since i am runinng it again, just curious as to what works for other people. i am thinking of using the point system (with 114 pints allowing up to 6 points of flaws). i am going to allow weres and vamps (after i modify them to make them playable pc options). a few of my potential players are bitching and moaning. they want at least 130 points. the thing is, by having fewer points available for creation it forces one to specialize rather than generalize. it enhances the experience, making it more enjoyable, my 2 cents anyways. once i finish the were and vamp stats i will post them and you can comment/flame as you wish.

I like low-power. I tend to play standard priorities straight from the book but I like the way Becks works... Also, in terms of style, I play a 'you set off any alarm, you better hope you get to the exit before Lonestar' kinda game.

Meh. High power, low power; whatever. I like to play. As long as everyone uses the same system I don't have much preference. I like the flexiblity in the BP and BECks systems but Priority and Sum to Ten are cool, too.

I give PCs 123 BP, 6 edges/flaws (unless they want ambidexterity [8]), allowing any extra edges to be converted into BP, up to 2.
I follow the availability rules, allowing one item at avail. 12, or to begin the game with a custom firearm.

All though I have taken many flames for my way of doing things, I perfer to start off small and work your way up to becoming king of the sprawl. Perhaps I have been to influenced by the work of Blackjack, who did have this to say on the matter.

130 bps? jeebus.

I have run a 140bp game in the past, but I also streched the costs of high-end resources and magic up a bit. The idea was to give a bonus to, thus encourage, non-awakeded and non-cyberjunkies. Can't really say it did much. Everyone was still either cybered or magical .

I ran a 500 point game once where you made a character with 125 points then you got 500 karma to spend, or you could trade in one karma for 100,000 nuyen. If you got cyber you had to pay for your surgeries. I had like 5 years worth of rolls to determine if permanent wounds were inflicted, new contacts aquired, or old ones died or improved.

The game lasted like 4 sessions.

I generally tend for mid to low end games, with a slower rate of advancement (and the rate of advancement is inversely proportional to the power they start out with). Right now I'm co-GMing with someone who gave out 30 karma for food fight and supernova (from First Run), and I just don't know what to do with myself.

It's an online game, so he bases it off of the number of IC posts as well. He does have more rules for training, which keeps people from going crazy, but I'm going to have to increase the cash rewards to keep the sams from becoming obsolete.

We'll see how it turns out : ) It's certainly new for me, but he seems to like a high powered game, so...

30 karma for Food Fight and Supernova? Ok...sounds like an awfully generous guy...seeing as I think I remember Food Fight being recommended as between 2-3 karma and Supernova as somewhere in the grey area of 4-7 karma...

But hey, whatever works...I'm sure any mage in the party is overjoyed at the prospect of nearly being able to initiate twice after just two runs. ^_~


When it comes to character creation, I personally feel that Sum-to-Ten is the most balanced, but Priority works if the player really wants to use it. I'm leery of the Point-Build system, because from experience I have seen players abuse it, especially if they're playing a human street-sam or other non-awakened type characters. If I'm GMing a game, I'll allow a player to use a point-build character, but I'll use a lot more scrutiny when reviewing the character.

As for Becks, that system just plain perplexes me. O_o Compared to the other systems I have yet to find why someone would want to use it to make a beginning character. Then again I've also yet to encounter a player who used Becks, so I really don't worry about it.

As for when it comes to game play, the only thing I really look for is that the priority of the GM is to make sure the players are having a good time. I really have a hard time playing in a campaign where the GM puts a priority on rule-mongering over the enjoyment of the game. I've been a part of some really challenging, yet really FUN runs; I've also been on some really easy, yet fun missions. The key was that the GM made sure that arguments over the rules were settled quickly and fairly. I've also been into some really not-fun runs where more time was spent arguing over meaningless trivia than actually playing the game. I remember one run that could have concievably been finished in the several hours that we spent together, but instead we barely even got halfway through it because we wasted so much time over stuff that really had no bearing on the run at all. That's the kind of thing that turns me off to a campaign.

wow, 30... I got like 5 when I played that.

