Hi All;

I have a player that is new to Shadowrun and the 6th world. In our first real session as the groups face and mage were interacting with him (gun adept), anytime either one (PC's) said anything to him, his response was "Don't say/do that again or I will fucking end you." I know that everyone will play their character the way they want to and the player was kind of drunk, but how do I help him realize that if you say this to a Mr. Johnson (or just about anyone else they might run with) there will be repercussions. Also, what might some of those repercussions look like other than a hit and/or blacklisting?

I gave him the "Sixth World Almanac" to read and possibly "Emergance" (I know I lent it to one of my players, I just can't remember which one) to get him familiar with the setting.

I guess, also, how leniant do I get with drunk players?

Thanks in advance

You can't play drunk. Not Poker, not Shooters, nor strategy, not monopoly and ESPECIALLY no Pen & Paper roleplaying game.

Having a beer or two is ok, but DRUNK? I would leave the session.

Second: So he "played" a dude who is threatening people for talking to him? Well, i guess the character needs to be abandonded and he has to make another one. Since it is clear that someone who CAN not fit into a group can not run with them. (Yeah yeah, a lot of runners have quirks, are starnge or angry at everything - but when he can't function as a runner he cannot be a runner).

You don't. If they're drunk enough to impede play they shouldn't be playing. Tell them to show up sober or don't show up.

Have him get set up with a nice free cranial bomb for his troubles, then blackmail him into doing a bunch of really dangerous things that will most likely end up killing him off anyways but benefit the one who put the bomb in his head if he succeeds.

My current group usually operates with a mexican standoff level of trust, and something like this would either pass pretty much unnoticed or cause everyone to start killing each other, though probably not at that moment. Such confrontations have happened before, with only one casualty so far (the player wanted to start a new character).

Edit: Also, none of us drink, so we've never encountered that problem before.

That is one example why alcohol should not be allowed, when playing...

If you can afford it, a map to the local pizza place and send him/her on a pizza run. Preferably one on the far side of town. Hopefully they'll actually be gone for the length of the session.

If you wanna be a jerk, then do the above but also call local law enforcement on a possible drunk pedestrian/driver.

What redwulf25 said is also good.

One of the PCs in our group pissed off a Johnson. They had unknowingly brought in the wrong target in an extraction and the J was really pissed. He was ranting and threatening not to pay them at all and instead find some real runners, so the team's physad put a gun in his face and would have shot him if the rest of the team hadn't talked him down. They eventually completed the run successfully, so the Johnson isn't looking to get rid of a possibly useful future tool, but he has set the wheels of his revenge in motion.

He hired a man named Puck whose expertise is making someone's life hell. The first (and only so far) incident was more of a friendly "let the games begin" sort of thing: Puck planted a bomb under the physad's car but when it went off it was just confetti, streamers, and a commlink with an incoming call. When he answered a voice on the other end let him know that his life was about to get much more interesting and ended with "that was number one."

Next session it ramps up.

Also, word spread that he'd almost shot a Johnson and he wasn't invited to the last meet. The pay also didn't factor him in, though they were never told that and he hasn't been blacklisted. He's just more likely to be avoided by the more cautious employers.

What should you do?

Depends. If he's seriously being an asshole, then kick him out seriously.

If he's roleplaying an asshole, maybe your party's mage will roleplay getting angry enough to cast a force 12 "Fucking End You" on the gun adept.

*edit: or you could challenge him to drink that last beer you "left on the front porch across the street", then lock him out. I love it when people mentally handicap themselves through excessive consumption of alcohol.

If you send a drunk out in a car you'd better be sending someone to drive them or you're just as liable (morally if not legally) as they are for anyone they kill on the road.

...it's all in how you treat imbibing while gaming which says whether it is good or bad. If you become visibly and judgmentally impaired to the others in the group, then yes, something is awry. However, if you are careful, and not drinking with the intent purpose to get drunk then it shouldn't be an issue.

When I GM'd my RiS campaign, I usually had a bottle of hard cider on the table next to me. Took me all session to finish it however it never interfered with my ability to maintain the flow of the game. As long as the primary reason for being there is to participate in the game in a cooperative manner and not look at the session as an opportunity just to party, then I'm fine.

...and yes, I have booted players out who stepped across the line.

