gorramfrakker
Jul 24 2010, 04:14 AM
I'm going to make my first Technomancer but can't seem to think of a direction to go in. What I have to work with for character creation is:
450BP
170 Karma to Spend
Extra 250K in Nuyen
None of the normal starting character restrictions
Submersion Allowed
The group already has a Rigger so I dont want to step on her toes too much but some drones are an option.
SkepticInc
Jul 24 2010, 04:25 AM
PACKS Platinum from Platinum and Ancient History
Udoshi
Jul 24 2010, 05:09 AM
With that much BP/Karma? Hell, do something different. Play a Stealth Samurai.
First off, play a logic stream. Sourcerors are pretty good.
5bp: Analytical Mind (any tm should have this)
5+BP: take a resonance bond with a free sprite. (cheaper submersion, access to sprite powers. its gooood)
5+BP: Martial arts.
5bp: Ambidexterity
Attributes: Max Reaction. Costly, but with Acceleration 3 you'll hit the augmented max, and that's worth it.
Submerge four times. This will cost you 70(13+16+19+22) karma before applicable discounts.
Pick up Biowires, and Acceleration 3 times. This nets you four real-world initiative passes without -any- ware or essence changes at all.
Take a point of Ware, going to 5 essence. Buy your Resonance back up to 6 with Submersion. Cybereyes in Betaware are a good buy. A fingernail Datachip out of arsenal gets you the ability to store data without any essence loss. Cerebral boosters to pump your Fading resistance, and Living Avatar stats. Get a pain editor. Its important for staying alive on the matrix for a TM. Accessorize with a trauma Damper/Platelet factories, and since you don't have any starting restrictions, adjust the grade to count. Consider Muscle Toner/Muscle Replacement to bring up your Strength and Agility.
Then build your character like a samurai.
Hell, consider going Type-O+TM(35), squeezing 2 points of bioware in, and picking up the Martial Arts and Resonance Bond qualities with karma. You certainly have enough to go around. Load up on Basic Bioware. Muscle Aug/Toner, Bone Density, Orthoskin(+ enhancements). Reception Enhancers(in augmentation) are great for hacker types, becuase they help matrix and sensor perception tests too, unlike attention coprocessors. Chemical Glands are also Basic, and there are -many- useful drugs. With so much biowire, you can cherrypick Cyberware to get at half-off due to the split. Cybereyes are ace, but you shouldn't overlook the small stuff, like a Math SPU(decryption tests, important) or a Skillwire Expert system to go with your Biowires, or even a nanohive. This is a minor rules exploit, but you can increase your Biofeedback filter(=Cha for TMs) by buying Tailored Pheromones - it adds to charisma, and doesn't count for awakened/magical tests. Fortunately, awakened is not resonance, but your mileage may vary, and its a little silly to try it.
Contacts:
Group Contact, representing your Technomancer Network
A free sprite contact, who's also your Resonance Bonded dude.
That oughta be enough to get you going.
As for your -gear-? No usual starting restrictions?
Pft. Milspec armor, an articulated weapon arm, and a Big Gun for it. Pilot upgrade the arm, grab the More Than Metahuman trait, and rig it in combat.
Load up on Viruses and Malware. You can't thread it, but its still good, and nothing prevents you from buying it.
Grab a few Doberman drones. Your machine sprites will thank you later.
Karoline
Jul 24 2010, 05:31 AM
QUOTE (Udoshi @ Jul 24 2010, 12:09 AM)

