Ok, For my upcoming game I wanted to try Rigger and was asked to do some Hacking too, because the team doesnt have a Hacker at the moment.
Its been a while since I last played SR and I have never played Rigger nor Hacker, so I'd appreciate advice.
After building and adding all I want I ended with 475 BP used, with 72 in gear. Way too much, so how can I save them without losing too much?

Gnome 25BP

B 3
A 3
R 3
S 3
C 2
I 4
L 4
W 5

E 3
Ess 4,275

Skills:
Mechanics SG 2
Electronics SG 2
Cracking SG 2
Dodge 3
Perception 3
Armorer 2
Gunnery 4
Pilot Ground Craft 4
Pilot Antroform 4

Qualities:
More Than Metahuman
Virtual Personality 1

Contacts:
Chop Shop Owner L4 C3
Fixer L2 C4

Implants:
Control Rig
Datajack
Full Oblivious Arm
*Nanohive R2
*Control Rig Boosters R2
*Neural Amp:Neocortical R3
*Large Smuggling Compartment
*Cyberarm Slide
Sleep Regulator
PuSHeD

Meta Link
*Modular Electronics
*Biometric Lock
*Customized Interface
*Responce Enchancer R3
Response 5
Signal 5
Vector Xim
System 5
Firewall 5
Satellite Link
Sim Module, Hot

Programs:
All Common R6 (Ergonomic Analyze, Command & Scan, Optimized 1 all)
All R5:
Armor
Attack
Decrypt
Defuse
ECCM(Ergonomic)
Exploit
Sniffer
Spoof
Stealth(Ergonomic)

Rover 2068
Morphing licence plate
Spoof Chip
Interior Cameras
Smart tires x4
Chameleon Coating
Removed Manual Controls
Rigger Adaptation
Rigger Cocoon
Winch
R6 cameras

FlySpy
R6 camera, microphone and radio signal scanner

Dragonfly
Imp. Sensor Array
R6 camera, microphone and radio signal scanner
R4 UWB
Manouverability & Clearsight R3

Orderly
Rigger Cocoon

Manservant
Armor Jacket w/ Delta-Amyloid
Ingram Smartgun X
R6 camera
Clearsight, Targeting(Automatics) & Adaptability R3

Contrail
Mechanical Arm x2
Rigger Adaptation
Rigger Cocoon
Walker Mode
Armor, Concealed R10
R6 Sensors with R4 UWB

FFBA half
*Nonconductivity
Armored Jacket
Skinweb Array
Survival Knife
Fake SIN & Licence R4
Shop, Mechanics + Hardware
Glue Sprayer
Full Face Mask
Fingernail Data Storage
Disposable Comlink
Middle 1 Month

Rover is for moving around, flyspy & dragonfire for recon and sensors, orderly for moving in public(I am considering adding concealed armor to it), manservant works as bodyguard & combat drone and contrail (+ weapon tbd) when going all out. Later I will buy more manservants and add tacsoft to them.
If my GM allows modding drone arms, I will mod them too.

So, what can I drop?

EDIT: Dropped B 5->3, E 4-> 3, Automatics 3-> 0, lots of gear. Now down to 419 BP with 63 in gear.

Hmm, couple quick things, see if this improves it.

#1 You have no Ettiquette, this is bad unless you never intend to talk, especially with Charisma 2.

#2 Consider some negative qualities. Don't know too much about the character so I can't make any recommendations.

#3 Are you using Unwired? If so, you don't need to buy all the programs out of chargen, you can pirate them for 1/10 the price and small monthly upgrades. Get what you need (Analyze, Command, Scan, maybe Exploit and Stealth) and then pirate the rest later.

#4 Did I miss something or are you running a System 6 on a Response 5 Commlink?

#5 Consider dropping Encephelon and picking up neural nanites, or just drop Encephelon altogether. Don't get me wrong, Encephelon is nice but it's very expensive and essence heavy for what it does. You can also safely drop the Math SPU; it's awesome, fluffy, and occasionally useful but just not that critical.

