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Paul
Another topic got me thinking-how bound do you feel to Canon, and Rules as Written? For instance in my own games i think we emulate the spirit of Shadowrun quite nicely. But if a rule or a part of the setting doesn't serve our needs we won't hesitate to change it. It's actually not a lot of rules changes on our part-however our setting has had several changes, most minor but a few major.

The major changes:

  • Cash. I get the arguments toward electronic currency, however it neither suits my tables needs nor our views of the Dystopian future. So at my table you can still get paid in cash.
  • The Wireless Matrix has been shifted, not eliminated but rather it's role has been mores specialized, and formatted to make what we see as a little more common sense. it's not something that really changes too much.


I can't think of any other serious changes we make.

What about at your table? How do you feel about changes to Canon or Rules as Written? How often do you do it?
NiL_FisK_Urd
If it collides with Common Sense, it gets houseruled or is plain ignored (like stupid scatter rules for missiles).
snowRaven
I'm doing less and less houseruling for each edition that comes out, which is a good sign (I think...)
CanRay
QUOTE (NiL_FisK_Urd @ Dec 20 2011, 06:05 PM) *
If it collides with Common Sense, it gets houseruled or is plain ignored (like stupid scatter rules for missiles).
You do realize that common sense is so uncommon that it's damned near a superpower by now, right?

*Looks at a knife in a kitchen supply store and reads "Danger: Sharp", and shakes head*
bibliophile20
QUOTE (CanRay @ Dec 20 2011, 07:24 PM) *
You do realize that common sense is so uncommon that it's damned near a superpower by now, right?

*Looks at a knife in a kitchen supply store and reads "Danger: Sharp", and shakes head*


I've seen "for indoor and outdoor use only" on Christmas lights, and "Attention: Some assembly required" on puzzle boxes...

Heh. I wonder how much of that crazy lawsuit-happy attitude that's at the root of those warnings has survived into the 2070s? Given that corporate suits can and will hire deniable assets to deal with annoying tort lawsuits for less than the cost of a settlement...
CanRay
Considering the people that do those kinds of lawsuits, it might be about the cost for a case of soy-beer.
Glyph
I think canon and RAW can both be house-ruled, or ditched, when they clash with verisimilitude or logic (in-game or not). With rules, I would ban some things (like empathy software) or house rule them (splitting dice pools for multicasting). With the setting, it is often easier to either find more plausible alternate explanations (people have done this with the formation of the NAN or Ghostwalker's invasion of Denver), or simply downplay that part of the setting (the Tir or JIS are out there, but don't ever really come up in the campaign. Note that they have recently done some things to fix both of these - I am using the earlier iterations of them for my example).
ravensmuse
I used to be all about the sanctity of in-game canon, and I still generally stick to that, but I've become more willing to change things up as they're needed.

Especially now that I'm running Denver and injecting my own takes on things; I'm not a huge fan of Nicholas Whitebird, so he's only just entering the campaign as Ghostwalker's Man Friday and nothing more. I've introduced my own kind of secret police for Ghostwalker (my players). Ghostwalker has different relationships with people, like a stronger relationship with Peri...Basically I'm only using Shadows of North America and the Missions supplement as background and ignoring Spy Games.

So yeah, thinking about it, I deviate a lot more (especially with my resistance to buying new CGL material) but I still try to stay somewhat true to written canon.
CanRay
I've outright stated a few things. I've mostly gone with an entirely electronic currency system, and my group doesn't mind it at all (They're all computer nerds, and see more and more places refuse cash for debit or credit card only.).

Hell, the new Canadian Hundreds would confuse the hell out of people south of the border. nyahnyah.gif They're Polymer now!

'Course, that won't change anything. You have so much as a Canadian penny in the lot and most US stores will refuse to sell to you. Even just across the border. dead.gif
ChewyGranola
That's funny, in Michigan I see Canadian coins all over the place. Every time I use one, I am not sure if I should be happy I got away with it or sad because I gave them more than the actual price (depends on exchange rates I guess)
Midas
I have a few house-rules for BP CharGen in order to alleviate the min-maxing tendencies of my players, but apart from that we pretty much stick to RAW. Oh, and I use a skill*2 (plus 1 per +3 of bonuses, round up) max for hits in order to increase the importance of skills vs attributes in the DP.