5+BP: take a resonance bond with a free sprite. (cheaper submersion, access to sprite powers. its gooood)
Only gets you a rating 1 free sprite though, which isn't super useful, or costs a ton of BP to get a higher rating sprite. You can get the cheaper submersion without having a bond, and at low ratings the sprite powers aren't that helpful.
I do agree with analytical mind though, great for TMs. As for going the physical route... well, at that point you may as well play an adept hacker. I'm guessing the person is playing a TM because the want to be a TM, not because they want to be a gunbunny that happens to be a TM. Give me a bit to post some more useful stuff.
Udoshi
Jul 24 2010, 05:37 AM
Or, you can feed your free sprite contact your Registered Sprites. They cost you nothing but time to make. And I have to disagree - some sprite powers are useful at a low force, like Stability, Proficiency, Suppression, and Electron Storm. The point of taking a resonance bond at a low force (like, 1-3) with a sprite thats also a contact, is you can feed it to grow bigger.
Granted, it may be a way to grab some karma debt (the bond is 5bp x sprite edge, so it the edge goes up, you may have to pay the difference), but....its still useful.
The other Neat Thing I have in mind, for a TM, lies in the dronomancer route. With Multiprocessing, Macro and More than Metahuman make a -great- combination. If you further pick up Mesh reality, you get to use macro for cybercombat. Its Echo intensive to get that and multiple matrix/vr passes, but its frighteningly effective in the amount of actions (or even rigging multiple drones at once, because you can pay attention to more than one node at once). You still need a point of ware, though, for your control rig - but it does stack with the Immersion echo.
Karoline
Jul 24 2010, 06:08 AM
Well, here is some more basic advice (Since this is a first time TM)
Make sure to get 5 resonance with BP (Possibly 6) and get the CFs you want as maxed out as possible, they're much cheaper to do so with BP than Karma.
BP is also good to use on qualities, cash, and contacts (And stats). Try and use your karma on submersion, specs for your skills, and low grade skills (like rating 1 or 2 stuff).
As for more TM based stuff, I'd suggest either going with a charisma based tradition as an elf and doubling as a face, or a logic based tradition and getting stuff like cerebral boosters. If you're getting ware anyway, trauma damper is great, as well as PuSHeD. Look into getting a cyberlimb (foot is good) to put a nanohive in so that you can get neocortical nanites. That'll give you a nice +4 bonus to any skill which is logic based, which includes software which is used in threading.
Whichever tradition (stream, whatever) you go with, SURGE for metagenic improvement to gain an extra stat point isn't a bad idea. Oh, and if you've spent essence, consider getting genetic optimization to give yourself an extra +1 max to whatever stat you use for drain.
There are tons of options for echos, so it is hard to suggest 'best' ones, especially because it depends largely on what you want out of the character. Mesh Reality however is very nice because it allows you to go VR without leaving your body defenseless. Combine it with a level of acceleration and a good int and you'll be making the sammy cry at your speed. You can also go with resonance trodes to take out anyone you touch by forcing them into VR and then hitting them with an attack program to KO them. And then there is of course 2 levels of swap to eliminate sustaining penalties, plenty of drone related stuff, overclocking... It really all depends on what you want to do with the character, but Echos really are like gold for a TM. I'd highly recommend spending most of your karma in submersions to get cool Echos.
Edit: When you say the normal chargen rules don't apply, does that include quality limits? If so, you can get a bunch of great stuff by being able to go over the normal 35 point limit (In both positive and negative qualities). Oh, and I'd strongly suggest a paragon. Only 5BP and gives nice bonuses.
suoq
Jul 24 2010, 06:13 AM
(Deleted, made into it's own thread instead of hijacking on top)
Udoshi
Jul 24 2010, 06:15 AM
Karoline has some excellent advice. Seconding the suggestion to max complex forms. If you need some suggestions on the essential ones, just ask.
On the nanite thing, if you plan on rigging at all, TMs are the only ones able to grab 5 passes and Control Rig Booster nanites(normally incompatable with a cyberhackers 5th pass), and Limbic nanites(the int-linked ones) benefit Perception tests, which you use for all-important Sensor tests, like Sensor Lock-On. Multiprocessing also cuts it down to a free action, which is really, really nice.
And, yeah. Unwired has all the cool echoes, so you're going to want to be taking a look at that. For now, though, decide on what you want to *do* with the character, and let us know so we can offer specific advice.
gorramfrakker
Jul 26 2010, 04:17 PM
This is what I came up with. I was limited to 3 submersions. I still have some Karma to spend too.
Race: Human
Class: Technomancer
Stream: Sourceror
Body: 3
Strenght: 2
Agility: 3 (5)
Reaction: 4 (5)
Willpower: 4
Logic: 6 (9)
Charisma: 3
Intuition: 3
Resonance: 8
Edge: 4
Skills:
Software 5
Compling 4
Registering 4
Computer 4
Cybercombat 4
Hacking 4
Perception 3
Dodge (+1 Reflex Recorder) 4
Infiltraction 3
Longarms 3
Exotic Melee Weapon (MonoWhip) (+1 Reflex Recorder) 6
First Aid 4
Qualities:
Type-O +30
AM +5
Records on File -5
Sinner -5
Reality Impaired -5
Delusions -10
Distinctive Style -5
Complex Forms:
Command 5
Analyze 5
Edit 5
Scan 6
Attack 6
Black Hammer 6
Exploit 6
Spoof 6
Sealth 6
Echoes:
Biowire (Echo)
Acceleration (Echo)
Multiprocessing(Echo)
Bioware:
Cerebal Booster R3
Pain Editor
Refelx Recorder (MonoWhip)
Enhanced Articulatio
Muscle Toner R2
Reflex Recorder (Dodge)
Karoline
Jul 26 2010, 04:51 PM
Took me a minute to remember that you had tons of points to throw at stuff.
Mind including your ware? I can see some of the stuff you got, but not sure about everything. I also notice very few specialization. A threading spec on software is a no brainer for a TM generally.
Also, how did you get your reaction up to 7? I don't see any reaction boosts.
You may want to consider getting some skillsoft CFs to go with your biowires. Also, you seem to be lacking the single most important CF: Stealth.
gorramfrakker
Jul 26 2010, 05:53 PM
QUOTE (Karoline @ Jul 26 2010, 09:51 AM)

