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Wuerfelwerfer
Our group recently liberated some slaves from an orichalcum mine. Incidentially we now have some orichalcum ore in our possession.
Apart from selling it, what can we do with it? Are there rules for some kind of magic weapons? Or can it just be used for foci production? Where in the books can I read up on it?
Cwell
It will help an enchanter, getting bonus dice to the roll to make foci, it is a potent material.
Street Magic - Enchanting (Alchemy) p.81 (description) / p.84 (Enchanting Table : +2 per unit to the enchanting test)
MikeKozar
p@wned!

Seriously, it's worth a *stupid* amount of money. Our party's mage is still saving Karma to bind the last focus he swiped - making more is just a hassle for him. Cash it out and take a vacation.
Draco18s
Sell it. Even at a mere 10,000 an oz. you're looking at a hundred grand (a half-pound, which could easily fit in one hand), easy.
svenftw
QUOTE (Wuerfelwerfer @ Mar 17 2010, 05:59 AM) *
Our group recently liberated some slaves from an orichalcum mine. Incidentially we now have some orichalcum ore in our possession.
Apart from selling it, what can we do with it? Are there rules for some kind of magic weapons? Or can it just be used for foci production? Where in the books can I read up on it?


Two problems:

1) orichalcum isn't mined, it is produced in alchemical labs so there would be no such thing as orichalcum ore.

2) ignoring that for the sake of the game, the price in the book is for processed orichalcum (the only kind) not the ore. I'm sure the ore would be worth much less than 10,000 per ounce, although it should still have plenty of value.
Ancient History
QUOTE (svenftw @ Mar 17 2010, 03:05 PM) *
Two problems:

1) orichalcum isn't mined, it is produced in alchemical labs so there would be no such thing as orichalcum ore.

Not to put too fine a point on it, but you're wrong. There was this big thing about "naturally occurring" orichalcum that you could mine in a 3e book called Year of the Comet (and before that, Snowdonia reportedly had some). Granted, most (if not all) of those should have dried up, and notes for mining and refining orichalcum were not included in Street Magic, but the possibility is there.

QUOTE
2) ignoring that for the sake of the game, the price in the book is for processed orichalcum (the only kind) not the ore. I'm sure the ore would be worth much less than 10,000 per ounce, although it should still have plenty of value.

The unprocessed orichalcum was worth half as much as made-in-the-lab orichalcum, and needed to be processed before being used in alchemical operations.
Draco18s
QUOTE (Ancient History @ Mar 17 2010, 10:26 AM) *
The unprocessed orichalcum was worth half as much as made-in-the-lab orichalcum, and needed to be processed before being used in alchemical operations.


Which is where I got my 10k figure from: Half (guess) at being raw, not processed. Half-again for selling (not buying). Snip off the least significant digits for poor negotiation and fudge factor to produce a low-ball estimate.
svenftw
QUOTE (Ancient History @ Mar 17 2010, 08:26 AM) *
Not to put too fine a point on it, but you're wrong. There was this big thing about "naturally occurring" orichalcum that you could mine in a 3e book called Year of the Comet (and before that, Snowdonia reportedly had some).


Well this thread specifically has the "SR4" tag on it.
Draco18s
QUOTE (svenftw @ Mar 17 2010, 10:53 AM) *
Well this thread specifically has the "SR4" tag on it.


Fact: GM declared that there was an orichalcum mine. Therefore one exists.
Fact: There is prior precedent for the mining of orichalcum, so while highly improbable, its not impossible.
Fact: Just because the SR4 rules are being used doesn't mean that the game date is 2070s. Whether this is true for this game or not is unknown (but I am in a game where the game date is 2059 and we're using the SR4 rules)
MikeKozar
QUOTE (svenftw @ Mar 17 2010, 07:53 AM) *
Well this thread specifically has the "SR4" tag on it.