If they player is saying things that will get them shot, give them a nice warning that it's not the kinda thing you say in the shadows. Next time have the person who he said it too shoot him in the face, maybe his next character will be more polite. An important thing every player needs to know is that good roleplaying isn't just doing whatever they want, but doing things that make sense. Any character who can be called a shadowrunner knows how to act around their team and Johnson.

As for drinking, I've always liked the two beer rule, or, if your too drunk to remember the rules well(usually after two beers), your too drunk to play. You play Dance Central on the Xbox when your drunk, you play Shadowrun when you want to RP.

If you believe that it was the alchohol that was talking at the time, then you need to have a talk with the player. He needs to understand that drinking only is OK, as long as it doesn't negatively affect the game and his character's behaviour. Once that line gets crossed, he's creating problems for you as the GM, for his IRL gaming group, and for the story, because the most logical response for a Mr. Johnson that is threatened, is never to use the team again, and if it was severe enough, to put a hit on the offending character or the entire team.

However, in this situation, the people the character was threatening, was his teammates, and that creates an even bigger problem, because that means that his fellow runners now have a situation where they have to deal with the situation that they have been threatened by someone they are supposed to be able to trust with their lives... This is a real problem, because unless the character was joking, and that his teammates knew that, then there is now a trust issue, and do they really want to work with someone that is unhindged enough to threaten to kill them over something they said? Personally I have a very hard time seeing it. And if his colleagues don't want to work with him, then that character no longer has a future in the game as a PC. Your problem player needs to understand this.

Good luck.

We don't mind drinking a bit during the game, but everyone knows how much he can handle. During the game everyone has to stay lucid, but a beer to loosen up and get into the spirit of things is nice. Nobody gets drunk to the point where handling the rules becomes a problem, but sometimes we get a bit more in-game belligerent, which isn't always bad, particularly when we put the smack down on an enemy - a kind of destructive camaraderie.

On the other hand, I've also had players - usually new players - who play a Dude Who Doesn't Take Shit. Those are tricky; on the one hand, that's cinematic. We see guys like that in action movies and they can be cool. So I understand when someone wants to play that. But there needs to be player-on-player respect for each other; talking smack and making some threats can be okay IC, but the player of the jackass character has to give the other characters some space too, even if his character is a jackass.

As for the "but I'm playing my character!" excuse: talk to the player, and try to get him to understand that:
A) Yes, characters like this are perfectly sensible characters for the setting
B) Unless they learn when to back down a bit, they'll get shot in the head, because all the other (N)PCs are just as dangerous.

Mr. J obviously can't let that one slip, because without a reputation of "don't touch me, or else..." meeting professional criminals in dark alleys is suicide. So Johnson packs his stuff, leaves, and tells his gorillas to work over that asshole as soon as he leaves the meeting point.
Or if the situation is taking place in a more civilized area, KE grabs him for disturbing the peace.


And alcohol does not just permeate the blood-brain barrier, it also permeates the fourth wall. So if somebody plays his character drunk, why not let him play a drunk character, too?

I'm guessing you and the other players didn't have fun...

First, ask the player not to be drunk next game. Tell him everyone else didn't have fun, mainly because of him.

Then, if the situation is repeated (of others not having fun because of this one player), don't invite the player back. If it's a friend, tell him his actions are not making this fun for everybody else. His reaction will let you know if he should be invited back.

In general, I think roleplaying an asshole or similar is a really difficult thing to do, in that you have to make sure the others are ok with it and having fun too. Noone likes dealing with an asshole, in-character or otherwise.

Of course the next time he says that to a Mr. Johnson you could simply give him a laser light show. You know, the kind with thirty little red dots centered on every vital spot on his body, or just be very nonchalant and put a bullet through his brain. Either way the problem should be rectified. I am not suggesting that Mr. Johnson is inviolate, there are instances where putting a gun in his face might be appropriate, after all hiring scum is a dangerous occupation, but in the case of your particular psycho I would make him a walking dead man unless he does some serious sucking up preferably accompanied by some serious reparations. "Does Mr. Johnson look like a bitch? No? Then why are you treating him like a bitch?"

Ah, I forgot that not everyone responds similarly to stimulus. People in our group generally reflect on our actions if we get a slap on the wrist (figuratively speaking) in front of everyone.
Personally, I don't like getting taken aside later on and told what I did wrong, since it's embarrassing. At table, the GM is judge and jury, so being ordered not to do something is easy to take in stride.