Took me a minute to remember that you had tons of points to throw at stuff.
Mind including your ware? I can see some of the stuff you got, but not sure about everything. I also notice very few specialization. A threading spec on software is a no brainer for a TM generally.
Also, how did you get your reaction up to 7? I don't see any reaction boosts.
You may want to consider getting some skillsoft CFs to go with your biowires. Also, you seem to be lacking the single most important CF: Stealth.
Edited Above.
Karoline
Jul 26 2010, 06:08 PM
Looks fairly solid. Mental stats are a bit low for your average TM, but those aren't required. I'd still suggest specs on your skills, it's well worth the 20 karma to spec basically every single skill you have. First Aid (combat wounds) is a nice +2 DP to 95% of your first aid tests for 2 karma, same with Software (threading) and plenty of others.
It seems like you're going for a physically based TM, I'd really suggest dropping some of your TM stuff a bit and focus more on that, because right now you've devoted a fair bit into being physically capable, and yet still come off as only okay, and your TM side seems to be suffering some from it.
I suppose my verdict is that it is a good character, but doesn't strike me as super impressive (Which isn't surprising if it is your first character of a given type. My first several TMs struck me as downright sucky)
Udoshi
Jul 26 2010, 10:15 PM
Looks alright. Seconding the Specializations, though you should save karma to submerge in play.
You may also want to look at Learning Echoes (from a Tutor, for example), on unwired 145. It needs gm approval, but lets you pick up a new echo for a flat 15 karma - just the echo, it doesn't increase your submersion grade at all.
Can you include your Essence rating, and possibly calculations for it?
Karoline
Jul 27 2010, 04:17 PM
QUOTE (Udoshi @ Jul 26 2010, 06:15 PM)

Looks alright. Seconding the Specializations, though you should save karma to submerge in play.
You may also want to look at Learning Echoes (from a Tutor, for example), on unwired 145. It needs gm approval, but lets you pick up a new echo for a flat 15 karma - just the echo, it doesn't increase your submersion grade at all.
Can you include your Essence rating, and possibly calculations for it?
I'm guessing he isn't allowed to save karma, and his essence should be 5.25. Remember he has Type O system.
czarcasm
Jul 27 2010, 04:36 PM
QUOTE (Karoline @ Jul 24 2010, 01:08 AM)

[snip]
If you're getting ware anyway, trauma damper is great, as well as PuSHeD.
I see your point with trauma damper, but not with PuSHeD. Unless I'm mistaken, I think that helps only with Logic-linked skill tests. TMs' skills -- such as hacking and etc. -- are Resonance-based rather than Logic-based.
EDIT: Sorry, I hit post too soon. I wanted to add that your post is chock-full of extremely good advice.
czarcasm
Jul 27 2010, 04:41 PM
QUOTE (gorramfrakker @ Jul 26 2010, 11:17 AM)

Software 5
Compling 4
Registering 4
Computer 4
Cybercombat 4
Hacking 4
Perception 3
Dodge (+1 Reflex Recorder) 4
Infiltraction 3
Longarms 3
Exotic Melee Weapon (MonoWhip) (+1 Reflex Recorder) 6
First Aid 4
Why not have the Electronic Warfare skill? I also think that you'll find the Hardware skill useful. I'd suggest going with the Electronics and Cracking skill groups at 4.
QUOTE (gorramfrakker @ Jul 26 2010, 11:17 AM)

Complex Forms:
Command 5
Analyze 5
Edit 5
Scan 6
Attack 6
Black Hammer 6
Exploit 6
Spoof 6
Sealth 6
Because your choice of the Attack and Black Hammer complex forms suggest that you want to engage in cybercombat, I'd also recommend getting either the Shield or the Armor complex forms.
Karoline
Jul 27 2010, 07:24 PM
QUOTE (czarcasm @ Jul 27 2010, 12:36 PM)

