I went through the spell list and set availability ratings.

I also put some Forbidden/Restricted in there, but I didn't look at those too closely.

I did this because some spells are so clearly superior to others that there is no reason for a player character not to take them. The fact that, by RAW, Mindprobe is just as easy to get as Healthy Glow is a problem.

You'll find that I placed extremely high availability on most of the invasive mind magic. It's my opinion that these are the most powerful spells in the game. If you run your game anything like I run mine - they simply are the best spells in the game.

You'll also find that I placed high availability on Stun/Power/Mana Bolt/Ball. Frankly, I did this because I'm tired of these spells. I don't think I've ever had a PC not take at least one of them, so I made it so that you would need to take Restricted Gear to get them.

To grab the xlsx file go to https://mega.co.nz/#!FkkTXDpY!J_vtn...hmrZ0Dffgh8gnEQ

You do realize that all Combat Spells and Mind Magics are already Forbidden, and the rest are Restricted, Yes?

Probably just looking at SR4a, page 348 & the availability of spell formulas. Only the Combat spells are listed as Forbidden, and there's no listed distinction about Mind Magics there.

Could be I am mistaken, Which has been known to happen.
However, Mages are required to Register themselves as such, so that alone moves all their spells into at least the Restricted zone (in many parts of the world, anyways), for the most part.

I think the idea is to make these spells nearly impossible to get.

Nothing is impossible to get (as long as it is available, at whatever insane level of availability). If you can't find it, you just research it yourself (Takes time, admittedly). *shrug*

Tymeaus, you are correct in that all spell formulas are either forbidden (Combat) or else restricted (all the rest). See pg 348 of SR4A.
I don't really see the need for this change. Spells are the bread and butter of a magician and by making them harder to get, you are taking those tools away. I'd suggest just asking your players to either flat out not take the spells you have issue with or else ask them to wait until later in the game to get them rather than starting out. As GM this is part of the job, to make sure the game is going to play the way you would like.

Yep. Part of this idea was to make writing your own spells a legitimate pursuit.




By assigning availability to spells, I have enforced my will as the GM onto the game. Players who wish to take these spells can still get them, either at the cost of taking Restricted Gear for them, or at the cost of writing the spell themselves. I'm not taking those tools away. I am making them appropriately difficult to acquire. Mages in SR4a aren't hurting for power. They simply get much more interesting and creative when you make them take something other than the standard spells.

I have to disagree with the motivation, here. These spells are MEANT to be common. It's rather clear in the design that there's more or less meant to be a general set of spells for the general case PC Mage to take - a direct combat spell, Heal, Increase Reflexes, and probably a couple of others that are slipping my mind right now. In a big way, it's part of why the limitation on chargen spells matters in the first place.

I agree with RHat here. And the only real way writing your own spells can be legitimate is to find some way to lower those intervals or else run your game in such a way that they only get a job every few months. It's the same with writing your own software or enchanting items. The intervals are so long that no one is likely to take those things up as pursuits unless they absolutely have to.
Let me turn this around a bit and ask if your NPCs are also going to be limited this way. Are they going to be without stunball or stunbolt? If so, I guess this means there is no sense in trying for a capture type of scenario.
Limiting the PCs and NPCs to what basically amounts to the more lethal spells means you end up with a more lethal game. If you are fine with that, fly to it, but for my own games I'll be leaving things exactly as they are.

"general case PC mage" Ew. What a horribly boring idea.



People have their runners doing missions every day? Really? I mean, I get that some runs may last into weeks or months without any real opportunity for a break - but shadowrunners are not 40 hour per week 52 weeks per year kind of workers.

The term "general case", here, refers not to a complete character but a general notion of certain situations or sets thereof being common enough to design around.

Especially when one may have to have some down time for a week or a month or more to improve a skill, skill group, or other such time consuming objectives the players may want their characters to pursue.

Never said you were doing a job every day or suggested anything close to that. With intervals measured at 3 months, you'll likely need 6 months or more to finish a single spell. That is a hell of a long time to commit to something in SR, even if you break it up with jobs in between. Seems an awful long time to go between getting spells. It also means you aren't training or anything else during this downtime. What is the samurai up to during all this? Improving several skill groups? He has that much karma free?
It is far more likely you will want to buy spells just like any other gear and save the 'make your own' antics for special ones you can't get any other way. By making all the typical spells special ones you force your players into a situation where they either use sub-optimal spells or else end up committing a bunch of karma and time to a skill (Arcana) they would otherwise ignore for the most part. Do you force your samurai to get armourer at high levels and increase the intervals on weapon mods to compensate?
My objection to these kind of changes is that it singles out a specific character and penalizes them for being good at what they do. It would bother me less if you hit everyone the same way and bump up the intervals on weapon and vehicle mods, force hackers to code all their own software, that sort of thing, rather than picking out the magicians for special treatment.

The only spells one might feel compelled to actually get Arcana in order to write are the ridiculously overpowered mind control and mind reading spells. Do streetsamurai have an equivalent to these? No. They have nothing that will even come close to these. Your entire argument is invalid. Sorry.

Funny, we do not seem to have any of the problems with the Mental Manipulation Spells that you apparently do. Do you use things like background count, wards and spell detection devices?

So you didn't place a high availability on spells like stun bolt? Your first post says you did and if I were playing a magician and I knew there were spells like that out there why wouldn't I try to get them? You would not be writing your own spells just for the 'overpowered' mind control spells. I don't find those spells to be over powered anyway. As Tymeaus points out, things like BGC and wards are there to help you as GM keep your magicians in check.
As for Samurai having equivalent abilities, that was not my point. Armourer is the skill equivalent for samurai as arcana is to magicians. You use it to customize your gear, guns and armour in the case of samurai and spells in the case of magicians. So, do you also advocate making it harder for the samurai (or hacker or rigger) to get the tools for their job? If not this is just the usual squash the magicians rules change.
If you are going to apply something that so affects the core of one character type you should consider doing it to all characters unless your goal is to make magicians a less attractive option. If the problem is spell casters running rampant over your opposition, try using their tactics against them or using things like BGC or talking to your players and explaining the problem.
The availability changes aren't going to prevent a determined player from getting what they want and may end up encouraging other less desirable behaviour.

I use them all. They're all of limited use, though. It doesn't matter if an individual detects a spell when you have captured their mind and control their thoughts. It would matter if they had any friends around, sure.

Mind reading and mind control spells are over powered. Period.



Did you not look at the file? I put stunbolt at Availability 13. Mindprobe on the other hand is 26. That's a big difference. Stunbolt is still totally attainable through contacts or restricted gear. Mindprobe would get you the attention of the CIA or Tir Ghosts if you started putting out feelers to find it.

Sorry, once again, your analogy to Armourer is a red herring. It has no relation to this at all. Armourer is NOT a skill equivalent to Arcana. The end product of those two things is nothing even remotely similar.

See, I disagree with you on that one. 's okay though.
The fact that you know you have a spell on you grants you additional spell resistance tests. Very HIGHLY of use, in my opinion. *shrug*
Mind reading is easily avoidable by breaking LOS. If you have been captured, Mind Probe is no different than torture at that point, and it will still ONLY get you what the TARGET understands is valid. If he has imperfect information, then so will you. *shrug* As for the Control Spells, they have a very short duration, that can easily be degraded by knowing you are the target of a spell, as I indicated.