Also, you can *usually* rely on Ancient History for good info... Particularly on the Shadowrun books that /he wrote/.

biggrin.gif

Not trying to pick on you, dude. I'm from the "Yes, and..." school of RPGs, where if somebody says they want to do or include something, run with it. It's usually more fun to play along then to be right. smile.gif By all means, run the game you GM however you want, but don't sweat it if somebody else is bending the fluff a little for their game.
MikeKozar
Back on topic, it would make for a hell of a fashion accessory. If you really couldn't find a use for it and didn't want to sell it, you could use it to put some extra shine on your weapons or cyberware. It's from the same school as the gold-plated Uzi, but it does have a certain financial recklessness to it, as well as being a huge lure for gangbangers and thugs to try their luck.
Professor Evil Overlord
QUOTE (Wuerfelwerfer @ Mar 17 2010, 04:59 AM) *
Our group recently liberated some slaves from an orichalcum mine. Incidentially we now have some orichalcum ore in our possession.
Apart from selling it, what can we do with it? Are there rules for some kind of magic weapons? Or can it just be used for foci production? Where in the books can I read up on it?


Orichalcum hasn't had any official affect on weapons since SR1, where its use in a weapon foci added to the weapon's damage code.
Wuerfelwerfer
Yeah, we don't play 2072, but rather somewhere between 2062 and 2064 and the Orichalcum IS there to be mined since our GM said so.
Depending on how much ore we can squeeze out of this, my streetsam is thinking about having an axe forged out of it* or having it alloyed into his titanium bone lacing - whatever that might do. But then again, our rigger might also sell it for crack.


*Come on, I could have a MAGIC AXE! biggrin.gif
Draco18s
QUOTE (MikeKozar @ Mar 17 2010, 06:57 PM) *
you could use it to put some extra shine on your weapons or cyberware. It's from the same school as the gold-plated Uzi


It raises your aggro.

QUOTE (Wuerfelwerfer @ Mar 18 2010, 07:47 AM) *
Yeah, we don't play 2072, but rather somewhere between 2062 and 2064 and the Orichalcum IS there to be mined since our GM said so.


Wow I was right on point three.
svenftw
QUOTE (MikeKozar @ Mar 17 2010, 02:30 PM) *
Also, you can *usually* rely on Ancient History for good info... Particularly on the Shadowrun books that /he wrote/.

biggrin.gif

Not trying to pick on you, dude. I'm from the "Yes, and..." school of RPGs, where if somebody says they want to do or include something, run with it. It's usually more fun to play along then to be right. smile.gif By all means, run the game you GM however you want, but don't sweat it if somebody else is bending the fluff a little for their game.


Did nobody notice how my second point started with "ignoring that..."? I have no problem with putting anything in any game - least of all orichalcum mines... jesus. But if you start an orichalcum thread with an SR4 tag, the simple answer is that it isn't mined. My only point is that ore would sell for less than the book price on the open market, I never challenged anybody's SR knowledge or said AH was wrong in any way or that it is impossible for such a thing to happen in a game.

Not everybody is itching for an argument in every thread... you guys can slow your roll.
Valashar
QUOTE (Wuerfelwerfer @ Mar 18 2010, 05:47 AM) *
Yeah, we don't play 2072, but rather somewhere between 2062 and 2064 and the Orichalcum IS there to be mined since our GM said so.
Depending on how much ore we can squeeze out of this, my streetsam is thinking about having an axe forged out of it* or having it alloyed into his titanium bone lacing - whatever that might do. But then again, our rigger might also sell it for crack.


*Come on, I could have a MAGIC AXE! biggrin.gif



Not only a magic axe, but a GOLDEN AXE. biggrin.gif

But the bit that got my eyebrows raised was the thought of deltaware orichalcum bone lacing. If, as a GM, I were feeling particularly evil/brilliant, I would mesh alchemy and cybertech in a non-cybermancy way to make a person into a weapon focus, sustaining focus, or power focus (I wouldn't use it for the so-called 'lesser' focus forms, but just for the two 'special' forms and sustaining, which I always consider to be must-have mage luggage). With the right brand of ritual mojo behind it, I could even see the weapon focus version showing up in an otherwise mundane combatant (the ritual allows for the binding of the focus to the host without said host needing to be themselves Awakened).

As for selling the ore for drugs, why not make it into drugs? love.gif
Mikado
QUOTE (Valashar @ Mar 18 2010, 03:07 PM) *
But the bit that got my eyebrows raised was the thought of deltaware orichalcum bone lacing. If, as a GM, I were feeling particularly evil/brilliant, I would mesh alchemy and cybertech in a non-cybermancy way to make a person into a weapon focus, sustaining focus, or power focus (I wouldn't use it for the so-called 'lesser' focus forms, but just for the two 'special' forms and sustaining, which I always consider to be must-have mage luggage). With the right brand of ritual mojo behind it, I could even see the weapon focus version showing up in an otherwise mundane combatant (the ritual allows for the binding of the focus to the host without said host needing to be themselves Awakened).