Drunk players are one thing, but drunk DMs are usually pretty entertaining

But, having impaired people messing up the fun for everyone else is not good. It happening every now and then is just kinda part of the social experience. I mean, around my table, having fun was more important than the game flowing smoothly every session, so as long as people weren't getting blitzed and being jerks or whatnot, not a big deal.

As for his character, deal with IC stuff in IC ways. Like Bubba the love troll showing up at his doss.

Bubba breaks the usual cap by knowing five moves:
leer
charm
sleep powder
harden
pound

I've played all of these while drunk and it never caused any problems. Friend of mine screwed up royally when he was playing Risk while completely shitfaced, but that was actually pretty funny. A total trainwreck, but hillarious.

It's just a game, no need to take it so serious. It's not as if anyone's going to get run over by a drunk player.

Some people can do it drunk, some people need to be sober, some people even need to be drunk. It's all about the individual in question.

Just don't call tech support for blurry monitor issues while drunk. (My first call at one job, I kid you not!)

Any game needs a measure of organization before you can be silly or have fun. In my experience overly drunk people tend to forget that.
Four square isn't fun if your friend is the only one playing it like soccer.
Shadowrun is far more rules oriented than that.

Tell me about it <.<

Ah well. Ok, didn't want to have it sound so harsh. Of course there are some qualifiers involved:

For example: If you just hang out with your friends drinking (and... umm... smoking) and somebody says: "Hey you all draw up some Wushu-characters, i have some dice. Let's play something insane." Surely it can be (wicked) fun.

I am going more into the direction: ONE dude just drinks excessively, while all other just play around. He goes overboard... and now they are all forced to endure a bad drunk for two hours. That is awkward. You either have a fun session P&P or you are heaving a binge-drink party, not both. P&P games are no party games. On the other hand: Like i said one-two beers are ok. Or even more over the whole night, or whatever you can take).

Agreed. If this ever happens.

Most people I'm familiar with would prefer to play beer pong and have a blast as their motor control is slowly and inexorably ground into dust over the next few hours.

But it can always lead to some great leverage to use over said drinker that might be worth it.

For example, one time at my house there were about 10 people over, some playing Magic and stuff like that, watching hockey playoffs, while people took turns playing Warhammer 40k. It was pretty quiet during a lull, and then throughout the house you can hear someone scream "PENETRATING MY ASS!". We all come running and someone who had had a little too much to drink was complaining that someone accidently miscalculated a hit on his Eldar vehicle. In 40k a hit to a vehicle can be glancing or penetrating.

To this day we still ask the guy what he was sticking up his butt.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Yeah, most of my players drink while we play.

The most unbelievable part of that story is that people were watching hockey in Midland.

Drunk Players, a GM's Bane.
Never have i seen a GM so horrified and nevr have i seen a carefully planned masterpiece of a xanathos gambit mindgame get resolved so quick . .
Basically, we were playing, most of us were pretty drunk allready (GM least drunk of them all, me still completely sober) . . We were guessing and trying and did not get any further . .
Suddenly, one of the others, our most impatient one, one of the a bit more inebriviated players, goes:"fuck it, let us pump the guy they want full of combat drugs and set him lose on them, they want him alive so i figure they are not going to hurt him too much, and we can use him as a distraction and take pot shots at them from cover"
I set on to say something along the lines of:"dude, that's the dumbest idea ever . . " looked over to the GM, saw the horrified face, changed it in mid sentence to:"you know what? it's just about crazy enough to work, let's do it, if everything goes south we'll go out with blazing guns anyway" . . 15 minutes later, the guy we were supposed to guard was down with deadly stun but otherwise completely fine, the opposition was in their last throes and the worst damage any of us had taken was a medium wound . .
quote the GM:"you guys suck!"

That's amazing

*nods* he still sometimes complains about that when he is slightly drunk or the others start getting there when he wants to pull his tricks on us again ^^

We were military folks man, from all over the country. Though I have lived only in Arkansas and Texas and have always watched hockey.

Not exactly gaming related (although most of my regular group were present), but nevertheless...

We are standing in front of a club, everybody has finally shown up so the only thing keeping us back is that I haven't yet finished my last prelashing beer. The conversation has been about relationships mostly, and one of the guys announces "It's about time I get laid again" - at which point I have finished my beer and loudly announce "OK, I'm good to go".

