I have a character that I plan on getting build/repair skills for. I cannot find in the SR4 books where it says the price for building materials. If I want to use the Armorer skill to build a custom weapon, how do I decided the cost of making it? I know I have to have a shop/facility and do extended tests to make it but I can't figure out how much it should cost. If I want to build the equivalent of Swat Armor (random example), what pricing would I apply to getting the materials for it?

References and house rules greatly appreciated!!

It may not be much of a help, but I think the skill writeup in SR4 states that you dont save any money by making it yourself, you just get to sidestep availability. Basically, materials to make an item cost just as much as the finished item you wish to make.

I could have sworn it was 50%. I'll take a look and find why I think that.

In Arsenal, there's a few more B/R rules, mostly around Chemistry. I think they suggest materials for Chemistry equate to 10% of the list price, but at are at the same Availability.

Could use something along those lines, with perhaps key ingredients being more difficult to find (like specialized processor chips for electronics), or highly controlled (such as high tensile materials in weapons).

D&D does 50%. Couple other games do as well.

My GM said he, too, thought it was 50% but said we needed to confirm that and I can't find it.

Nope, found it:
"The Hardware skill rarely comes into play when in the Matrix, but it affects everything on which the Matrix runs. Use it to install upgrades to your commlink. You can also use it to build your own hardware upgrades; use the Building Hardware Table, keeping in mind that the cost for parts is half the purchase price of the upgrade and following the rules for Using Technical Skills to Build or Repair, p. 138." (SR4A, p227).

That's why I had it in my head. Hmm.

Ah Perfect, thanks. I kept looking at Armorer stuff and didn't think so look at Hardware.

I looked that up recently. its in the SR4 main book, under 'using hardware to build and repair', i think. 4th anniversary page 227.

Edit: Argh, beat. Nicely done.

Anyway, it seems clear that it's up to the GM for other things (like Eratosthenes suggests), so a SotA heavy weapon might be more like 75%+, while furniture could be lower, maybe 25% or less.

Don't facilities and shops contain some parts? Also, to create custom weapons, you need design knowledge skills.

Well, I meant existing items, of course. Build/Repair is, as you say, not for inventing anything new.

AFAIK, facilities and shops are just tools. BIG tools.

Well it makes sense that it would come with some spare part at least.

While it might make for a nice game mechanic, and is somewhat important for game balance, it isn't very realistic. The chemical precursors for most of the things runners would want to make - namely explosives and street drugs - are both readily available and (usually) legal in the real world.

Any firearm enthusiasts care to comment on home weapon manufacturing? How hard are parts for guns to get compared to the weapons themselves?

Don't know about firearms, but I know explosives are usually very easy to get the basic components for. Especially an ANFO bomb.

Fun fact: Binary explosives are only illegal (controlled) after you've mixed them. Before that, the separate parts of a binary explosive are not illegal (controlled), even if kept together.

Arsenal goes over this, as well, giving a table for the Availability and cost of components for common (i.e. listed) explosives. I believe that rule is only for cases not covered; a blanket general rule. And I think was also meant more for drugs and toxins. While you can make an explosive out of common household cleaning products, K-10 likely requires at least one special organic compound that is highly controlled.

Even then, some compounds that are common are controlled if you try to by them in large quantities (like fertilizers that can be used to make Ammonium Nitrate).

Making guns at home would require some pretty impressive hardware to complete...

Tapping your barrel would be extremely difficult with anything less than facility level equipment, and I would say that you would need at least access to a facility of some sorts for most of the minutia...

When I was younger, I visited my Uncle at Lake Washington. He had a small "facility" and was a contractor for Colt Firearms (His equipment cost close to 200,000 USD, and that was in the 1980's). He had an industrial milling machine that he used to craft multiple pieces for the Colt 45 and though he had the hardware to create a fully functional weapon, he could not actually Tap the Lands and Grooves in the barrel. I spent the summer making lo-tech Black Powder weapons (with smooth-bore barrels) which was a lot of fun...

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