Our group is planning on having a sideliner game to blow some steam. We've all decided to play some a character inspired by a movie of choice, and I chose Equilibrium just 'cause I really like the style (:P on everyone who bitches about it -- it's a friggin' movie, get over it). :D In any case, I was wondering if you guys could look this rough, rough draft over and give me some constructive criticism on how I can make him a bit more accurate to the concepts in the movie (not necessarily Preston) without going all cheesy.
The main thing I see missing is a proficiency with other melee weapons, namely Edged Weapons. But I don't know, that didn't seem to be very practical in the field and since this is a one-shot go-crazy game, I figured I'd just stick with the basics for the most part.
Oh, and here are two major house rules we use before someone mentions them: In our games, all magical characters, including adepts, gain 5 Spell Points per natural Magic Attribute during character creation and they may be used as Karma for any magical purposes within their ability as per SRComp. Martial Arts also come with a free maneuver during creation for every two full points in the art.
Also, feel free to throw down some other ideas for other movie-inspired characters just for the fun of it. Might as well make this thread fun for others, too. :)
Tetragrammaton Cleric
Build Points (130): Magic 25, Race 0, Attributes 60, Skills 35, Resources 15, Edges +0
Attributes: Bod 5, Qui 6, Str 5, Cha 2 (Cold-Hearted), Int 6, Wil 6; Rea 6(10), Ini 1D6(3D6), Magic 5(7), CP 9(12)
Active Skills: Athletics 5, Centering (Gun-Kata) 6, Clubs 4(8) (Pistol-Whipping 6[10]), Escrima 4, Etiquette 2, Intimidation 1 (Social 3), Pistols 5(9) (Savalette Guardian 7[11]), Stealth 5. Escrima Maneuvers: Multi-Strike, Multi-Strike: Clubs
Knowledge Skills: Gun-Kata 6. Remaining 24 points to be spent to round the character out after I hashed everything else out.
Magical Group: Tetragrammaton Clerics. (3 Spell Points)
Ordeals: Oath, Thesis (two copies, one of which is owned by the group).
Initiation Grade: 2nd; Centering (Physical), Centering (Firearms). (19 Spell Points)
Remaining Spell Points: 3 Unspent.
Adept Powers: Combat Sense 3 (Condition: Gun Kata), Improved Ability: Clubs 4 (Condition: Gun-Kata), Improved Ability: Pistols 4 (Condition: Gun-Kata), Improved Reflexes 2 (undecided geas), Quick Draw (no geas)
Edges & Flaws: Ambidexterity 4, Bad Karma (due to a lack of emotion), Combat Monster (I know, I know, but it fits), Incompetence: Etiquette.
Implants: Cybereyes (alpha; Flare Compensation, Image Link, Vision Magnification 3), Smartlink System (Ballistic-2 Processor, Induction Pad, Limited Simrig). No geas. And yes, I'm aware targeting systems aren't compatible with two weapons use. But he's not always going to use two weapons. Naturally this wasn't from the film, but in Shadowrun it's pretty much a "must have" for any gun expert character.
Notable Gear: Concealed-Quick Draw Holsters (x2) (pop-out wrist holsters), Form-Fitting Body Armor, Savalette Guardians (x2) (Custom Finish [silver], Engraving, Laser Sight, Melee Hardening, Personalized Grip, 2 Spare Clips, Underbarrel Weight), Vashon Island Actioneer Line.
Full Version: Movie-Inspired Characters...
I saw that movie for the first time about a moth ago. And I thought it totally ROCKED! Sure a LOT of it was WAY out of the realm of reality, but it was just plain entertaining.
As for the character, he looks good, though I would probably kick up his Escrima skill a bit. Preston seemed to really be able to handle himself when unarmed.
And BTW, I trained in Escrima for a few years (even attended some training events with Omar Hakim) and I think it's a good choice for the type of unarmed stuff you see in that movie.
Good luck with the character, BTW.
As for the character, he looks good, though I would probably kick up his Escrima skill a bit. Preston seemed to really be able to handle himself when unarmed.
