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Frag-o Delux
Friday we were running through a corn field being chased by guards. Well our teams troll was. I playing a shaman was keeping cover watching him while the rest of the team was trying to get into the corps facility. The troll was invisible but the guard just happen to have ultrasound. Well long story short the troll was hit by 3 grenades from the M22a2. Because I had sustained a barrier spell on him and he was wearing some good armor, coupled with the fact he is a troll nothing happened to him. Well the GM being frustrated that a troll took 3 grenades and about 30 rounds ammo, and didn't get a scratch. The GM wanted to at least ruin his armor for the next encounter. We were in the middle of the job. I being the master of the rules pointed him to the armor degradtion rules, but the problem is that it says the person has to take at least a moderate wound. But the troll took nothing. So what is your fix, am I reading the rule wrong and does it mean if he takes a moderate before adjustment he loses armor or does it mean after adjustment. Or do you have another idea. On a whim I cheked Rayguns website I couldn't find what he tought. Now before to say kill the mage, I was about a klick a way useing binoculars in the dark to see the whole thing. The facility had big ass lights illuminating the entire field. We have never played with the rule so we haven't decided what to do with it. I wanted the rule to work because our troll player always wants combat in every situation, so we are (the whole group) looking for a way to make it hurt him so he relises combat ins't the best way to go most times, but of course we don't need a wounded troll running around, who is going to carry his ass out of the corp.

On a different note, during the same encounter. Before the guards were disbatched they managed to call for help. Well help arrived in the form of 3 rotodrones. Well actually they didn't get there. I dropped the Barrier on the troll, and started to place the barriers in front of the drones. My theory is that since they are rotodrones that failed their crash test and impact test, they should have fallen to the ground in a pile of scrap. But since the charts say it only took a serious the GM kept them flying. They left us alone but I wanted them smoking junk. I argued that the props would have folded on impact and they would have burned, I told the GM I could see if it was a vector thrust or fixed wing, but a rotory wing is different.

Now I will abide by any rule set down by the GM, but he usually listens to our side and we go on. Not to get bogged down in a rules debate we decided before the next game we'll discuse these 2 encounters. But I am curious to what everyone else has done.
Austere Emancipator
Flexible body armor (ie anything that doesn't say it has something rigid inside in the description) shouldn't degrade (significantly) if the armor itself is not penetrated. Rigid armor, IRL, will degrade even if it isn't penetrated. Direct hits from grenades should degrade any armor, regardless of whether the guy inside takes damage or not.

I rule that all metal-based armor (mostly rigid armor suits, like Secure armor) degrade 1 point per 20 points of Power it gets hit by. All ceramic or similar armors (including most flexible armor with rigid plates inside), designed to only protect you from the first few hits, will degrade 1 point per 10 points of Power it gets hit by. Flexible body armor degrades 1 point per 10 points of Power that penetrates it.

I realize most people won't want such detailed accounts of armor degradation. You could, for example, just degrade all body armor by 1 point for every 10 points of Power that penetrates it. So if an Armored Vest With Plates (4/3) gets hit by a Barrett Model 121, it will immediately degrade to 3/2 (14-4=10). A Heavy Security Armor suit will never degrade when hit by standard or Explosive Light Pistol ammunition, but 10 EX-Explosive hits will degrade it to 6/4, the next 5 degrade it to 5/3, the next 4 to 4/2, and so on.

Or, if you wish for armor to degrade faster in general, you can rule that it is degraded 1 point by every 20 Power that hits it. Or you could rule that it is degraded 1 point by every (5xArmor) Power that hits it, or (3xArmor) Power that penetrates it, making light armor degrade faster than heavy armor. And you can change the numbers or multipliers how you like, to set the rate at which armor degrades.
Dog
I don't usually worry about armor degreadation. Usually characters have to ditch their armor due to blood stains, sewer stink and slash marks all over the outer shell before the armor value is compromised.
Icepick
QUOTE (Dog)
I don't usually worry about armor degreadation. Usually characters have to ditch their armor due to blood stains, sewer stink and slash marks all over the outer shell before the armor value is compromised.

That is one of the greatest things I've ever heard.

I don't really use realistic armor degredation rules. I use what I like to call the rule of 6. If I manage to actually roll 4 or more 6's in a row on a single die will cause armor degredation, even if I don't do any damage to you.

Oh, and yes, I've done it before.
Frag-o Delux
I usually dont worry about armor either. My characters change armor about as often as underware (which means a lot). The GM just needed a way to stop the rampaging troll now.
BitBasher
QUOTE
but the problem is that it says the person has to take at least a moderate wound


We just play it (and the way we interpreted it) that id the player is HIT with a moderate wound, not TAKES a moderate wound. The logic here is that if he does not dodge the attack, but soaks it then the armor took the brunt of the attack lowering the TN so it could be soaked, hence the degradation. Whether or not the attack ended up doing damage the PC or not, the armor got hit just as hard.
Buzzed
Question about Ablative Armor for cyberlimbs.

M&M pg. 36
"When struck by an attack with a Power greater than [3 x (points of ablative armor)], reduce the bonus to ballistic and impact armor to 1.

Ok so lets say a cybersam has 5 points of ablative armor in a cyberarm. He gets hit by a 16S attack from a sniper rifle. Fortunately, the sniper didn't make a called shot, so the armor comes into play. (rookies)

5 points of Ablative Armor gives 10 points ballistic and 10 points impact armor in the arm.

So after getting hit, will his armor bonus on the arm be 1 ballistic and 1 impact, or 5 ballistic and 5 impact?
Mr. Unpronounceable
QUOTE (Buzzed)
Fortunately, the sniper didn't make a called shot, so the armor comes into play. (rookies)

ohplease.gif Don't you hate it when rookies know the rules better?

Impact armor can only be bypassed for melee & chemical attacks...ballistic armor can never be bypassed without adding houserules.
Buzzed
QUOTE (Mr. Unpronounceable)
QUOTE (Buzzed @ Aug 24 2003, 07:02 PM)
Fortunately, the sniper didn't make a called shot, so the armor comes into play. (rookies)

ohplease.gif Don't you hate it when rookies know the rules better?

Impact armor can only be bypassed for melee & chemical attacks...ballistic armor can never be bypassed without adding houserules.

Unless its Body Plating. M&M states Body Plating values are counted for the particular hit location only when targeted via called shot.
Fortune
QUOTE (Buzzed @ Aug 24 2003, 04:48 PM)
Unless its Body Plating. M&M states Body Plating values are counted for the particular hit location only when targeted via called shot.

One could argue that that is true only in the context of allowable called shots, as Mr. Unpronounceable described.
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