I've been searching for the range of one of these weapons and I'd like to know what people think. I'm not the first person to ask:


(from: Bola Launcher Capacity, Am I missing something?)

but the thread didn't give a clear answer. In an area with no cover for long distances (sand dunes, mounted on a UAV / flying drone) it could be a real nuisance if it had a long range and good visibility, but on the other hand I'd have thought a, ahem, less lethal weapon like that would have been designed for security & riot deterence and intended to be mounted on a drone to begin with.

Anyone got an answer ?

How about we do this Mythbusters style.

I'll hold it and shoot you at different ranges, and you tell me how much pain you're feeling at those ranges. We'll have it done in no time!

Let's go to the golf course, they have range numbers set up already!

what book is it in the only fichetti's i see are"

Tifani needler
Tiffani Self Defender

which both follow the hold out ranges of 0-5/6-15/16-30/31-50

Core book. Special Weapons.

It's a microwave beam, so I'd use Laser rules (Arsenal). The Pain Inducer looks like a two-hander, so that'd likely be Sporting Rifle ranges (based on the fact that the MP Laser 3 is 'large assault rifle'-sized). Assault rifle ranges would also be acceptable. I might also use the DV reductions for range, smoke, etc., which might require some tweaking given the Pain Inducer's special toxin-like effects. The laser weapons are balanced to include these, so if you didn't use these at all, it's probably best to use a much lower range template (SMG?).

We really need a range for Elemental Attack, too.

Well, that's infinite/LOS, like all magic. Which is its own problem.

Geek the mage, problem solved.

Now you have a new problem, rampaging free spirit.

it is Line of Sight, but range modifiers do apply. well it i did in 3rd ed. Well for Indirect Combat Spells, which are usually Elemental attacks.

so if you (or the spirit) casts from cover or while running or in melee combat, then you get those modifiers. (for the good or the bad)

I'm not sure that the spirit power is an Indirect, but yes. Ranged Combat mods apply, if not actual range mods.

Thanks Yerameyahu. I was thinking similar.

Is there an errata for SR4A that I could add this too? I did a search here on Dumpshock and found only http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?show...p=0&#entry0, and while there are some errata on at http://www.shadowrun4.com/game-resources/&...game-resources/, neither the SR4 to SR4A changes doc nor SR4 errata v1.8 doc mention the pain inducer.

So they're incomplete and either abandonned or shelved.

It really annoys me that there are rules in the main rule book printed last year and the errata documents are still this patchy. Or non existenent. I've still to find one SR4A errata doc (as opposed to the first release and revisions of SR4) in English. Even the one I found in French didn't have the word "fichetti" in it. - [url="www.black-book-editions.fr/contenu/file/122_sr4a_errata.pdf[/url]

*grumble*

I'd say SMG ranges. It looks boxy-ish, maybe large SMG size, but the thing to keep in mind is that it's not a powerful laser a-la Ares Redline or Ares Laser III; it's a microwave beam that's designed to be less-than-lethal. The beam would dissipate through heat dispersion much easier.

God I hate exotic weapons. A separate skill for a dart pistol? It is a freaking pistol, the rules just suck as a feeble attempt to balance really powerful items.

Shooting a paintball gun is a lot different than shooting a similar sized/styled firearm.

Anyone have experience with both actual tranq weapons (Pistols or Rifles) and firearms of similar type? Do they fire the same?

I don't find paintball guns to be that different to fire from real guns. Yeah there are differences, but not big enough to claim it is a totally different skill. I'd say there is just as much or more differences between a paintball gun and similar gun and a SMG or assault rifle, or heck even a revolver and pistol. Tranq guns being air powered probably fire a lot like BB guns which guess what fire a lot like real guns.

BBs and tranqs will tend to have a LOT more drop from gravity at longer ranges, plus in general they're a lot less accurate.





-k

Yeah that is really tough to adjust for, it would be like you had never picked up and shot something before. Seriously they are slight differences less than the differences in what a lot of skills carry. Long Arms covers shot guns and sniper rifles those fire differently as well. A separate skill to shoot paint balls doesn't make sense unless you want to break firearms down into 50 skills instead of 3.

Hmm. You've got a point. The pain inducer beam have the similar properties to a laser beam but the distinction is important.

Also, anyone go an opinion on whether [a] massively thick armor (or thermal insulation) would count as cover [b] the weapon would reflect off mirrors?

(Purely looking for input on a house rule. I'm think of a "Bruce Lee-esque hall of mirrors" for those who don't feel like resorting to smashing mirrors. Perhaps for a laser & pain inducer gun fight inside a giant orbital space telescope's optics chamber?)