Anyway, most of my games are 125 with 6 edg/fl. and 8 av. I do enjoy the challenge of making characters at 115 or less. Making 80 pt. street gangers is fun. I do want to know how much B.P. a vampire might cost. With all the edges they get (plus some edges/flaws being GM discretion), it is tough to figure a cost.

On BeCKS and creation:
Recently, I've been requested to put a PC into retirement and bring out another one. That's OK, I wanted to bring someone new in anyway and correct some of the mistakes I'd made last time around. I opted for a PhysAd Magician, and put some serious time into number crunching.

Buildpoints, BeCKS, priority. Went through them all, and in the end determined that BeCKS was by far the most unbalanced system with 425kp. I was able to absolutely create a monster with that by pumping all my stats up, then throwing the remainder into skills. Don't really need money, but I was still able to give myself one helll of an efficently min/maxed warrior.

The BP system I just didn't like at all, I didn't really fully explore it because I figured I'd be directed to priority system and knew that I could abuse BeCKS to generate a wonderfully diverse, unstoppable character.

-shrug- It may be the simplest, most boring, and looked down upon generation system but the Priority Sytem works and generates characters who have a fair number of skills and stats, but nothing severely lopsided. Not that it doesn't have its flaws (you can go mighty far with a 1M), but overall its fair.

But hey, that's just me.

I suppose i'm just used to the 120-123 bp range. I don't even know what i'd do with 130 or 140. Lessee....

60: Attributes, 25: Adept, 10: Elf, 5 or 10: Resources. That leaves 35 or 40 bps for skills. Plus edges and flaws. Wow.

Well, yes, 140 points is significantly more. 130 is less so.

And no, I've never run a 256 point game. I may have to someday. Either that or a 64-pointer.

~J

I can attest that a 90 point game makes for a great way to bring non-shadowrunner characters into the shadows. We had a lot of fun with that group of characters.

I suppose you choose the system that works for you (as a GM) and tell the players what kind of character you would like. My current group could get a group discount for all the cream filling that goes in some characters but if you say 'No', they tend to play by the rules.

When they don't, just write a sheet for them. Of course, my wife an I have some advantages over the average GM. The GM is God, this is true. We have greater deity status for having the sessions in our house every week, then upgraded to super-amazing-one-true-god-of-gaming because we sell roleplay books and stuff.

Damnit. I'm still but a Greater Deity.

When you control their dice supply (and the trickle of obscure rare books) they are the puppets that dance to your malevolent tune.

But seriously, any player who will not at least give your ideas a try (ideas like 'how about having more than two points in non-combat skills?') needs to be taken out and introduced to a two-by-four's various cranial applications.

I've had characters with two points or under in combat skills. Makes an interesting change.

~J

I've played one character whose only combat skill was Pistols 2. He owned a Remington Roomsweeper, but usually only carried it when he wasn't expecting trouble. He had it for self-defense from casual street riff-raff, but figured that if he were going up against professionals, he didn't stand a chance if it turned into a gunfight, anyway, and if he weren't carrying, he a) wouldn't be tempted to start a gunfight he couldn't win, and b) might be able to talk his way out of situations that he wouldn't be able to if he were found to be armed. You get really creative about coming up with alternate solutions when you know that you're screwed if it comes to a fight.

I had another one who had no actual combat skills at all, but I'm not sure she counts, because she was a sorceress, and did have a quite high Sorcery. She didn't have any proper combat spells, either, but she did have a couple of very nasty elemental manipulations. She picked up a Viper somewhere along the line, but never actually fired it. She used it primarily for intimidation purposes... unlike a Lightning Bolt, a flechette pistol doesn't usually require a demonstration before whoever you have it pointed at will believe that it's really dangerous.

Then try a 32-pointer.

~J

Yet another great thing about BeCKS: Because of the way it scales, you can create meaningful human beings with as little as ~100 Karma, less than 25% of the intended amount. Scaling the power level of a campaign is a whole lot simpler that way.