Thanks.

#1 Character isnt much of a talker and we have semi Face to cover that for the group.

#2 I'll have to look then through again, hopefully I find something fitting. Virtual persona is one possibility, especially because this character will spend most of his time in a rigger cocoon anyway.

#3 Yes, gotta look that rule up.

#4 Missed that totally, I'll fix that. And I have to drop program ratings to 5 for those that I take, it will save quite a bit of .

#5 Hmm, Neocortical nanites seems to be better than Encephalon and half the price too. Concentration limit might become problem sometimes but still better. I'll drop Encephalon and Math SPU.


Also after thinking I am considering to drop Body to 3 and drop all those glasses and earbuds, because they do nothing inside cocoon.

Ok, just recognize that talking to anybody outside of your team is going to be difficult. This person is generally unlikable (low Cha) and rude (No Ett). Johnsons, fixers, mechanics, black market folks selling you cars and drones, your ability to work with all of these people is limited. Ettiquette is a very basic skill.


Rude, unlikable, and isolated. Well, it's a roleplaying challenge.


Nope, you're gonna optimize them (Program options, Unwired) and add in Ergonomics. Your skills simply are not high for you to be losing dice for a lower rating. Don't worry about cost, you're gonna be buying programs at 10% cost and spoofing your lifestyle to save on money. Also, nueral nanites break down in stressful situations. Look into drugs to keep you calm. Your best bet is probably the Reality Amplifier Focus from Unwired (p. 189) which fluffwise fixes the problem and almost prevents the loss by RAW. (Focus prevents dice penalties due to stress, neural nanites arguably are a bonus taken away, not a penalty).


Fair enough.

Double check the nanites, I'm pretty sure control rig boosts have some compatibility issues with other cyberware.

Also, knowledge skills and languages?

Not really, Cha 2 is slightly below average. Etiquette 0 is typical man on the streets. Should't have more problems than any reserved and shy person.
As a gnome he is used to being overlooked and treated like child, because of his size and looks. Low self-esteem socially, so he rather stays in cocoon and shows regular human sized icon in AR/VR.
Hence Virtual Personality.


R6 hacking program have availability 12, adding options increases avail. Cant be done in chargen, but afterwards will do that.


Avail 14, maybe after chargen


They conflict with simsense booster, character doesnt have it so no problem.


Havent decided yet, this is unfinished character.

You can't have a Response 5 on a Metalink, you can only upgrade commlink up to +2 Rating in Response and Sensor. It would be like trying to put a V8 Engine in a moped.

Drop a few points of Edge
Drop some of your Resources (Getting Nuyen in SR4 is usually alot easier then getting Karma), your character doesn't need to start out God-like
I'd Specialize more then have all low rating skill groups, or use skillsofts, with decking ability you can always attempt to hack yourself some.

About the no ettiquette- remember that a skill of 0 doesn't mean you have no ability, you have the same ability as the typical person on the street. You can navigate the basics of society, order a meal, make a purchase, ask for directions, say high to a neighbor. A 2 charisma means you are undeveloped in that area, something of a geek most likely being a computer expert. You certainly aren't going to talk anyone into anything they hadn't planned to do, nor are you going to walk into a bar where you don't belong and convince anyone that you are a regular. But don't think you are a social missfit or a complete dunce. Let the face do the talking when it comes to negotiation and fast talking the security guard, but you aren't a walking social disaster that offends everyone and pees in Mr. Johnson's soycaf. It doesn't even mean you are not likeable, you are just not very forceful or convincing.

It has the Modular Electronics upgrade that removes that limit.

I'll drop it one point, personally I like high edge for when you absolutely have to succeed or when trouble arrives.

What kind of skill setup would you recommend?


Maybe I am just too greedy and trying to doo too much at the same time. But it would not make sense for rigger to not have cool gear from the start.

