (SleepIncarnate @ Mar 9 2010, 12:46 PM) *
Not to sound like someone completely out of it, but what do you mean by PBP? Is that a pre-built run or something? If not, what's the basic idea for this group?

PBP = Play By Post.
crizh
I'm up for any game that isn't going to evaporate the instant the meet is over.... grinbig.gif

I don't really care what sort of game you want to run or where, I'll fill any role that needs filled.

Not sure I'd play any sort of Hacker or TM under those rules but that's such a small part of the game it hardly matters.

What sort of characters do you want?
pbangarth
I have three PCs whose PbP games here on DS have died. Definitely NOT because I wasn't participating! I sure would like to get one of them working again. I would have to redo them in the Karmagen system, and tweak a bit to make up for flaws that became obvious during game play (like a university researcher / investigator without Data Search Skill!), but here are links to their writeups in other threads:

"Professor" - discredited archaeologist
LINK

"Bongo Slade" - mystical drummer
LINK

"Hodder" - Qabbalistic treasure hunter (info spread out over three posts)
Vignette

Vignette 2

Character sheet and Background

I hope one of these looks interesting.
BlackHat
QUOTE (crizh @ Mar 9 2010, 01:30 PM) *
I'm up for any game that isn't going to evaporate the instant the meet is over.... grinbig.gif

QFT

I'm certainly interested. In my experience, Karma Gen can create some real monsters, though. wink.gif Since you're going for a professional game, it might not matter as much if the team has some experience and some sweet gear. Speaking of which, you mentioned mundanes being able to spend 150 karma on gear, what's the ratio (or is that part of the karmagen system that I overlooked)?

Edit: Figured it out, it was right there on the table. smile.gif
SleepIncarnate
QUOTE (crizh @ Mar 9 2010, 12:30 PM) *
What sort of characters do you want?

This is kinda what I was asking when I asked the setting. I get the impression that this is one of those moments where the Johnson puts the team together, which means they have a specific purpose in mind, which means they're going to pick runners suited for that purpose. A team put together for guerrilla attacks on competitors convoys and the like in the Amazon Basin or Sahara Desert is more likely to have a rigger than a hacker, would likely include a sniper, their mage would be more inclined to combat and health magic, etc, meanwhile a team put together to raid facilities in the Seattle sprawl for extractions, data swipes, etc is more likely to have a hacker than a rigger, close combat specialists instead of the sniper, and the mage would be more inclined to illusion and detection magic.

Also, if we're being moved, should we bother including lifestyles, vehicles, or drones of certain sizes?
Crank
QUOTE (ravensoracle @ Mar 9 2010, 11:37 AM) *
5. Magic/TM PC's may Initiate/ Submerge twice, Mundanes got to spend up to 150 Karma on gear.


Any other modifications on gear for Mundanes, such as availability and grade of Cyberware available?

Also, for Mystic Adepts, is the force for spells limited by the magic points dedicated to magic (SR4) or to their total magic attribute (SR4a)?
BlackHat
QUOTE (ravensoracle @ Mar 9 2010, 12:37 PM) *
2. Race costs BP in Karma

Does this mean attributes start at racial minimum, as well? (IIRC, the default karma system requires you to buy them up, but doesn't charge you for the race, itself).
Or are those rules unchanged (so an elf would have to pay 30 karma to be an elf, and also pay something like 35 karma raising agility and charisma)?
Crank
QUOTE (BlackHat @ Mar 9 2010, 01:46 PM) *
Does this mean attributes start at racial minimum, as well? (IIRC, the default karma system requires you to buy them up, but doesn't charge you for the race, itself).

Actually the default karma system neither requires you to pay for race or to buy attributes up. You start with racial minimums under the default system.

From Runner's Companion, page 42, top of column 2
QUOTE
Characters begin with the minimum attribute ratings defined by their race/metatype.
SleepIncarnate
QUOTE (BlackHat @ Mar 9 2010, 01:46 PM) *
Does this mean attributes start at racial minimum, as well? (IIRC, the default karma system requires you to buy them up, but doesn't charge you for the race, itself).
Or are those rules unchanged (so an elf would have to pay 30 karma to be an elf, and also pay something like 35 karma raising agility and charisma)?