I would use it like a weapon or sustaining focus with the limitation that the implanted person must (on the low end) maintain an essence score above the rating of the focus, or reduce a personís essence equal to the rating of the focus. Therefore signifying a "fueling" of the magic with the hostís spirit. In the basis of a sustaining focus I would have the spell set (anchored) to the implant and not allow it to be changed easily. But would allow the spell to "come back" after an encounter with a ward or background count.

If I where to allow it at all that is...
Valashar
QUOTE (Mikado @ Mar 18 2010, 01:52 PM) *
I would use it like a weapon or sustaining focus with the limitation that the implanted person must (on the low end) maintain an essence score above the rating of the focus, or reduce a person’s essence equal to the rating of the focus. Therefore signifying a "fueling" of the magic with the host’s spirit. In the basis of a sustaining focus I would have the spell set (anchored) to the implant and not allow it to be changed easily. But would allow the spell to "come back" after an encounter with a ward or background count.

If I where to allow it at all that is...


I like the bit about needing to maintain an essence at or above the focus rating. Keeps things on a more even keel, since it would fairly effectively limit the focus rating to a maximum of 4. Given how little 'spare' room there would be for additional augmentations could also limit this kind of modification to more of a niche boost (with the significant investment already inherent in deltaware and high-end ritual magic adding additional checks). Also, given that having an active focus as a permanent part of the character's aura, I would consider making them dual natured whenever the focus is active. Or, perhaps, simply causing them to perceive astrally when it's active (a fine distinction, I know, but someone that's fully dual natured doesn't get the penalties to acting in the physical realm while astral that someone who is 'just visiting' accumulates).
Professor Evil Overlord
Who says the implants have to delta or orcalicum? What's stopping a magician from enchanting his/her foci in the form of implants, and then implanting them? It would be harder than using virgin or hand made telesma, but I don't see why you couldn't have say, cyber spurs, as a weapon foci. It was legal under SR3 and earlier. Anybody know off the top of their head if SR4 still allows this?
budoka05
In Digital Grimoire, I believe there is mention of a weapon foci that is specially constructed to act as foci even with mundanes. So it is possible to enchant some cyber spurs and have them work on any street samurai. However, the text did recommend embuing those types of properties onto a foci after great effort or with some consequence (like foci addiction).
wayfinder
It is perfectly legal to make a focus out of cyberware. It just makes it harder to enchant the focus as the enchanting process target number is modified by the object resistance of the telesma.
Wandering One
QUOTE (Valashar @ Mar 18 2010, 12:07 PM) *
Not only a magic axe, but a GOLDEN AXE. biggrin.gif

But the bit that got my eyebrows raised was the thought of deltaware orichalcum bone lacing. If, as a GM, I were feeling particularly evil/brilliant, I would mesh alchemy and cybertech in a non-cybermancy way to make a person into a weapon focus, sustaining focus, or power focus (I wouldn't use it for the so-called 'lesser' focus forms, but just for the two 'special' forms and sustaining, which I always consider to be must-have mage luggage). With the right brand of ritual mojo behind it, I could even see the weapon focus version showing up in an otherwise mundane combatant (the ritual allows for the binding of the focus to the host without said host needing to be themselves Awakened).

As for selling the ore for drugs, why not make it into drugs? love.gif


My troll is now drooling at the idea of a dwarf being his weapon focus. Dwarf Tossing! Thrown Weapons!
Cwell
A Weapon Focus needs to be bound (spend Karma) to an awakened character.
It also needs to be activated (by the awakened) to be used, a simple action, and cannot be kept on at all times (sleep, mana barrier, etc)
Cyber spurs would work perfectly on an Adept, but not Bone Lacing type as it is not a weapon.