Waits, players need to be drunk for that?

Players will always respond with an inappropriate amount of violence. Sometimes too little, usually too much, but never the amount they should.

OMG. Just had the next session last night. I had to arrive a bit late due to family reasons.

The Face, GA, and Mage are there. They finish up their game of "Tragic: The Blathering" and we get ready to start. I've spent around 10-12 hours in the last month preparing and, while I'm always a bit nervous when I GM, I'm looking forward to it.

The Street Sam and the Hacker show up this time and we have a full group. We start playing about 4:30pm.

IRL, the players of the Mage, GA, and SS all work at the same factory and have been working 70-80 hour weeks for the last month. They're a bit on edge. Also, the Mage is the SS and GA's boss (this becomes relevent later).

We're running "Ghost Cartels" and the SS is tailing Alex Littletree and watching him do his thing at the Safehouse in The Verge.

Then the GA starts pulling his "Don't disrespect me or I'll fucking end you" roleplaying style. The Mage is on the commlink with the SS and the GA tries to talk to the MAge. The Mage says to hold on a second til I get off the 'link.

GA goes totaly apeshit! "Don't you fucking dare tell me what to do. If you treat me like a bitch again, I'll fucking kill you."

Now the GA is trying to get all the other players to gang up against to kill the Mage. He insists on being called "sir" and all decisions of the group must be made by him, or at least be approved by him. (of course, by this time the GA's player is very drunk and so is the Mage's player).

The rest of the characters realize that the GA is totally unstable and likely to hunt them down and kill them. They agree to meet him in a park and off him (except the Hacker, he's got the "Pacifist" quality and bails).

Just as it's going down (at 7:30 real time), we decide to break for dinner. It is also when we stop playing, as the mage is so drunk, he's wandering around his yard (we meet at his place) puking in, roughly, 5 minute intervals. The Face and I spend most of the rest of the evening following him, making sure he's ok. By 9:30 the mage decides that he has to head upstairs and head to bed. I've been shit-faced, falling down, puking all over myself drunk before (not in the last 20 years or so), so I understand. Everyone else decides to call it a night, except for the GA's player who wants to stay in the basement where we play, get drunker than he already is, then sleep/pass out on the couch.

I believe I am going to suggest that we go to non-RPG things until the work schedule for the Mage, SS, and GA, slows down a bit. If that doesn't work, I will excuse myself from the group as I don't want to make things weird for the 3 who work together.

I tend not to take things personally, but it makes me sad that we finally get to Shadowrun, and the group may disband.

Any and all comments welcome. I need to laugh at this.

(edited for grammatical correctness)

Well, I've never had drunken ridiculousness at the table, but I did have some guys playing high. They actually didn't do too bad, though they were bitching about food. Stereotypes can be true. Speaking as a college student, most of us have run out of beer by Saturday Morning, or are not in a state to look at alcohol til much later in the day. Mostly I just have to herd hangovers for a while til everyone gets water in them.

Yup, sounds like alcohol.

It's been said now multiple times, but:

No more alcohol at your games.

It's just not working out.

Hell, given some of the described players involved, the GROUP may not be working out.




-k

I vote this one.

Me too.

just say, "your heart stops beating. it will take the docs at Johns Hopkins years to figure out why."
and play without him.

i hate playing with drunks or complete asshats.
(we had a guy that thought that actions took place in realtime, so he kept talking every second about what he was doing. needless to say, someone with a sticky bomb asked him, "corpse says what?")

We always drink something when we play, but nobody would ever start blowing his own lights out during a game. Wouldn´t make much sense if you are not able to follow the run anymore. Strange people are living on this planet...very strange.^^

my buddies usually fall asleep after food from food coma when we are playing . .
leads to funny situations like one of them not doing or reacting to anything, GM rattles of combat, 14D Damage to x's Character.
x suddenly wide awake:"14D DAMAGE?!"

[quote name='Stahlseele' date='May 3
x suddenly wide awake:"14D DAMAGE?!"
[/quote]

Heh! I love it

Here's the next installement in our saga.

First, some RL backstory;

After the mage's falling down drunk last time, I guess he caught some aggro from his wife.

Face and I meet with the Mage and let him know that if the drunk stuff continues to happen, we both will be leaving the group. The Mage tels everyone else that the serious drinking can not continue at his place if we want to keep meeting there.