It seems like you're trying to do way too much. I'm better off when I can actually SEE the dice pools, but it looks like you have a lot of low dice pool specialties and the generic skills you have you're trying to keep yourself from using. (Automatics? When? While in the orderly trying to control the manservant?).

You may be the team hacker, but I'm not actually sure your character can hack. What is your Hack-on-the-fly dice pool?

You don't need a fly spy AND a dragonfly and you don't need either at character creation. You don't need the contrail for anything I can think of. If you're going everywhere in the Orderly with a Manservant it should take about 2 seconds to trace you and find you. You're gonna stick out everywhere. They're cool, but are they a benefit or a hindrance to the team?

I think you've built a heck of a character but I don't think you've built a teammate. I don't see how this person works with, well, anyone. How is the face going to talk the guards into letting you into the building while you're in the orderly? How well are you going to be able to sneak around the facility with a manservant? It almost seems that anything the group will be doing, you'll be excluded from and anything you're doing, you're doing on your own (and I'm not sure you have the dice pools to do that).

For building a hacker/rigger think about roles. You'll probably want to be able to drive/steal a car/boat/plane and have your own car/van/whatever with enough passenger room. If you're the only hacker, make sure you know how high your dice pool is going to have to be (ask the GM). A flyspy and a Stormcloud are both nice, but a good face can get them for you post-character creation. Other than that, you need to work with the team, which means being part of the con/stealth/assault team. Since you're the only(?) person with the hacking/hardware you're not going to be able to sit in the car on a lot of missions. Frequently, their job will be to get YOU in and you need to find a way to make that easy for them.

Where are you getting modular electronics upgrade from? What book? page?

I think your math is off...I ran your character though SR4 CharGen because I was suspicious of your attributes, you know you get the 1st Attribute pt for free right? costs 10BP to have attribute 2 and so on...without your Gear I got 347BP (NOT counting Resources), 150 Stats, 20 Edge, 25 Race, and 152 Skills, Qualities cancel each other out

Personally I would get rid of dodge, If you want more Rigger Character I would take Mechanic SG 4, Electronics SG 4, Cracking SG 2 or 3, Gunnery 5 or 6, A vehicle Skill 4 to 5, and maybe a few other Vehicle skills rating 2, maybe get Influence SG 2 so you have 4 dice pool on your social tests.

For more Hacker Character with Decent Rigging Abilities Hacking 6, Cybercombat 4, Electronic warfare 2-3, Computer SG 4, Mechanic SG 2, Pilot Skill 4, Gunnery 4

A must for your character is Exploit 5, Stealth 5, and Firewall 6 Those are the most important programs in a Hacker's Arsenal

Hm hm... Don't know if all those things add up, and how much you already changed. But for me it looks reasonable so far. (But yeah, some negative qualities for a few more skillpoints would work great, i guess)

Depends on your gm and campaign you are playing, but you are of course not the "BEST EVAAR!!!" with skillgroups on 2. I personaly like that a lot (A lot of people go massivly overboard at creation).
Well rounded abilities, no crippling flaws, and broad equipment for many applications.

Seems like a reasonable and very playable dude.

Modular Electronics, from the SR4A Changes document, is technically a Vehicle Modification.

That said, it does kinda imply that it's also supposed to be a general Device upgrade, but there are no actual rules for that.



-k

Why Gnome? None of your tricks requires being "subcompact".


Can work; cut the cracking group and get yourself an agent, amp up Perception. Keep Dodge and add the Ranged Spec ingame, but remember to always fight by proxy anyway. Get a bit of the Stealth skills, vehicles need those, too.



Obvious Arm 15k, Nanohive 20k, Control-Rig-Booster 10k, Neocortical 15k => 60k. Gain +2 to two Piloting skills, gain +3 dice to Logic-based skill tests unless you really need them (I assume those are for Build&Repair between Runs?).

I would use a Cerebral Booster + Cybereyes with Smartlink + Attention Coprocessor instead - active target aquisition for the win. If piloting dice are really important, increase the skills.


