I'm working on a script for MapTools that will automate (among other things) much of the Summoning mechanics. I am a little confused, however, about the Elemental Attack on the Earth Elemental. I can guess what the other standard elementals will deal, but what type of damage do you use for an Earth attack? I'm more interested in ideas and opinions then hard-core rules quoting, so don't hesitate to weigh in.

Whatever is approate for the tradition. Sand, Metal, ect would be my best bet.

How about Sargent Detritus?

Damage_Type:"Seriously_Prodding_Buttock"

Agreed. I'd likely go for metal to represent the 'solidness' of your 'standard' earth elemental.

Acid possibly

That's the one I figured was intended as per the Core book, since Metal and Sand elemental types hadn't been written yet.

I considered that, but it seems like a Toxic aspect. Also it's hard to program.



Follow-up, what are your opinions on ranges for this attack? I'm tempted to use Bow ranges, just because it makes long shots challenging for weak elementals but scales neatly for the big guys. Since the elementals are so mobile, I think making them charge in isn't too punative, and could be fun.

Well, it seems appropriate if earth elementals are close-range monsters (big, avoidable but deadly if they hit), while for example fire and air have a longer range. But that might be overdoing it.

Range is LoS. That means there's no built-in range penalty. If it is within Line of Sight, they can hit it.

The only penalties are Visibility Modifiers.

SR4A, p 294: The attack’s DV equals the critter’s Magic and is treated as Cold, Electricity, or Fire damage (see p. 164) as appropriate to the attack.

So by RAW, you've got three choices from the core book, which really only suit the other three types of elementals. Of course, in Street Magic you get Radiation attacks and suchlike, so while there's no rule in there saying you get extra elements, they're assuming you will. If you open it up to the extras available in Street Magic, I'd say Blast works better for a traditional Earth Elemental (though a metal monster or sandman could be a cool variant). Think of the Thing's signature clap-shockwave attack. Now use it to shatter all the windows in your runners' van. Bingo bango.

Heh, that's a funny oddity of SR4A. I don't own a copy yet, as I'm the sole income provider for my family at a low-paying job. I plan on getting it as soon as things look better for me though.

Sand, Metal, or Blast. I'd say pick one and stick to it.

Personally, I like Blast.

Or Acid the DnD earth element it still fits as well though go go stacking damage. Cold could also work at a push.

Like wise Acid/Blast could work for your water elemental. Again your air coudl have Blast, Electristy or Sound. Fire is kindo stuck with Fire or Smoke but I guess you coudl push Light maybe. Guess what in may games as long as it fits the theem/tradition of the spirit I'll let it happen variation is fun and can be used taticaly as soem are stun and other P ect.

To me, Earth & Acid is a counterintuitive correlation.

Maybe so but there are links and its mental links that matters to magic users not physical links.

I kinda consider Earth to be the weak sibling of the Spirit types, so I bended the rules and treat their Elemental Attack as an LOS Engulf-- Kind of a ranged touch attack, if you will. I play of it off as the critter stretching up from the ground and snatching their victim Sandman style. It's a touch powerful, but well, like, I said, I always thought Earth Elementals kinda sucked and that they needed something. Their standard Force-2 Agility rating means that it takes a Force 6 Spirit of Earth just to hit double digits on the attack test, so it's not like they're stomping all over Spirits of Fire & Air in the offense department. I figure if you get hit by one of those guys then well, you deserve what you get.

My guess? Physical. The rational being that their Engulf Power does physical damage so their Elemental attack doing physical would make sense. Also, I enjoy the imagery of an Earth Elemental throwing a rock at it's enemies to be hilarious

Resisted by full impact armor? That's awful.

as was pointed out to me once, there isn't necessarily a "this is the type of elemental attack (or aura) that goes with this type of elemental" universal solution. the example was made that an air spirit could represent a storm spirit (lightning), a powerful desert wind (fire), the north wind (cold), a powerful blast of wind (blast), and so forth. an earth elemental should likewise not necessarily be restricted to one element. a volcano spirit might be represented as either earth or fire, but in either case could certainly be justified as having elemental attack (fire), but on the other hand the spirit of a high mountain that has a constantly snow-covered top might have a cold attack, to represent an avalanche. a water spirit might use blast to represent the force of a tidal wave, or cold to represent a spirit of the arctic ocean, and so forth.

so ultimately, i don't see any given spirit type as necessarily being restricted to a specific elemental attack. (though as was pointed out, it technically is limited to cold, fire, and electricity, i would ignore that rule in favor of implementing the full range of possible elements). the simple fact is that each type of spirit is really a general category of spirits that is intended to fit dozens of roles, and it isn't particularly reasonable to assume that they only have one role based on their type. but that's just me.

Well-said. Perhaps decide on a per-Tradition basis which elements the spirits use?

Personally, in my game I like to treat spirits as individuals at least as much as other NPCs, and a few changes here and there can really make a spirit stand out, as well as complete descriptions. "A living tornado with eyes of volt-blue lightning, wobbling forward on an unsteady funnel" sounds more interesting than "an air elemental with an Electricity attack." But widening the scope of spirit powers might be a good idea, although I could see munchkin mages trying to slip ridiculousness like some kind of Acid-Engulf-Energy Aura damage-stacking combo on it. Here's a quick and dirty house rule idea: For every signficant departure from tradition, like using Blast damage for a punishing wind spirit's element or giving an Engulf effect for earth spirits' Elemental Attack as described above, dock one Optional Power from the available Force/2 number. Apply the same thing to enemy spirits. A bit more flexibility, but not too easy to abuse. Thoughts?

definitly. an egyptian follower of Ra would summon a fire spirit, that is actually a Spirit of Light. obviously an aboriginal Spirit fo Air would use Sand(-storm) as element. a technophile chaos mage summons a metal earth spirit. etc

No. Interesting, but no.

Yep I like blast!