I also use the maxim "What is good for the goose is good for the gander" to help check players exploiting rules loopholes too much. Hence, we don't use the called shot mechanic in my games very much, for example ...
Ascalaphus
I'm not a fan of the love AIs get from the public..
thorya
Not at all. We like the setting and the rules (mostly), but we'll change things to keep the game fun in a heartbeat. Our last game was a steampunk alternate reality version of Europe (partially to avoid the matrix) and we tried using caliber rules rather than long lists of guns with slight variations in properties. We also have a lot of thresholds that are higher than 4 and a lot of equipment that is not standard, i.e. chloroform rags, plasma grenades, programming packages that contain many functions, counterspelling foci that can be bound to mundanes, anti-magic mines that are triggered when magic is used within a certain distance (force-distance in meters >= 1), etc.
Blade
I can still play and GM canon SR from time to time, but the more I GM (and the more CGL releases sub-par books), the more my Shadowrun strays from canon both in the rules and in the background.
snowRaven
QUOTE (thorya @ Dec 21 2011, 03:44 PM) *
Not at all. We like the setting and the rules (mostly), but we'll change things to keep the game fun in a heartbeat. Our last game was a steampunk alternate reality version of Europe (partially to avoid the matrix) and we tried using caliber rules rather than long lists of guns with slight variations in properties. We also have a lot of thresholds that are higher than 4 and a lot of equipment that is not standard, i.e. chloroform rags, plasma grenades, programming packages that contain many functions, counterspelling foci that can be bound to mundanes, anti-magic mines that are triggered when magic is used within a certain distance (force-distance in meters >= 1), etc.


Sounds like fun =)
Hida Tsuzua
My group has a polite indifference at best to the official fluff. Rulewise, we follow Missions rules since we play Mission games. Therefore, we closely follow RAW expect for stuff that isn't well covered and the matrix. For the former, we typically work some sort of guideline. For the latter, we go with how the mission writer uses the matrix.
CanRay
QUOTE (Ascalaphus @ Dec 21 2011, 10:09 AM) *
I'm not a fan of the love AIs get from the public..
That's just the sheeple. People in the know (like Clockwork) know what they're really like.

And don't forget that some AIs are downright monsters in and of themselves.
ShadowPavement
I usually don't change cannon at all. I find that I get my best ideas from figuring out how to work within the constraints of the SR cannon and that is helps more than hurts any creative process I bring to the table (so to speak).

As far as RAW goes, I only make changes or house-rules if there has been a demonstrated need for it at the table. The two examples from my own game have been Armor Layering and the Matrix.

Because my players don't do any armor layering, and aren't abusive of the rules to begin with, I decided that to reward them that I would get rid of the penalty for wearing armor in excess of their body score, as long as they only wear one piece of armor.

With the matrix in my game I don't bother with the rules for logging on and networks and stuff since all it did was slow down play. So all I use are the programs and the list of matrix actions and tests. That way I can keep all the matrix actions in real time with combat and let my wife pick any off-the-wall hacking actions she could come up with and then just pick which matrix action it fell under and roll for it.
3278
I don't give a shit about canon. I use what's good, and where that meets canon, great, but I feel no guilt when the two diverge. For the purposes of interacting with other groups, though, you still have to know it; it's like being British or Dutch: you speak your regional [village] dialect at home, but you still have to learn the national dialect.
Patrick Goodman
QUOTE (Paul @ Dec 20 2011, 03:51 PM) *
  • Cash. I get the arguments toward electronic currency, however it neither suits my tables needs nor our views of the Dystopian future. So at my table you can still get paid in cash.

Can't cite titles at the moment, but there are several examples of this in the fiction. It's not been emphasized properly, IMO, but yes, you can still get paid in nuyen notes, corp scrip, and a variety of national currencies. The notion of nothing but electronic currency just doesn't fly, IMO.
JanessaVR
The Awakening happened on December 21st, 2012, not December 24th, 2011.

Technomancers are verifiably Awakened - seriously, their abilities break the laws of physics just as much as magic does, and their abilities use very similar mechanics to those of magicians. Ergo, they are magicians - just "Type B" magicians.

Not sure if this technically counts as deviation from canon (these days), but Earthdawn was the past, and so the Horrors are coming eventually, so watch out...

Those are the biggest off the top of my head.
3278
QUOTE (Patrick Goodman @ Dec 21 2011, 08:18 PM) *
The notion of nothing but electronic currency just doesn't fly, IMO.

Out of curiosity, why not?
Warlordtheft
QUOTE (3278 @ Dec 21 2011, 04:27 PM) *
Out of curiosity, why not?


I am too. Pretty much we're already 1 step away from it. Do you really think if everybody drained every account and converted it to cash in the US there would be enough physical bills to cover it. Is there fraud? Sure, but not enough that prevent profits.
Paul
Part of society is one step away from it. The vast majority of the rest of the world is no where near it.
snowRaven
QUOTE (Patrick Goodman @ Dec 21 2011, 09:18 PM) *
Can't cite titles at the moment, but there are several examples of this in the fiction. It's not been emphasized properly, IMO, but yes, you can still get paid in nuyen notes, corp scrip, and a variety of national currencies. The notion of nothing but electronic currency just doesn't fly, IMO.