Your manservant is not much of a combat option unless you are jumped in. Even then you will have to waste many IPs on Dodge. A Response of 3, a body of 3, and some strap-on armor is a level lowly gangers can take on.
The Contrail is an efficient base for a mech, but by all means ask your GM first. (Concealed armor... you must have a much different image of the beast than I got...)

True, I dont really need automatics for anything.

Hacking pools: Skill 2 + Program 5 + PuSHeD 1 + Neocortical 3 + Hotsim 2 = 13 While low, it isnt bad. Our games tend to be lower powered than average dumpshock games. 12-14 dices in main skills is ok, around 9 for secondaries.

Contrail is just cool thing that I wanted. Maybe better as a in game goal for character, not something he has from the start.
I should maybe swap orderly for horseman, they are pretty common sight, at least according to fluff.



150 Stats, 20 Edge, 25 Race, and 152 Skills, Qualities cancel each other out + 13 contacts.

I changed things few times, so mistakes happen. I update first post as changes happen.

I'm thinking about the skills. I'd rather have more things I can do than be one trick only. Lower power level means that I dont need that high pools.


Thank you.
Our group tends to be not that optimized, lots of low pool skills is common.


I didnt realize it was vehicle only. I am assuming that it aplies to electronics also. If GM says otherwise I just have buy that 4/4 commlink and remove mod.

First, I like the idea of small character piloting massive drones, second being small and low weight means that I can easily justify him rigging lots of things. By RAW there is no difference between cocooned gnome or giant, but my gm might question large rigger in small vehicle.

Are agents sufficient to hack? R4 is highest I can get in chargen. For stealth, I am overusing points as it is, but after some karma will take that.

Cerebral booster doesnt help hacking, because pools are program + skill. I have 12 Logic linked skills(Mechanic, Electronics & Cracking SG + Armorer), 60k +3 to all of them is cheap.
Cybereyes do nothing from inside cocoon, where character will spend most of his time.
Does Attention Coprosessor effect Perception while jumped in? If not, then not useful. If yes, gotta have.

Why would Manservant dodge? Armor jacket with delta amyloid is 11/7 armor. If damage is =< armor, it is stun. Drones ignore stun. Immune against small arms and encountering anything doing more than 12 damage means they are wrecked anyway.

About contrail, well it is supposed to in the back of the van when not needed. It has no F parts and only R parts are sensor and armor that is, well, concealed. In theory it can walk the streets with no problems, though it might raise few eyebrows. With right licences and stories it could pass as a movie/tv props, rich mans exotic toy etc.

Neocortical goes away the moment things go bad, which is when you can least afford to fail.

This means when hacking the enemy drones that are attacking you, you're down to a dice pool of 10, at that's Hot-Simmed, which means that if you fail, you're wall paper because you're an easy target. That +3 also goes away when you're being hacked and you're trying to defend yourself and your team.

It's nice to have, but it's not dependable and it's a major part of your dice pool. Basically, it's a free hit in good times.

Pixie?

<runs and hides>





-k

True, but Reality Amplifier: Focus fixes that. Its avail 14, but only 500 so I'll buy it after or preferably before first run.
Even moderate hacking is good, currently team has none.

I'm considering to drop A and R to 2, because they do nothing from inside cocoon. Also dropping Pilot Anthroform, Orderly, FlySpy and Contrail. Instead I'd take Horseman with advanced cargo, Full arm, cocoon & adaptation, concealed armor and upgraded sensors. It cost slightly more than contrail, but is much more discreet. Contrail would be long term goal/project.

After that it would be 385 BP, 61 in gear. Needs Born Rich quality and have to shave 1 BP in gear, but otherwise it is still only 395and and has room for some tweaking.


No Pixies, I dislike the idea and my gm probably wouldn't allow it.

EDIT: Have to calculate all again, after so many changes there is bound to be mistakes somewhere... I'll drop Defuse R5, its exactly 1 BP.

Your character BP points don't add up??! Your not even close to 400 excluding Resources

Yeah, after many changes I have to recalculate it all.