And BTW, I trained in Escrima for a few years (even attended some training events with Omar Hakim) and I think it's a good choice for the type of unarmed stuff you see in that movie.
Good luck with the character, BTW.
First let me say I didn't care for the movie 
Other than not likeing some silly movie the char looks good might I suggest the trademark longcoat as your improved reflexes geas.
Also even though it might seem munchkin and you look low on cash, you can get the engraving on your guns as Olricalcum and have pistols that double as weapon foci for HtH
and if your Str is six then by the recoil rules in CC you get one more point of compensation.
Let us know how he turns out.
Other than not likeing some silly movie the char looks good might I suggest the trademark longcoat as your improved reflexes geas.
Also even though it might seem munchkin and you look low on cash, you can get the engraving on your guns as Olricalcum and have pistols that double as weapon foci for HtH
and if your Str is six then by the recoil rules in CC you get one more point of compensation.Let us know how he turns out.
Where did the escrima come from? Escrime is stick fighting, usually paired sticks, small, about 18 inches long. I never saw them do that in the movie. They used swords, both real and bokken, practice swords.
It's being used to simulate his proficiency at rapidly beating the fuck out of multiple opponents with his pistols. In other words, it's being used to snag Multi-Strike. The other other alternative off the top of my head is Ninjutsu. If it bothers you, just pretend it says "Gun-Kata" instead of "Escrima." It's just a word.
And if you look, I did address the Edged Weapons earlier in the post.
And if you look, I did address the Edged Weapons earlier in the post.
Jsut curious -- how do you use a skill (knowledge, to boot) as a geas? Does it mean he has to be /doing/ the kata? What's to prevent the character from saying he ALWAYS is using it, and effectively make the geas irrelevant?
in any case, character looks cool - why Salavettes? It seemed like he used bursts more than FA -- and doesn't that take a complex action with the Salavette?
Starting with an initiated character- kinda cool; pretty much the only way to convey what hecan do, I suppose.
And as faras escrima -- great idea! From what very tiny bit of escrima I've seen, it seemed to really fit with the "beating the fsck out of" parts of the movie. =) Esp. since escrima (and other similar arts) tend to teach a lot of empty hand, knife, and stick techniques too (unless I am mixing it up with kali?)
in any case, character looks cool - why Salavettes? It seemed like he used bursts more than FA -- and doesn't that take a complex action with the Salavette?
Starting with an initiated character- kinda cool; pretty much the only way to convey what hecan do, I suppose.
And as faras escrima -- great idea! From what very tiny bit of escrima I've seen, it seemed to really fit with the "beating the fsck out of" parts of the movie. =) Esp. since escrima (and other similar arts) tend to teach a lot of empty hand, knife, and stick techniques too (unless I am mixing it up with kali?)
| QUOTE (BitBasher) |
| Where did the escrima come from? Escrime is stick fighting, usually paired sticks, small, about 18 inches long. I never saw them do that in the movie. They used swords, both real and bokken, practice swords. |
Actually, we trained with paired sticks, single stick, stick+knife, single knife, and paired knives. And almost ALL of the techniques we learned have open-hand counterparts. We also learned how to deal with armed opponents, specifically using your techniques to disarm/deal with people who have knives/swords/etc. In the movie, the most shining example of unarmed-fu is in the flashback scene when the cops come to take Preston's wife.
I was lucky enough to attend a Kali seminar (Omar Hakim) that was focused on training for law enforcement officers. We learned some techniques for being really nasty with handcuffs, and things like how to chamber a round in automatic with just one hand (in case your other hand is disabled or being controlled by a bad guy). A lot of this would play into the Gun-kata stuff in Equilibrium.
