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Kerenshara
Iím very fond of the base mechanics for dice rolling in SR4X, but I think the concealability system is... Iíll be polite and say ďsub-optimalĒ. I liked the old amount of variation and the flavor it lent. (Otherwise why the line about the ďobviousĒ nature of the Armored Jacket?) So, how do you use the old numbers with the new mechanics? And then it hit me: divide by three as a threshold for the observer. (Even better if you use the dice caps, where really small items are just impossible for a novice to notice, hence the value of the security professional...)

1 Threshold 1
2 Threshold 1 (-1 Observerís DP)
3 Threshold 1 (-2 Observerís DP)
4 Threshold 2
5 Threshold 2 (-1 Observerís DP)
6 Threshold 2 (-2 Observerís DP)
7 Threshold 3
8 Threshold 3 (-1 Observerís DP)
9 Threshold 3 (-2 Observerís DP)
10 Threshold 4
11 Threshold 4 (-1 Observerís DP)
12 Threshold 4 (-2 Observerís DP)
13 Threshold 5
14 Threshold 5 (-1 Observerís DP)
15 Threshold 5 (-2 Observerís DP)
16 Threshold 6
17 Threshold 6 (-1 Observerís DP)
18 Threshold 6 (-2 Observerís DP)
19 Threshold 6 (-3 Observerís DP)
20 Threshold 6 (-4 Observerís DP)


All modifications and calculations are based on the BASE levels of the item.

Long coats (and their ilk) add 50% (round down) of base item concealability.

Concealable holsters and similar items add up to a maximum of 50% (round down) of base item concealability.

Hits scored on a Palming skill test (to a maximum penalty of 50% round down of base item concealability) may be applied as a negative modifier to the observerís dice pool.

So:

An assault rifle (Concealability 2) under a long coat (+1) being carried by somebody who can carry it just right (-1 DP) is Threshold 1, -2 to observerís pool. Itís not that hard, just like in older editions. But a rank novice might still have issues.


A Cavalier Scout (Concealability 9) under the same long coat (+4) in a permanently mounted concealable holster (+2) being carried by a Palming specialist (-4 DP) is Threshold 5, -6 dice. That means you need a minimum of 11 dice to have even a chance to spot it, more like 21 on average. If youíre using the caps, you need at least Skill 3 (Professional) to see the thing. As it really should be.

Thoughts (other than ďwho cares!?Ē) or suggestions?

-Kerenshara


Epicedion
That's not bad, but you'd have to go through and assign every piece of gear a Concealability number.

You could keep the DP modifiers as they are, and instead apply Concealable Holster and Lined Coat type modifiers to the threshold instead of the dice pool. That way an assault rifle under a lined coat, while giving +6 dice to spot, only gets seen on three hits. A "professional" level security guy (Intuition + Perception 6) would have 12 dice to get 3 hits, which is about even odds. By the same token, for spotting a heavy pistol in a concealable holster under a lined coat, he'd have 6 dice to get 4 hits, which would be rare.
Yerameyahu
It looks complex. :/ Maybe it's easier if you're still very familiar with the old version.
Epicedion
I don't think anyone was ever that familiar with the Concealability table. I always made the players track that stuff and include all their mods. If they couldn't produce a number, I would just assume they were carrying it in their hand.
Method
Yeah, yeah concealability....

You do realize that this scheme could be used to convert any "variable target number" mechanic from SR3 to SR4. Its briliant!! love.gif
Epicedion
QUOTE (Method @ Mar 29 2011, 12:44 AM) *
Yeah, yeah concealability....

You do realize that this scheme could be used to convert any "variable target number" mechanic from SR3 to SR4. Its briliant!! love.gif


It wouldn't quite work out the same in practice, though it could make for a decent guideline if you wanted to import a mechanic. Thresholds prevent the lucky one-in-a-million roll of a single die that hits a TN of 35, which makes the GM shrug his shoulders and say sure, why not let the bleeding-to-death drone rigger with 1 point in Rifles bank an off-hand sniper rifle shot off the helicopter, off the pipe, through the air duct, and into the target's skull.

No, to hit those levels of awesome in SR4 you have to actually be competent.
Tyro
I like it. It makes me want to go through and assign a concealability number to every piece of equipment in the game ^_^

Seriously, no joke.
Kerenshara
You do realize about 90% of the gear in SR4A has antecedents in SR3 (think: SOTA & Cannon Companion), right? I know... I just sat down and did the conversions.

So take the closest stuff (Predator III w/ Smartlink becomes Predator IV for example) translates foward and the remainder should be something you can fudge from the nearby items.

I really like the concealability to notice armor and how things like the Colt Manhunter get more attractive due to that one point of concealability. Adds to flavor without really overcomplicating things, since we're just replacing an existing (over-simplified) mechanic with another one. I mean, why would the corps turn out effective carbon copies of each other's weapons? They'd try to diferentiate THEIR models in little ways... ("Our phone is 20% lighter and 5% thinner than the iPhone!" or "Our screen has 35% more usable area then the iPhone 4 & we offer removable media!")

Now, a really industrious soul could go back and reverse-engineer all the weapons to see how much space is left for add-ons and modifications using the rules in Cannon Companion, but that's another post... after I finish my work on it. *evil grin*

-Kerenshara
Tyro
QUOTE (Kerenshara @ Mar 29 2011, 03:27 PM) *
You do realize about 90% of the gear in SR4A has antecedents in SR3 (think: SOTA & Cannon Companion), right? I know... I just sat down and did the conversions.

So take the closest stuff (Predator III w/ Smartlink becomes Predator IV for example) translates foward and the remainder should be something you can fudge from the nearby items.

I really like the concealability to notice armor and how things like the Colt Manhunter get more attractive due to that one point of concealability. Adds to flavor without really overcomplicating things, since we're just replacing an existing (over-simplified) mechanic with another one. I mean, why would the corps turn out effective carbon copies of each other's weapons? They'd try to diferentiate THEIR models in little ways... ("Our phone is 20% lighter and 5% thinner than the iPhone!" or "Our screen has 35% more usable area then the iPhone 4 & we offer removable media!")

Now, a really industrious soul could go back and reverse-engineer all the weapons to see how much space is left for add-ons and modifications using the rules in Cannon Companion, but that's another post... after I finish my work on it. *evil grin*

-Kerenshara

I look forward to it.
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