When we met on 17 June, the SS and Hacker couldn't make it again, so it waa Mage, Face, GA, and me (GM). Also, there was no alcohol in attendance. Wait, the Face has a bit of Saki, Mage and GA did not drink

We agreed to a complete reset of the current campaign arc. Anything that happened after the end of the first time we met for Shadowrun had not happened yet. Now into the game

GA, Face, and Mage were contacted by their fixer. They met with Ms. Johnson at a strip club called “Ticklers”. They were hired to tail Alec Littletree and Xa Firebird (of the First Nations gang) to figure out what they were doing and how they were getting their nuyen.

Davis used a contact to figure out where the warehouse for Alec Littletree was (critical glitch on the contacts part) and decided the easiest way would be to fins a Frist Nations dealer and off they to buy some drugs. At the deal, they were jumped by 10 members of a rival gane. The Mage managed to kill 9 of them with Manaball spell. The group managed to save a few of the First Nations dealers and got taken into a safe house. The Mage Mind Probes one to figure out where Littletree’s hangout is.

They follow Littletree and find that he is dealing tempo to someone of a different gang. They follow Caine to his place, and decide to mug him to use mind probe again. Caine runs them off.

They find Xa Firebird and mind probe him, get nothing out of his mind because of the bonus die die to his magic resistance. They buy 50 tabs of tempo off Firebird.

(this part had me cracking up hard just thinking about it) They hatch a plan to dress up as Cutters drive into First Nations territory, in a sub-compact POS car, mug a first nations gang member (that probably have muscle cars and bullet bikes. Trying to make a getaway in a “Geo Metro” type car being chased by the gang. I laughed so hard at the mental picture). Decide against it, decide to go in with black masks.

They decide to follow 2 First Nations gangers go to the “Stuffer Shack”. The Mage Mind Probes one to get Firebird’s address.

They follow Firebird to a loading dock in Everett, notice a bunch of people in the warehouse and Firebird goes ninja to get over the fence and see what’s going on in the warehouse. The group decides to just observe. A van leaves, they decide to follow and they almost get shot up on I-5.

They go back and talk to Ms. Johnson. She hears what is going on and asks team to frag Firebird.

That is where we broke for the night.

We accomplished more in one night than we did the last two sessions. I was glad!

Congratulations Troyminator. Sounds like your problem might have found a solution to itself. Hope it lasts

With people who are not familiar with the setting, mandate their character is someone who has spent several years in coma.. like, say.. 62 or so? Oh, and it's a corp hospital, so they've been playing "What happens if I try this prototype leonisation treatment on them" to explain their relative youth and inexperience with their abilities. They might have had similar abilities during their previous life, their magic may have juyst really kicked them in the face and given them these rough abilities (or they discover them on their own, as an awakening story) or were put there in some bizarre skillwire experiments. The corp might also like it's unusually successful test dummy back.

As a GM or player, my response is basically the same, though adjusted for relative degree of power. As a player, if somebody threatens my character, then I seek an opportunity to be rid of them permanently. As a GM, I make it clear to the players that it's their decision to react however they wish. The moment that belligerent player threatens an NPC, the world responds accordingly. That belligerent player may have just called down Lone Star/Knight Errant/Corpsec (threatening a relatively innocent civilian or officer), local gangs, a bounty on their head, a UCAS counter-terrorist strike force... the possibilities are endless.

Suffice it to say, it'll only be a matter of time before an anti-tank round or overcast spell makes a startling argument about how their behavior has caused too many problems, causing their head to disappear in a red puff of logic.

Realistically, if the party does NOT do something about the issue other than letting it slide, then THEY are equally responsible for any and all impediments that they allow to form against them because of the problem player.

Then again, I'm of the opinion that a GM who's scared to kill off a character is a GM who's too scared to run anything other than a glorified fanfic. Granted, some fanfics are actually well-thought well made, and not every game need include character mortality. OTOH, many fanfics are self-flagellating pieces of crap, and a character that threatens EVERYBODY around him with death is already calling mortality into the game. The same behavior on a playground would get a child punished. In the business world, it generally would get a person fired or arrested. In the shadows of 2070, you can add molested, robbed, 2nd-hand cybered to drop essence (and therefor magic) and capability to nil, and death.

It sounds to me like that behavior went away with the alcohol.