That's not quite right, BlackHat. According to what I'm reading, the metatype is free normally (which you agree with) but that they also start with the minimum attribute ratings defined by their metatype, but can only spend karma equal to half their starting karma plus twice the listed BP cost of their metatype.

So for example, making an elf by standard karmagen, they start with 2 agility, 3 charisma, and 1 in all other attributes, and can spend up to 435 karma on attributes: half of the standard 750 karma (375) plus double the normal 30 BP cost for being an elf (60). They don't need to pay the 10 karma for ability 2 or 15 karma for charisma 3, they get those automatically. This is shown by the example creation of a sasquatch with Body 10, and it only costs 102 karma (because a sasquatch starts with Body 6, and they were doing x3 instead of x5 for attributes).
BlackHat
Ah, gotcha, so the minimums are free, its the maximums that you pay for. Either way, I guess that clarifies what I was asking.
SleepIncarnate
Looks so far like there's 5 people interested, so assuming this 5 is the 5 he's got picked, what's everyone got in mind? I've already got a tech character in one other game, maybe 2 if Troll Bouncer ever comes back and starts his Matrix game, so while I don't mind playing that role if no one else wants it, I would like to try and go another route if someone else wants to pick up the hacker/rigger role.
Crank
I'm interested in an Adept or mystic adept. If I picked a mystic adept, I would only dabble in magic and not seek to fulfill the spellcaster role.
SleepIncarnate
Physical, Social, Technical, Gun, or Astral Adept?
Crank
QUOTE (SleepIncarnate @ Mar 9 2010, 02:20 PM) *
Physical, Social, Technical, Gun, or Astral Adept?

Physical most likely, but maybe gun. As I fill out the questionnaire and start playing with the numbers I'll get a better picture of what I'd like him to be.
malachite333
I hope I'm not too late to join this game, because this definitely seems like an interesting game. I'm looking to play a adept doctor with a fair bit of occult investigatory ability as well as a healthy dash of facery, a bit odd I know but when I was making the build it took on a will of it's own and morphed slighty.
SleepIncarnate
Alright, and looking at all three of pbangarth's characters, they seem to be mental/social adepts (and one mystic adept) so that's pretty much the face and close combat specialist down if no one else shows interest in this group, crizch said he doesn't want to be tech, which means BlackHat or myself will end up being the hacker or rigger (depending on what the kind of runs we'd be picked for would be).
SleepIncarnate
QUOTE (malachite333 @ Mar 9 2010, 02:26 PM) *
I hope I'm not too late to join this game, because this definitely seems like an interesting game. I'm looking to play a adept doctor with a fair bit of occult investigatory ability as well as a healthy dash of facery, a bit odd I know but when I was making the build it took on a will of it's own and morphed slighty.

Not too late at all, ravensoracle hasn't decided who his 5 will be, but I'm trying to get the lay of what everyone wants to play before I decide which one of my many concepts I want to go with. When you work 10-12 hour days of sitting around doing mostly nothing, you end up bringing stuff in to do, I often made characters.
pbangarth
QUOTE (pbangarth @ Mar 9 2010, 11:37 AM) *
I have three PCs whose PbP games here on DS have died. Definitely NOT because I wasn't participating! I sure would like to get one of them working again. I would have to redo them in the Karmagen system, and tweak a bit to make up for flaws that became obvious during game play (like a university researcher / investigator without Data Search Skill!), but here are links to their writeups in other threads:

"Professor" - discredited archaeologist
LINK

"Bongo Slade" - mystical drummer
LINK

"Hodder" - Qabbalistic treasure hunter (info spread out over three posts)
Vignette

Vignette 2

Character sheet and Background

I hope one of these looks interesting.

Folks are right that the flavour of the runs determines who gets picked. If none of these fit, I'm happy to generate a magical artillery piece. Maybe ... call him "Thor"?
SleepIncarnate
QUOTE (pbangarth @ Mar 9 2010, 02:32 PM) *
Folks are right that the flavour of the runs determines who gets picked. If none of these fit, I'm happy to generate a magical artillery piece. Maybe ... call him "Thor"?