Gnome for style is ok.

I was going to say that Agents are not sufficient to hack on the larger scale, but still way better than your char. With the little "I stay perfectly calm, why would I loose the bonus"-trick you are going to pull this might be wrong. I would expect some serious roleplaying of being in combat and having no fight-or-flight reaction, as Focus is way beyond professionally cool, but if it works you are good to hack yourself.

The manservant - delta amyloid? Not to shabby, where is that listed? Still, a DV of 11 is easily obtainable against opponents with only three dice on the defense. An offensive pool of 12 dice and a heavy pistol with regular ammo can do that. Even without "Called Shot to the Off-Switch".

I will roleplay that and I think it will be fun.
Agents are useful, but they cant use edge and it would be boring to just say "I tell my agent to do that".

Delta-amyloid is in Attitude p160. +3 B, +1 I, +400 to cost. It has no listed availability, but after reading the fluff they seems to be pretty common.
Actually, I not so sure anymore that they can be added to armored jacket, the listing speaks of normal or armored clothing. Hmm.
If it doesnt work I have to either buy armor upgrade or accept that they are expendable.

My goal for manservant was to buy several of them, lets say 4, and put tacnet on them. Against hard opponent they wont probably hit, but few full wide burst will take their defense pool down for heavy hitters.

Finally after recelculating and swapping thing around it is ready.

Gnome 25BP
B 3
A 2
R 2
S 3
C 2
L 4
I 4
W 5

E 3
Ess 4,275
Attr: 130 + 20 BP

Skills: 140BP
Armorer 1
Dodge 3
Gunnery 4
Perception 3
Pilot Ground Craft 4
Mechanics SG 2
Electronicts SG 3
Cracking SG 3

Knowledge & Languages: Free
English N
Japanese 2
Chemistry 1
Engineering 2
Data Havens 2
SOTA Science 3
Scifi Sims 2
Security Systems 2
Black Markets 2
Computer Background 3
Drones & Vehicles 5

Qualities: 10BP
More Than Metahuman
Born Rich
Virtual Personality

Contacts: 15BP
Chop Shop Owner L5 C3
Fixer L3 C4

Gear: 60 BP, with 530 left

Implants:
Control Rig
Datajack
Full Oblivious Arm
*Nanohive R2
*Control Rig Boosters R2
*Neural Amp: Neocortical R3
*Large Smuggling Compartment
Sleep Regulator
PuSHeD

Rover as in first post
Dragonfly as in first post

Steel Lynx
*Walker Mod
Ingram White Knight
Sensor upgraded to R6

Horseman, Advanced Cargo
*Mechanical Arm
*Rigger Adaptation
*Rigger Cocoon
*Concealed armor R10
Sensor upgraded to R6

FFBA Half
*Nonconductivity R3
*Biomonitor
Industrious Line Jumpsuit
Skinweb Array
Beretta Model 70
Survival Knife
Fake SIN R4
Fake Licence R4
Shop(Mechanics)
Kit(Hardware)
Glue Sprayer
Trauma Patch
Fingernail Data Storage
Middle 1 Month

Commlink
Meta Link
*Modular Electronics
*Biometric Lock
*Customized Interface
*Response Enchancer R2
Response 5
Signal 5
Vextor Xim
System 5
Firewall 5
Sim module, hot
Satellite Link
Mapsoft(Campaign City) R6
Disposable commlink

Common Programs: All R6
Analyze(Ergonomic + Optimization 1)
Browse(Optimization 1)
Command(Ergonomic + Optimization 1)
Edit(Optimization 1)
Encrypt(Optimization + Optimization 1)
Scan(Ergonomic + Optimization 1)

Hacking Programs: All R5
Armor
Attack
Biofeedback Filter(Ergonomic)
Decrypt
ECCM(Ergonomic)
Exploit(Mute)
Sniffer
Spoof(Mute)
Stealth

EDIT: Removed FlySpy, dropped Response Enchancer to R2, added Biofeedback Filter. Removed Manservant and took Steel Lynx.