I'd love the Troll-Dwarf throwing duo though silly.gif

Also, stuff is not made of pure Orichalcuum (it would be heavy and not really hard), it uses some to improve the magical properties of it (helping the Enchanter on his roll)
A man-made Dagger is easy to Enchant, Cyber Spurs (or high tech stuff) are not.
Cwell
QUOTE (budoka05 @ Mar 20 2010, 12:55 AM) *
In Digital Grimoire, I believe there is mention of a weapon foci that is specially constructed to act as foci even with mundanes. So it is possible to enchant some cyber spurs and have them work on any street samurai. However, the text did recommend embuing those types of properties onto a foci after great effort or with some consequence (like foci addiction).

You need to find the reference again please, as i can't. Digital Grimoire only has 3 more foci and few details on other stuff from what i found. Nothing about Weapon Foci working for Mundane.

If you lose contact with an active Focus, it deactivates (the bond is not broken and can be tracked back to it's owner). You need to pick it up and re-activate it (simple action).
Having someone else activate a focus and passing it to another person won't work.
QUOTE ("SR4.A p.199")
Once activated, a focus continues to operate as long as it is on the ownerís person, be it worn, carried, hand-held, or in a pocket or pouch. If the focus is snatched away or dropped, it immediately deactivates and all benefits are lost until it is recovered and reactivated.
Ancient History
QUOTE (Cwell @ Mar 20 2010, 03:02 PM) *
You need to find the reference again please, as i can't. Digital Grimoire only has 3 more foci and few details on other stuff from what i found. Nothing about Weapon Foci working for Mundane.

The example of a unique focus on p. 9.
Cwell
QUOTE (Ancient History @ Mar 20 2010, 03:10 PM) *
The example of a unique focus on p. 9.


Thanks! Its description is pretty clear.
Since it's a "Unique" one, it should not be used as a general rule for foci though.
Stahlseele
Well, it's a unique focus.
BUT this also means SOMEONE has figured out a way to do just this.
This also means someone else could figure it out too.
And technically, every focus is unique anyway.
Cwell
yep, i re-read the section about creating Unique formula, and it is fine. No perma active weapon foci all around wink.gif
The sword described p.9 has, for example, a carved fang from a Dragon as its hilt wobble.gif
Ancient History
We were gonna have that in Street Magic originally, to go along with the intro fiction, but it just didn't pan out. Glad it did finally find a home.
Stahlseele
Yes well, of course the stronger enchantments need stronger telesma.
Also, the magic level is constantly on the rise, magitech is going to happen.
But probably not before SR Version 10 *snickers*
Ancient History
Hey, we have manatech in Arsenal...just whip out your PKE me...er, Ambient Mana Potentiometer and have a ball.
Stahlseele
Yes, i know. But not of the Magitech Calbre used in Earthdawn or other high Fantasy settings. It's good like that too ^^
Hmm, a PKE-Meter . . wonder if one could build something like that within the woo . . err, rules ^^
Wuerfelwerfer
How would foci work for my non-awakened streetsam? Aren't they connected to the user's magic?
Cwell
QUOTE (Wuerfelwerfer @ Mar 22 2010, 01:14 PM) *
How would foci work for my non-awakened streetsam? Aren't they connected to the user's magic?

They would not work (you cannot bind a focus to yourself if not Awakened, nor do you have a Magic attribute), except for the Unique Enchantment type of objects, as described in Digital Grimoire and its example p.9
The user in "user's Magic" is the person bonded to the focus (an Awakened with a Magic attribute). If an active focus if separated from that user, it deactivates as mentioned in an earlier post in this thread
Draco18s
QUOTE (Cwell @ Mar 22 2010, 08:47 AM) *
except for the Unique Enchantment type of objects
The user in "user's Magic" is the person bonded to the focus (an Awakened with a Magic attribute)


I'd like to point out the two contradictory statements made here and point out the original question:

QUOTE
How would foci work for my non-awakened streetsam? Aren't they connected to the user's magic?


Note how you didn't actually answer the question. He asked HOW those unique foci work if they're associated with a Magic attribute, and you said "they can't (except when they do, which was the question)" and then proceeded to state the obvious with regards to the normal circumstance, which was obvious (and not the question).
Wuerfelwerfer
Ah, thanks! Earlier on, I thought people were talking about the Grimoire of 3rd Edition and wondered what that would help me. Just found out that Digital Grimoire is something else entirely!
Question answered!
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