Troll Drake astaru combat mage? nyahnyah.gif
malachite333
10-12 hour workdays! That's harsh, but at least you get something worthwhile with the time such as making characters wink.gif .
SleepIncarnate
It's not as common as it could be (I'm military IRL) but it did happen for a period of about 2 months, and I was in a job role of "damage control" basically (i.e. unless the fecal matter hit the rotating blades, I was bored).
BlackHat
QUOTE (SleepIncarnate @ Mar 9 2010, 03:29 PM) *
... if no one else shows interest in this group...

<unlikely />
This post has only been up for a few hours, and there are at least 5. By this time tomorrow, I would expect twice that number to at least say they're interested, if not to have builds ready to go.
It might be a good idea to keep an eye on what other ideas people are tossing out there, but I don't think it will matter a whole lot. In all likelihood, ravensoracle will have to trim the players down to 5, and there's no telling who the other 4 would be ahead of time - so I wouldn't base too much of your own decisions on who you think your character would be working alongside.

My advice would be to just make something you'd enjoy playing, and if you have a lot of builds around, already made, you could always post more than one like pbangarth did.
QUOTE (SleepIncarnate @ Mar 9 2010, 03:29 PM) *
...which means BlackHat or myself will end up being the hacker or rigger...

See previous comment. smile.gif It is at least worth noting that if only one person proposes a hacker/rigger type, they're probably a shoe-in for that role, though.
Again, I don't expect that to be the case for long.
SleepIncarnate
More likely than you think. A lot of players don't like hackers still, because of the "waiting long periods of time for the Matrix stuff then everyone else is waiting long periods of time cause of the one or two matrix players" mentality you see in a lot of games.
pbangarth
I was a computer programmer for 13 years. I have never played a decker/hacker. It just seems too much like the life I left.
BlackHat
QUOTE (pbangarth @ Mar 9 2010, 04:01 PM) *
I was a computer programmer for 13 years. I have never played a decker/hacker. It just seems too much like the life I left.

Software Engineer IRL, and I probably play more deckers/hackers than not. smile.gif In another decade, I may very well burn out on it, though.
SleepIncarnate
Naw, you forget reality filters. You can be a ninja, a space pirate, etc. The way your programs/complex forms appear in the Matrix is left up to you (or the reality filter being used by the node or other hackers).
ravensoracle
OK, wow a lot of interest so quick. So a little of what I am looking for. I am looking at the player as much as the character. Some of the new guys may not be thrilled but if you have a good posting record with other games that will be a factor. And yes I do read the other threads when I get a chance.

The team I am looking for is a team of professionals that can get the job done. Any job. I want well rounded characters so that multiple rolls are covered and doubled up on if possible.

The basic concept I have for this game, which I haven't put together yet hence the two week minimum prep time, is that the crew will be hired to do a job. The job will be the payoff although some money will be put up front for expenses. The last game I tried this concept on was a RL game that lasted about 8 sessions to complete the job. There was a lot of prep side missions but the payoff was big. I don't plan on railroading but more giving the players the objective and see what happens. I think this form will work well with PBP. Mainly my prep for a game usually involves the main objective, some goals that have to be obtained to achieve the main objective and building the world around the objective that will be tied to the outcome.
ravensoracle
On another note: I am a strong believer in a good mission is one where a shot is never fired unless specifically planned. The Italian Job is one of my favorite movies. So are movies like the Score and the Saint.
SleepIncarnate
Quick question, do you consider the character type (i.e. magician, adept, TM, etc) to apply towards the BP/karma limit on qualities or not? For example, if someone is playing a mage, do you count the 30 karma for that as part of the 70 karma limit on starting Qualities, or are they allowed a full 70 karma for any other qualities?
BlackHat
QUOTE (ravensoracle @ Mar 9 2010, 04:11 PM) *
OK, wow a lot of interest so quick.