And yes, you are right about the swords...that part certainly doesn't mesh well with Escrima...the largest edged weapons we trained with were machetes. In fact, the sticks really started out as a training tool to represent the machete.
| QUOTE (gknoy @ Mar 31 2004, 04:26 AM) |
| Jsut curious -- how do you use a skill (knowledge, to boot) as a geas? Does it mean he has to be /doing/ the kata? What's to prevent the character from saying he ALWAYS is using it, and effectively make the geas irrelevant? |
Preston was certainly an effective combatant when not performing his Gun Katas, and I think that's reflected in the above character's unmodified stats (Pistol-Whipping 6, Savalette Guardian 7, Combat Pool 9, etc.). But when he focused himself and went into a trance, he opened up a huge can of whoopass. That's what it reflects. Basically, he has to be Centering, or at the very least meditating via Gun-Kata, in order to gain the use of his Improved Ability and Combat Sense powers.
| QUOTE |
| in any case, character looks cool - why Salavettes? It seemed like he used bursts more than FA -- and doesn't that take a complex action with the Salavette? |
The Savalette is a SA/BF* heavy pistol, and the only one outside of the Thunderbolt to be BF-capable. I guess I could use a Thunderbolt in its place (I don't remember him really ever shooting anything other than bursts now that I think about it), or maybe grabbing a Steyr TMP and just never using it in SA mode. In BF mode it still does 9S damage, but at least it would give him the option to go FA if e ever needed to. The total lack of recoil compensation seems like to would deter from the concept though.
I'm also trying to avoid creating any new rules for the character, too. So that means no new firearms or custom martial arts.
| QUOTE (TheOneRonin) |
| I was lucky enough to attend a Kali seminar (Omar Hakim) that was focused on training for law enforcement officers. We learned some techniques for being really nasty with handcuffs, and things like how to chamber a round in automatic with just one hand (in case your other hand is disabled or being controlled by a bad guy). A lot of this would play into the Gun-kata stuff in Equilibrium. |
I was going to put down Kali originally (it's all the same Martial Art in CC), but I thought Escrima would just be more recognizable and thus relay the reason I selected it better.
But yeah, in the movie, Preston and the other Clerics did demonstrate a high degree of proficiency in multiple martial arts. It's kind of hard to reflect that well with a limited amount of skill points, though. I figure if I really comes up, I can always just default from Edged Weapons to Clubs and still gain the same benefits, just with a +2 TN modifier (thus reflecting a lesser degree of proficiency over his pistol-whipping goodness). Same goes for using Shotguns, such as in the fantastic puppy scene, and Assault Rifles. With the latter, since he'd only be using one at a time as well as using a Smartlink (making up for the +2 penalty), he'd be just as proficient as he would be using twin pistols, too.
I'm also thinking about giving him a Spatial Recognizer (since he seemed to know where his opponents were at all times), and maybe going Alpha with all his implants and seeing if I can afford Enhanced Articulation on top of that. Not really sure what to do there since adding implants is purely a Shadowrun convention for the character.
| QUOTE (gknoy) |
| Jsut curious -- how do you use a skill (knowledge, to boot) as a geas? Does it mean he has to be /doing/ the kata? What's to prevent the character from saying he ALWAYS is using it, and effectively make the geas irrelevant? |
Centering, which can use a mental only Knowledge skill, is an acceptable geasa.
One thing i did notice was missing was his "interval". You did mention this wasn't nessasarily Preston, so perhaps this silly bugger hasn't stopped taking his dose? No idea how to handle that, just something i noticed.
I thought SL/2 did allow a the use of a second gun by hooking up a second induction pad? You still get twohanded pentalies of course. BTW mechanics wise how would the bitchslap/shootout mechanics work?
His "intervals" and the reprecussions thereof are being handled by his Bad Karma flaw. It's a bit generic, but it was mostly a roleplaying aspect of the character more than any mechanics-oriented thing.
To answer your last question, it would be resolved using the "Using a Firearm in Melee Combat" penalty, and I'd probably (even though we want to avoid using new rules) advocate allowing counterattacks to cancel successes with it just as in regular melee combat. Thus all the misses that occured.
[Edit] Ugh, I'm typing like a drunk today.