I agree in part:

Whenever there is something of value, people are bound to create representations of it that can be traded. Even with a society with nothing but electronic currency, people would likely still create some 'tokens of value' for trade, whether as basic as IOU's or in the form of hard-to-forge notes, scrip, bills, deeds, etc.

And yes, there's plenty of references to bills of various currencies, and corp scrip, all over shadowrun. Electronic currency may be a lot more common in 2070, but back in the 2050s there was a great deal of mention of physical currencies: UCAS using physical dollar bills, Tir Tairngire using their own bills, etc. Seattle was something of an 'odd man out' dealing mostly in electronic currency and corp scrip, with nuyen notes being rare.

I can't cite exact sources either, but a good bet would be NeoAnarchist's Guide to North America, NeoAnarchist's Guide to Real Life, Tir Tairngire, possibly the NAN books, Denver Boxed Set, London Sourcebook -- maybe even the old Seattle Sourcebook and the SR1 and SR2 main books.
CanRay
QUOTE (Patrick Goodman @ Dec 21 2011, 04:18 PM) *
Can't cite titles at the moment, but there are several examples of this in the fiction. It's not been emphasized properly, IMO, but yes, you can still get paid in nuyen notes, corp scrip, and a variety of national currencies. The notion of nothing but electronic currency just doesn't fly, IMO.
Yeah, older fiction. Pre-Crash 2.0. After Crash 2.0 and the usage of CommLinks and Displaying SINs everywhere, monitoring money as an electronic-form only was only another step.

Note that I only say that the Nuyen is Electronic only. I've had the group stuck with a briefcase of UCAS$1,000 Bills that they had to figure out how to launder into legal Nuyen. Mainly because paying for a Stuffer Shack Snack with a 200 equivalent bill just don't fly. nyahnyah.gif
Udoshi
QUOTE (JanessaVR @ Dec 21 2011, 02:12 PM) *
The Awakening happened on December 21st, 2012, not December 24th, 2011.

Technomancers are verifiably Awakened - seriously, their abilities break the laws of physics just as much as magic does, and their abilities use very similar mechanics to those of magicians. Ergo, they are magicians - just "Type B" magicians.

Not sure if this technically counts as deviation from canon (these days), but Earthdawn was the past, and so the Horrors are coming eventually, so watch out...


This is something that has come up in my game recently. The thought that the Matrix and the Resonance are a man-made metaplane, and the Technomancers are its Magicians - just on a slightly different wavelength than mana users.

In general, our GM likes manipulating and, in some cases, re-writing or tossing out cannon to suit his plots. Its actually working out rather well, because the things he pulls off are genuinely surprising and unexpected.

And yeah, the horrors have made their presence known, sadly.
rythymhack
QUOTE (Midas @ Dec 20 2011, 11:21 PM) *
I have a few house-rules for BP CharGen in order to alleviate the min-maxing tendencies of my players, but apart from that we pretty much stick to RAW. Oh, and I use a skill*2 (plus 1 per +3 of bonuses, round up) max for hits in order to increase the importance of skills vs attributes in the DP.

I also use the maxim "What is good for the goose is good for the gander" to help check players exploiting rules loopholes too much. Hence, we don't use the called shot mechanic in my games very much, for example ...


Not sure I understand the "+1 per +3 of bonuses" part. As a flat skill*2 cap things would get a WHOLE lot harrier. In regards to the increasing the importance of skill over stats...for body and str this is actually reversed. As it stands, someone with a str of 3 with a high agility and some decent skill (and maybe some cyber/magic) can use a knife to kill a troll (likely or not it IS possible...not a number cruncher). If one were to use skill*2 (not using the second part because I dont understand it...I am hoping this will help someone explain) the max # of hits you would be 14 (assuming aptitude). An average troll wearing an armor vest gets to resist with 12. It seems to me this would (in general) make the possibility of using a knife with a str of 3 to kill a troll a WHOLE lot less likely, upping the need for higher damage weapons (which then ups the need for a higher BOD...hence my including Bod and STR together in this topic). I am assuming the "+1 per +3 in bonuses" puts the possibility of "epic" back on the table (however at a reduced chance). Of course, all this means that the covert ops guys need to be even MORE covert =)

I could be way off since I have never played. Owned every edition but no play time...gotta work on that.
Snow_Fox
We follow the meta plots to some extenst but may adject the level of severity just to allow for our own world view. so for example although the Archology shut down, it only last about 6 weeks total menaing there was not such extensive damage but that also means the escape of the IA is more surprising, it had less time to plot.
stevebugge
I used to be pretty in to keeping Rules and Meta plot as written, as I've gotten older more employed and more constrained by time I've found that it's more in the interest of our gaming group to condense, simplify, and more often than not just wing it in the interest of most fun in time allowed. We're working on a Shadow-lite (less filling still tastes great) rule set and borrowing heavily from other systems to do it.
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