Assuming you get more than 5 submissions, any idea when you would be making the decision?
ravensoracle
I haven't figured out when I will make the judgment. I will have to see how submissions go.

I will edit the first post but I am not counting Character type to the qualities limit. Nor am I counting Martial Arts,

EDIT: I also do not allow the In Debt quality. I am fed up with all the arguing about buying it off with Karma or money.
BlackHat
QUOTE (SleepIncarnate @ Mar 9 2010, 02:22 PM) *
Also, if we're being moved, should we bother including lifestyles, vehicles, or drones of certain sizes?


Likewise, should we assume that since we're being given a "ticket" to get where we need to go, that we should make sure our personal gear could make it past a reasonable amount of security - or will this "ticket" be for the sort of transportation that won't look too closely at the cargo its taking from place to place?
Crank
How much info do you want us to give you in order for us to be considered? Just the questionnaire and concept? Or would you prefer a first draft character, questionnaire, and back story?
ravensoracle
QUOTE (BlackHat @ Mar 9 2010, 04:02 PM) *
Likewise, should we assume that since we're being given a "ticket" to get where we need to go, that we should make sure our personal gear could make it past a reasonable amount of security - or will this "ticket" be for the sort of transportation that won't look too closely at the cargo its taking from place to place?


One of the criteria for selection is going to be portability. I am not limiting the game to Seattle, I want pro's who can pick up shop at a moments notice and be able to get past security. You can still have your toys but you need to have some idea on how you're going to move them. Shop's and the like may need to be rented in the city of the current job. I will make that kind of stuff available. Also for Lifestyles go ahead and make one. People do have to have a place to go when off work. It adds something to the background and character personality. At least one High rating SIN will be required.


QUOTE (Crank @ Mar 9 2010, 04:17 PM) *
How much info do you want us to give you in order for us to be considered? Just the questionnaire and concept? Or would you prefer a first draft character, questionnaire, and back story?


Truthfully as much as possible. But even an idea or concept to let me know you are interested so that I can look for your character will suffice at first. I will make decisions off of finished characters, so just because I give some constructive criticism does not guarantee an in.
SleepIncarnate
QUOTE (ravensoracle @ Mar 9 2010, 04:42 PM) *
At least one High rating SIN will be required.

So are SINs and licenses not covered by the availability restrictions, or are we going to need the Restricted Gear quality to buy one higher than Rating 4?
ravensoracle
A rating 4 SIN should be sufficient at first, getting higher grade ID's will most likely be part of the mission. Just to give you guys an idea of what I am shooting for I will use a movie I kinda like but not really.

Let's say the job your hired to do is to rob a Las Vegas Casino. There is a lot of prep runs that have to be made just to pull something like this off. I am thinking that scale.
cndblank
I have a runner from another game I'd like to submit.

Named Kit, he is a Kitsume shaman/Shinto magician or maybe a Mystic Adept.

Could go Illusionist, B&E, or Face as needed by the group.

Below is one version (and likely out of date).

[ Spoiler ]





cndblank
QUOTE (SleepIncarnate @ Mar 9 2010, 02:57 PM) *
More likely than you think. A lot of players don't like hackers still, because of the "waiting long periods of time for the Matrix stuff then everyone else is waiting long periods of time cause of the one or two matrix players" mentality you see in a lot of games.



Certainly as a SR GM with a decade long F2F campaign, I have to agree there.

How is it for hackers in PBEM campaigns?

I would think they work fairly well if the GM and the Hacker tried to keep most of the mechanics off scene.

crizh
Out of interest, how will you be running Threading?

That's the major thing that is changed by the Attribute + Skill optional rules.

I have a TM for a jet-setting game that I created after play-testing Midnight that was designed to answer a lot of the complications of trying to play across multiple jurisdictions and all the border crossing and gear difficulties that presents.

I'm just a bit wary of the way Threading may have changed...
cndblank
QUOTE (ravensoracle @ Mar 9 2010, 03:18 PM) *
On another note: I am a strong believer in a good mission is one where a shot is never fired unless specifically planned. The Italian Job is one of my favorite movies. So are movies like the Score and the Saint.