I see your point with trauma damper, but not with PuSHeD. Unless I'm mistaken, I think that helps only with Logic-linked skill tests. TMs' skills -- such as hacking and etc. -- are Resonance-based rather than Logic-based.
EDIT: Sorry, I hit post too soon. I wanted to add that your post is chock-full of extremely good advice.
It doesn't matter what dice are rolled, if the skill being used is in the book as being linked to logic, then you get the bonus whenever that skill is used.
So, while for threading you roll Software + Resonance, you still get the PuSHeD bonus, because software is still a logic-linked skill, even though you aren't rolling logic. Same goes for when doing Hacking + Exploit, Computer + Analyze, etc. So long as the skill appears, you get the bonus, regardless of what else is used in the test.
So yeah, it won't help with your compiling/registering, but it'll help with most everything else you do in the matrix. Might also want to look into chopping off a hand/foot to get a nanohive for neocortical nanites. Same as pushed except with a +3 bonus.
X-Kalibur
Jul 27 2010, 08:35 PM
I can honestly find no reason why any Techno would go without the Shield CF (or armor, if they lack Unwired). Considering even a simple attack program can cause you serious hurt every little bit of extra protection helps.
Karoline
Jul 27 2010, 08:38 PM
QUOTE (X-Kalibur @ Jul 27 2010, 04:35 PM)

I can honestly find no reason why any Techno would go without the Shield CF (or armor, if they lack Unwired). Considering even a simple attack program can cause you serious hurt every little bit of extra protection helps.
Yeah, Shield is great. I love having 20ish dice on a defensive pool against an attack pool which is maxed at around 12 dice for most others.
Wraith235
Aug 20 2010, 03:46 AM
QUOTE (gorramfrakker @ Jul 26 2010, 12:17 PM)

Qualities:
Type-O +30
AM +5
there is a Very large issue in your qualities
Technomancer is a 5 BP quality
Stingray
Aug 20 2010, 04:36 AM
(IMO) missing one thing: Biofeedback Filter. essential to hackers and technomancers.
Thirty Second Artbomb
Aug 20 2010, 05:18 AM
QUOTE (Stingray @ Aug 19 2010, 08:36 PM)

(IMO) missing one thing: Biofeedback Filter. essential to hackers and technomancers.
For technomancers, Biofeedback Filter = Charisma. SR4A, p.239. Hope this helps. ;)
Saint Sithney
Aug 20 2010, 07:36 AM
QUOTE (Wraith235 @ Aug 19 2010, 07:46 PM)

there is a Very large issue in your qualities
Technomancer is a 5 BP quality
This is a no-limitations uber character. Starting Qualities are not restricted on account of massive cheese injection.
Mäx
Aug 20 2010, 08:11 AM
QUOTE (Udoshi @ Jul 24 2010, 07:09 AM)

This is a minor rules exploit, but you can increase your Biofeedback filter(=Cha for TMs) by buying Tailored Pheromones - it adds to charisma, and doesn't count for awakened/magical tests. Fortunately, awakened is not resonance, but your mileage may vary, and its a little silly to try it.
It adds to charisma and social skill test not charisma attribute, so that really doesn't work.
Wasabi
Aug 20 2010, 11:00 AM
For TM's I think Body is a better buy than Reaction. With Reaction you reduce hits possibly dodging an attack entirely. With Body you increase your armor cap by 2 pts per point of Body and have a better chance of shifting any physical damage to stun. If you have a very unlikely chance to make them miss entirely (read: low Reaction pool) then Body gives more mileage.
Max ballistic with Form-Fitting Armor III is (Body*2)+3
So if you lower Reaction by 1 and raise Body by 1 you net two extra defensive dice to REDUCE damage. When spiked Reaction is much better so my statement is about having Reaction at single digits when you have a fragile Body stat.
Wraith235
Aug 20 2010, 08:58 PM
also with an intuition (response)of 3 all your CF's are limited to 4 in Full VR without threading Unless theres something Im missing
X-Kalibur
Aug 20 2010, 09:08 PM
QUOTE (Wraith235 @ Aug 20 2010, 12:58 PM)

also with an intuition (response)of 3 all your CF's are limited to 4 in Full VR without threading Unless theres something Im missing
Yes, start with the entire Technomancer section in the main book.
A TMs complex forms are NOT subject to his or a node's system or response. Rather, they are limited by his resonance (for known CFs) and resonance x2 for threading.
Wraith235
Aug 20 2010, 10:58 PM
ok ... I was thinking they were still limited by the standard rules of response as well as by resonance
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