To answer your last question, it would be resolved using the "Using a Firearm in Melee Combat" penalty, and I'd probably (even though we want to avoid using new rules) advocate allowing counterattacks to cancel successes with it just as in regular melee combat. Thus all the misses that occured.
[Edit] Ugh, I'm typing like a drunk today.
Yeah, it's hard to duplicate Preston in SR as a sharting character in that regard because he was far from a starting character, he had a metric buttload of karma in my opinion.
The reason I was thinking of escrima only being sticks was my kenpo experience. sticks were escrima, hand to have was hand to hane and knife fighting was knife fighting. All the techniquest in the art could all be done either bare handed, or with one or two sticks or one or two knives. It was just a matter of perception. I don't identify escrima or kali as being anything other than the stick fighting, my bad.
The reason I was thinking of escrima only being sticks was my kenpo experience. sticks were escrima, hand to have was hand to hane and knife fighting was knife fighting. All the techniquest in the art could all be done either bare handed, or with one or two sticks or one or two knives. It was just a matter of perception. I don't identify escrima or kali as being anything other than the stick fighting, my bad.
there was a drug in one of the nigel findley books (shadowplay i believe) called dead head that killed your emotions. you could use that as the interval. also, besides roleplaying, do you think there'd be any in game effects to something like that. maybe Immunity:fear?
| QUOTE (fourstring_samurai) |
| there was a drug in one of the nigel findley books (shadowplay i believe) called dead head that killed your emotions. you could use that as the interval. also, besides roleplaying, do you think there'd be any in game effects to something like that. maybe Immunity:fear? |
Immunity could be a bit strong. Instead perhaps an extra die or two when resisting emotion Manipulation spells and powers (Fear, Control Emotions, etc.) and when opposing Social skill attempts (Initmidate, Negotiate)?
Immunity: poetry. Extremely useful when hanging out in one of those coffee-shops. ;D
I titally agree on Preston having a metric boatload of extra karma morethan most starting chracters; I think that's pretty handily represented by the multiple initiation levels their house rule allows; I'd hope that there's also some extra skills involved, too.
as for the centering/kata geas: I think you have a good point on one hand. Preston certainly did open up several cases of whuppass when doing the kata. I like the roleplaying restriction (even if I as a player would /hate/ to have it, I think it DOES reflect the character well). What my main question was, though, was - how do the mechanics work? Do you declare that you'll be Doing Ze Kata, and your GM makes you do some sort of kata test? Is there a down-side of doing the kata? (lack of movement? doesn't seem so -- often Preston stood in place, but take the shotgun scene for example -- that seemed to be very kata-like, in a sense.) Can you fail to do the gun-kata?
BTW, suggested knowledge skills:
- Psychology. Preston was freaky at his psychological and gut-level analyses of other people. You might consider upping his Intimidation as well. This has got to be useable as a complementary skill, I'm certain of it.
- Law enforcement, perhaps. Or perhaps "Cleric Code" -- knowledge of what the clerics are all about, etc..
Perhaps small unit tactics would be good too if you can spend even more active skill pts
I titally agree on Preston having a metric boatload of extra karma morethan most starting chracters; I think that's pretty handily represented by the multiple initiation levels their house rule allows; I'd hope that there's also some extra skills involved, too.
as for the centering/kata geas: I think you have a good point on one hand. Preston certainly did open up several cases of whuppass when doing the kata. I like the roleplaying restriction (even if I as a player would /hate/ to have it, I think it DOES reflect the character well). What my main question was, though, was - how do the mechanics work? Do you declare that you'll be Doing Ze Kata, and your GM makes you do some sort of kata test? Is there a down-side of doing the kata? (lack of movement? doesn't seem so -- often Preston stood in place, but take the shotgun scene for example -- that seemed to be very kata-like, in a sense.) Can you fail to do the gun-kata?
BTW, suggested knowledge skills:
- Psychology. Preston was freaky at his psychological and gut-level analyses of other people. You might consider upping his Intimidation as well. This has got to be useable as a complementary skill, I'm certain of it.
