Picked up Attitude at the suggestion of Dumpshock. Enjoyed it. Helped me build a more rounded and flavored character. Need to make a new character, going the infiltrator route this time.

The year of the game is 2070, and isn't street level, but it's not spec-ops either. Would Spygames be worth picking up to help flesh out ideas and gear? Or is it not really worth it?

It has lots of toys and options and I don't think any of them are time period specific. I looked at it as more of a catalogue of what spys have been using/are using rather than a SOTA list of spy gear. If you are making a former spy turned shadow runner, I think it is worth a look.

If you are looking for gear, SG just gives you headaches and duplicates of existing items (somebody should have checked the gear Chapter in the BBB first...). In terms of fluff you should be aware that it is 2/3 a Denver book and 1/3 general spycraft. Or rather "generalized spycraft", as most of the time it does not go deeper than "Turning someone requires you to determine their weaknesses and to exploit them. Most of the time you can manipulate someone with money, sex, or vices." Captain Obvious to the rescue...


The list of intelligence agencies in the back of the book is nice to have, though.

That's what I was afraid of. I guess they didn't have enough for a Denver book or an actual infiltrator book, so they slapped the two together. Disappointing, as I was looking to spend money =/

So spend the Money. I happen to really like Spy Games, personally. *shrug*

I couldn't give a rat's ass about Denver, so I'm disinclined to waste 2/3rds of my book value.

Ahhh... Gotcha. I live in Denver, so it is entertaining reading.

Glad you liked it. I'm out in Jersey, the most densely populated region in the country, and we've gotten jack shit written about us. Ah well.

Where's Jersey?

I think it's a suburb of New York.

I hate you.

I actually find the Spy Games book very hard to look through for information, & when you do finally find something, the information about it is often so limited its ridiculous, for instance, finding good details about the vision enhancements int he book is like pulling teeth from an alligator.

I thought it was a show about drunk Italian Americans with fake tans. Do you mean where was it filmed? It was filmed on the coast near New York the first season and then they moved to Miami and then Italy. Not sure where they filmed the last few Seasons.

I think that CanRay has it Right. Suburb of New York.

my view was similar, that it is focused heavily on Denver. If I were playing in Denver that would be great, but we don't so it has a limited value for my money

Yeah. And even with the fictional upgrade Shadowrun brings, I just can't see anyone in their right mind wanting to spend time in Colorado.

Denver, come for the smuggling, stay BECAUSE THE DRAGON TELLS YOU TO!

Haha, seriously. Colorado is like Canada lite, without any of the fun of Canada. AND A DRAGON.

You say that last bit like it's a bad thing....

*Comes running back from wikipedia* Colorado is a state? My god, my American geography is worse then I thought!
Turns out I also thought Denver was Dallas

Worse? Texas is bigger then 4-6 European countries put together. It's why the whole European concept of world travel is a crock of shit. You could drive through 3 European countries in the time it takes you to drive through one of our moderate sized states.

*Shakes Head* That is okay, we can do without you.

Weren't you the one who thought NJ was a suburb of NYC? lol. We're thankful you're out there, being a northern Texas wannabe state.

That's a very general statement, France is a whole lot bigger then say Poland or Hungary, at the same time pretty much all of the habited parts of Russia is part of Europe. What countries should be the standard format?

How about instead we phrase it "if Texas were in Europe, it would be the third largest country there." But, to specifically answer your question, anything with the land mass of Germany or less, you can add up any two of them and end up with something smaller than Texas.

There's an old saying that goes "In America, 100 years is a long time. In Europe, 100 miles is a long distance." It's -- like most old sayings -- an oversimplification, but not an entirely untrue one.

Quite obviously America is the World's standard.

More seriously though, the average size of a European country not counting Russia is 162,801 square kilometers.

Almost half the states in the US are larger then that (23 out of 50.)

NJ IS a Suburb of New York. That, or just a great place to put nuclear waste.
As for a Wannabe Texas State. No one can compete with Texas. I was so very sad that I had to leave there. Oh well.

It must be old as most of Europe doesn't use miles at all
...
Sorry I had to.

Isn't there 52 states nowadays?

Also... Size isn't everything America

Well... 50 States + Washington DC.

Ah I thought there was 50 before Hawaii...

Might be 51 if Puerto Rico gets its way.

48 that are neighboring each other + Hawaii + Alaska, Puerto Rico is trying to become a state as I hear, but not official.

I know someone in PR. He tells me the island is about split even on joining the union or just leaving to become their own country.

As for the book Spy Games, I found it interesting. But then, I find most books that expand beyond the little world of Seattle interesting.

That can be forgiven because you're not American. For example, I have no idea where the major cities are in Germany except... in Germany.


Texas is larger than France. Florida is 65,000 miles square, which is about 15% larger than England (50,000 mi^2).

EDIT:
Has been trying to for years, and Puerto Rico has also been voting against it. They're conflicted about Stateshood, but can't get a majority to petition for it.

Also, don't forget America's other territories, including Guam, the United States Virgin Islands, Commonwealth of the Northern Mariana Islands, and American Samoa, among others (Specifically, Classification of current U.S. Territories).

Yeah yeah yeah, keep whining, Canadian Provinces still rule size-wise.

Hell, when it comes to size alone, don't screw with the Territories!

As entertaining as the last couple of posts have been, please get back to topic.

Not entirely true, a number of old novels describe New Jersey (part of the New York/New Jersey sprawl) fairly in detail. The Nyx Smyth stuff - Striper Assassin, Steel Rain, Into the Night and, uh, his other book. Night's Pawn and Nosferatu 2055, and the old Celtic Doublcross adventure also have info on that area, IIRC. Some more detail is given in the equally ancient 2nd Edition North America book, but that's extremely Manhattan centered. The 4E "New York" writeup, of course, woefully ignores the fact that the boroughs of NYC other than Manhattan, let alone New Jersey, even exist. I have copied that into my own little semi sourcebook, but unfortunately I did so several years ago, and it's all in German.


You realise half of the 2/3 Denver book is actualy a London book, right? Which is much more interessting than a Denver book, anyway. The Denver book part is rather redundant at times, too. I find the S3 Missions writeup of Denver more useful, myself.


Depends entirely what you mean by 'Europe' and which countries. Former Yogoslavia, BeNeLux? Sure. Ukraine? Not quite. Generally, Europe's far more compressed than America, though. Everything in America that is not New Jersey is basically made of wilderness with occasional settlement.