Doublepost, please remove...

Just saying "no, I don't have a fight or flight response, and can give my full and calm attention to my work in a fight just like I would at my desk" is...well, kind of BS. And the reason they made it that way in the game was intentional, that certain powers or implants don't function during combat, that's why they cost what they do/are as effective as they are. It's like saying that you don't acknowledge time limits on an adept power because you don't recognize the validity of linear time.

NOW...I step in it. There are a couple of implants in WAR! that I actually found quite interesting (and not any worse written or balanced than anything from other books), which basically turn off your natural fight or flight responses in the form of giving you large bonuses to your Composure tests. I would be willing to let a character that had those, so long as they RP'd the effect such a removal of a natural component of human nature would have, possibly have the 'doesn't function during combat or high stress' clause waived. Of course, that'd be pure house rule territory, just like 'no, no, it just doesn't affect me, because...' is.

Armor Jacket & FFBA Half with a body of 3 = encumbered unless my math is off. (-2 to your agility of 2). You may not have the intent of ever leaving that horseman, but the horseman really isn't good about getting behind cover. You're putting your GM in a position of having every bad guy open fire on your horseman for lack of any other targets.

I'm concerned about the lack of Biofeedback filter.

I'm still not sure how you plan to control the Horseman AND the Manservant in the same Initiative Pass, nevermind 4 manservants.

I am using FFBA half + Industrious jumpsuit. It has 4/2 so no minuses. Armor jacket was for original build with body 5.

Totally forgot biofeedback filter. Lets see if I can squeeze it in somehow. Hmm, drop flyspy and decrease response enchancer from 3 to 2 gives about the right amount of money.

Jumped in Horseman, Drones acting under their own pilots.
Manservants arent that good for combat, but they are cheap.

That is why I am buying Reality Amp: Focus. It specificly removes fight or flight responses and removes dice penalties for stressful situations. It even says hacker can calmly write code while taking heavy fire as an example.
Its avail 14 so I have buy it after chargen, before first mission if possible.

I don't think I'd describe incapable as "aren't that good". Pilot Capabilities in Arsenal (Pg 103) doesn't leave me with any question that the Manservant is unable to tell friend from foe and doesn't know how to use a gun correctly. Dog Brains aren't going to make those Manservants remotely useful in combat except as target dummies.

Note also that the Manservant is slow, "any ambulatory person can outrace it" (Pg 121, AR) which is going to be a liability to your team. Meanwhile, the description of the upper arms as "This design option limits any chance of using its upper body limbs offensively." makes me seriously doubt one could use a gun, especially since Renraku have good reason for making sure that Manservants don't start shooting people.

If you had a targeting autosoft AND electronic firing, I could see it working, but my money would be on Renraku coming down on you HARD because they have good reason to not want this sort of thing to happen.

But all that's up to your GM.

Yeah, they are bad. Cheap though. Drones either have to be cheap enough to be expendable or good enough to take hits and that cost a lot.

As for recognizing friend from foe I am assuming that is has capability to tell individuals apart. Telling these are friends, dont shoot, if anyone shoots them/me, target that individual. Shouldn't be that hard especially as it has Adaptability program. It has Targeting(Automatics) so it knows how to shoot that is the entire point of that program. Apparently I forgot to add those to second posting, in first post it has them.

It doesnt say that. Its says that upper body strenght is on lower end of humanity "while being unable to strongly strike". And it cant kick. Holding a gun requires neither of those.


Manservant + stuff for it costs 10960. Come to think of it, It might be possible to buy Steel Lynx instead. It would already have Targeting 3 +Defense 3, armor and weapon mount. Thats 5000 + about 1000 for upgraded sensors. About 5000 for weapon + modes. Back to arsenal it is.

EDIT: I am dropping Manservant and taking Steel Lynx with walker mod, Ingram White Knight and R6 sensors. It is 10550, cheaper than Manservant.