- Law enforcement, perhaps. Or perhaps "Cleric Code" -- knowledge of what the clerics are all about, etc..
Perhaps small unit tactics would be good too if you can spend even more active skill pts
I think it's fairly reasonable to say that nobody would be easily able to duplicate the Tetragrammaton's Gun Kata with a single SR Martial art - not without breaking the game...
There has been talk above of Escrima and Kali and various things, including the Clerics' use of bokken and katana, and whilst from our Shadowrun point of view this would point to a number of different skills, the original concept behind the Grammaton Clerics was their adoption of a unifying, singular martial art which, although it taught them to use any weapon at their disposal, focussed on the gun as the peak of human killing efficiency.
Much like Escrima matches its open hand and weapon movements to the point where theoretically they are the same (just with or without an extension), the Gun Kata uses the same principal - you have a gun or you don't. The theory is the same.
It also, as you said, teaches the use of the gun as a melee combat device (a logical assumption since they are designed for it with those little flick-out studs) and, although I have no basis to assume it other than my own musings, the Katana as the "epitome" of melee combat weaponry, especially apt since it seems to have some cultural significance for the citizens of Libria (carried as a ceremonial adornment).
Blah. Late. Enough spouting...
There has been talk above of Escrima and Kali and various things, including the Clerics' use of bokken and katana, and whilst from our Shadowrun point of view this would point to a number of different skills, the original concept behind the Grammaton Clerics was their adoption of a unifying, singular martial art which, although it taught them to use any weapon at their disposal, focussed on the gun as the peak of human killing efficiency.
Much like Escrima matches its open hand and weapon movements to the point where theoretically they are the same (just with or without an extension), the Gun Kata uses the same principal - you have a gun or you don't. The theory is the same.
It also, as you said, teaches the use of the gun as a melee combat device (a logical assumption since they are designed for it with those little flick-out studs) and, although I have no basis to assume it other than my own musings, the Katana as the "epitome" of melee combat weaponry, especially apt since it seems to have some cultural significance for the citizens of Libria (carried as a ceremonial adornment).
Blah. Late. Enough spouting...
| QUOTE (A Clockwork Lime) |
| Active Skills: Athletics 5, Centering (Gun-Kata) 6, Clubs 4(  (Pistol-Whipping 6[10]), Escrima 4, Etiquette 2, Intimidation 1 (Social 3), Pistols 5(9) (Savalette Guardian 7[11]), Stealth 5. Escrima Maneuvers: Multi-Strike, Multi-Strike: Clubs |
Not sure exactly what you did here but it doesn't look Canon. Am I missing something? You specialized 3 to three levels?
It's a little confusing, Solstice. The () numbers are the "improved ability" numbers. It's only one specialization. When I first saw it, I thought they were playing second edition
The brackets are the improved ability stacked on top of specialization. so he has pistols(Guardian)5(7) with four levels improved ability so it should read
Pistols(Guardian)5[9](7[11]) but hey, whats a typo among frineds?
Pistols(Guardian)5[9](7[11]) but hey, whats a typo among frineds?
Mostly what I would change would be to make the Gun-Kata its own martial art, which you said you were opposed to, and I would also give him a custom made heavy pistol with burst fire capability, and improved concealability. As for the Gun-Kata dodging ninja stuff, thats what you have combat pool for.
Biggest single problem with the character: Charisma. Preston had a ton of charisma. If you look at the way that he could read people, the way that everyone gave him room, and the way that he managed to lie to everyone fairly well. The only reason that he got busted in the end was because he got setup. Even then he managed fairly well to sneak a pair of heavy guns past security. He wasn't very bright though.
-Slapstick
Biggest single problem with the character: Charisma. Preston had a ton of charisma. If you look at the way that he could read people, the way that everyone gave him room, and the way that he managed to lie to everyone fairly well. The only reason that he got busted in the end was because he got setup. Even then he managed fairly well to sneak a pair of heavy guns past security. He wasn't very bright though.
-Slapstick
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