I like those missions too.

In my 10 year campaign, my players never fired a gun at a Lonestar cop once during the entire campaign.

Now over their heads, physically assaulted, nacrojected, or stunballed, many many times.
ravensoracle
QUOTE (cndblank @ Mar 9 2010, 05:02 PM) *
I have a runner from another game I'd like to submit.

Named Kit, he is a Kitsume shaman/Shinto magician or maybe a Mystic Adept.

Could go Illusionist, B&E, or Face as needed by the group.

Below is one version (and likely out of date).

[ Spoiler ]


Right off the bat, I'd have reservations. I just did a quick skim of the sheet, not a hard look. These are some problems that stand out. Someone with glamour and a vestigial tail may stand out a little more than wanted. I wholeheartedly disagree with your interpretation of the Surge Quality, but that could be worked out. The teeth are a No. I am not meaning to rip you apart but I am seeing some custom stuff that I wouldn't allow at my table.

I am hesitant about allowing Custom spells, Mentor spirits, Tradtions, TM Streams or the like at the table because I would want to test them out first to make sure they weren't broken and I really don't have the kind of time I would put into that.
ravensoracle
QUOTE (crizh @ Mar 9 2010, 05:12 PM) *
Out of interest, how will you be running Threading?

That's the major thing that is changed by the Attribute + Skill optional rules.

I have a TM for a jet-setting game that I created after play-testing Midnight that was designed to answer a lot of the complications of trying to play across multiple jurisdictions and all the border crossing and gear difficulties that presents.

I'm just a bit wary of the way Threading may have changed...


I have never ran a TM with the Matrix rules like I am wanting. I am willing to take suggestions and I will have to think over it and do some research. That is a great question.
crizh
QUOTE (ravensoracle @ Mar 9 2010, 11:26 PM) *
I have never ran a TM with the Matrix rules like I am wanting. I am willing to take suggestions and I will have to think over it and do some research. That is a great question.


It's difficult to say. Increasing the Rating of an Exploit CF is pointless but for the Stealth CF it is invaluable. Having Threading add to dicepool and the cap seems a bit unfair on normal Hackers but you really need to do both depending on the circumstances.

Perhaps you could split the successes on the Threading test between increasing the CF Rating and providing a dicepool bonus?
ravensoracle
This is just something that popped into my head, not even sure it would work or if I'd do it this way. I haven't done anything to test it out. But what about Threading as a teamwork test to the actual program roll? Like I said this is just off the top of my head so I will have to test it myself. Any suggestions on how to handle this is welcome and encouraged.

Edit: If I can't think of an easy solution then I might be persuaded to just go with the normal Matrix rules.
LurkerOutThere
I would be interested in playing, I havn't played any other online games and it would be dispicable of me to expect a quid pro quo but I am running one right now. smile.gif

On to the character standpoint I've been playing around with an old soldier turned technomancer concept for a while, a former armorer and soldier who is suprised as anyone by his technomancer abilities and those are not the focus of the character. If i could think of the closest mass media analogy I guess I would say Bill from left for dead. Someone who is concerned about other people and very mystified by some of the changes going on. He runs the shadows because his records and pension were destroyed in the crash. Other big quirk is while he's not wired enough to go toe to toe witha street sam or anything of that nature if the GM allowed it was going to have him function like a living tacsoft and fill that role for the group. I havn't decided what nationality to have him be but i'm leaning very strongly towards a ghost dance war veteran (whether on the NAN or the UCAS side I haven't decided).
BlackHat
QUOTE (RC p42)
Characters cannot begin the game with more than one attribute at their natural maximum.


Just to make sure I am reading this right... this includes special attributes (magic, edge, etc)?
ravensoracle
QUOTE (BlackHat @ Mar 9 2010, 05:52 PM) *
Just to make sure I am reading this right... this includes special attributes (magic, edge, etc)?


I personally wouldn't include them but it is vaguely worded.
Glyph
I would be interested. I would probably play a mundane muscle type, but with 850 Karma he will have plenty of face and sneaking abilities too.
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