To all you GM's out there. Had an interesting question posed and it got me thinking as well. Spell design specifically states... no time travel and no teleportation... which makes anything else pretty much legal. So, could one create a Bag of Holding? If so, what requirements would you assign to designing the spell? What drawback would you give to the spell?

Myself, I was thinking the spell designer would need to have at least rating 8 in physics to have a competent crasp in diemensional theory. I was also thinking that the "pocket diemension" created would be on some metaplane. If the spell was ever cancelled or destroyed, the items end up on that random metaplane (I've heard of trying to find a credstick in a haystack, but that's ridiculous).

Thoughts, comments, flame throwers?

Is it possible to transfer anything physical onto a metaplane? My understanding is that a physical thing is stuck on the physical plane, and it cannot be transported to any other, no matter what.

Better go with a "Make Small" Sustainable spell.

Let me rephrase: Is there any existing rules mechanic for transporting anything physical to any other plane than the physical one?

Some spirits and immortals have the power to transport anyone, including mundanes and their gear, to the metaplanes.

So metaplanes have a physical existance, then? That's what I'm having trouble with. I've always considered the SR metaplanes as an extension of the astral plane -- completely unlike the D&D Outer Planes that are not inherently different from the Prime Material Plane.

If metaplanes are physical, then exactly what happens to the astral form of a mage when it hits a metaplane? Does it solidify into a physical form with gear decided much the same way as in Matrix (the movie)? If astral projections do not solidify, but physical people can still access them with their physical gear, then metaplanes really are like totally weird, man.

Think about it this way:

The physical plane IS a metaplane...we just don't see it that way, because we're from it. Do you think a fire elemental considers their home a "meta"plane?

That's just my theory, though.

Your idea, then, is that the astrally projected form of a mage from the physical plane (the Human Plane or HP, if you will) acts on metaplanes just like a spirit works on HP? In other words, a mage who astrally projects and enters a metaplane can then Materialize and have physical attributes on that metaplane determined by something other than the physical attributes of their physical form?

That's not a bad idea, but it'd be great if there was something in canon to support this. Some example of trudging around metaplanes after having your physical form thrown there (as per the power mentioned by A Clockwork LIme), or even just traveling a metaplane as an astrally projected mage in a context other than Astral Quests, in MitS or some other book.

The metaplanes are exactly that. They're "pockets" of the astral plane that have their own physical laws and rules. While you may be able to physically travel there, you still "transform" to their laws when you arrive. That's exactly what happens in Harlequinn's Back on each different metaplane. I think Survival of the Fittest has a similar entry. The laws are so dominant, in fact, that you can find yourself in possession of completely new skills, implants, and/or abilities while there.

Think of summoning a spirit of the physical world. They can enter our world "astrally" and are still astral entities even while materialized... but at no point are they physical beings just because they're in our world.

In the dragon heart saga I read about Harlequinn transporting things into the astral and metaplanes, but it too him a ritual and hours to prepare. To say that Jo anymage could do the same thing instantly with a bag and a spell just seems wrong.

A Bag of Holding... brings memories when I was a kid and we played the original D... ahem, the other game. How about this spell:

Floating Disc

Type: Physical
T#: 6
Drain: +1 M

This spell creates a hemisphere-shaped "disc" of force that can be used to move things around. The radius of the disc is 10 cm * Magic rating of the caster. The disc can carry 25 kg's of stuff per Force. The disc has Barrier Rating equal to half the spells Force, rounded down, if attacked or otherwise damaged. It can be moved with a Complex Action by the caster, at a movement rate equal to Force * casters Magic Rating.


Any comments and critisism is welcome.

The best part about the D&D bag of holding is the intrinsic risk of piercing it and blowing a whole in space and time. Any kind of bag of holding in SR should have the same drawback, which would mean it would qualify as a weapon of mass destruction. So of course the government would be all over. Not only that, instead of making it a spell, I'd probably make it some kind of artifact requiring an enchanting ritual.

I wouldn't allow Astral Pockets for the rest of the world just yet just... but the accidents that would happen while developing the spell would almost make it worth while...

"Where's my arm! I can still feel it, but it's gone! I can move my fingers... It feels like something's... something's eating my arm! Ahh! Get it off me get it off---" <Whooosh>

"Um... Where'd the mage go?"

We've always played that some free spirits with "Astral Gateway" are capable of placing physical objects onto the metaplane, close up the gateway, and then open it up again later to retrieve the objects. We once found one with this ability using it for smuggling.

A very powerful free spirit we encountered once physically placed a player character onto the metaplane for "storage", and recovered him later. Obviously that spirit had never read what the chrome-domed people at MIT&T say are the limits to the Astral Gateway Power (MitS.117), as it acted with complete disregard for such limitations. When next we encountered the player character, he was chained in a liquid bath of some sort, having his "hide" softened in preparation for use in taxidermy.

In ED there was an ability to store item in an astral 'pocket' of sorts - this isn't too hard to translate into SR rules, and there's been lengthy discussion previously on these forums regarding it.

Personally, I've made it a metamagic called Storing, but I haven't got the exact details worked out yet.

There is also much precedence in ED for moving a physical person and their gear entirely to the astral plane, or a metaplane for that matter. It seems to involve a certain risk, however, since such astral travellers in ED could be summoned by other mages as spirits, and be forced to perform services...

I made it easy for myself an made it another metamagic, called Shifting, which allows the magician to bodily transport herself onto the astral plane. (I can't seem to find my notes on that one right now, though - bummer) Basically it involves nasty drain and movement limited to your physical movement.

One of the spells I came up with a while back is called Ghost. It adds Multi-Sense to the Improved Illusion spell, making it +1(S), but now you are silent and have no smell.

I would say no. (Remember, I never played ED). Only things with Aura can go on the astral(magicians and focii).

However, there is the exception of the Place of Battle on an Astral Quest. You can bring mundanes(who DO have auras) and their gear. IIRC, you need a spirit to do that, however.

I would say it is beyond a normal metahuman to do that, then. As for the example of Parlainth and the others, you have to remember that the level of magic was MUCH higher and even then it was difficult and dangerous.

Once again, it's canonical for complete characters and their gear to delve into the metaplanes. It's not an Earthdawn thing. It occurs in runs like Harlequinn's Back and Survival of the Fittest. Just like you basically stated, though it's not limited to "places of battle."

Man, I need to get some more adventures, then. How did they get onto the astral in those two, Lime?

Read awakened lands. "Astral constructs" are the term for items (obviously pre-industrial all of them) that are astrally solid, have no physical component, and have no enchantments on them. They assense as completely mundane objects, but are completely on the astral.

Thanks, folks.

Just thinking of how this could be abused is making me giggle uncontrollably.

GM: "The Lonestar officers search you thoroughly and remove all your gear. They also deactivate all your combat-capable cyberware such as spurs and oral guns. The team is now locked in a jail cell."
Street Samurai: "I reach into my Fingertip compartment of holding and pull out an AK-98 and 200 grenades."
Decker: "I open up my hollow kneecap of holding and pull out a set of lockpicks and 5 kilos of high explosive."
Rigger: "I open up my cyberleg of holding and a steel lynx drone + my spare VCD comes out. Then I open up the Steel Lynx's cargo compartment of holding, it has 5000CF of storage in which I've placed 2 other Steel Lynxes, 3 Stratos-9s, and 10,000 rounds of assorted ammo."
GM: "I'm gonna have to find us a new game."