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FuelDrop
Did you know is a thread where we showcase facts of the shadowrun universe caused by the rules. smile.gif

For instance:
Did you know that an Ares Roadmaster can survive a fall of up to 13 meters unscathed, though the passengers are another story?
Jack VII
Did you know that an average person (Intuition 3) has a tough time spotting another average person (Perception Threshold: 2, p. 136)
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Jack VII @ Sep 26 2013, 11:03 PM) *
Did you know that an average person (Intuition 3) has a tough time spotting another average person (Perception Threshold: 2, p. 136)


Not really... Since Obvious things are Obvious and do not require any roll at all. smile.gif
Epicedion
Of course studies show that the average person, if asked to do a simple counting task while watching a video, won't notice a man in a gorilla suit walk slowly through the frame.
DireRadiant
QUOTE (Jack VII @ Sep 27 2013, 12:03 AM) *
Did you know that an average person (Intuition 3) has a tough time spotting another average person (Perception Threshold: 2, p. 136)


Ah, this is the whole PC can't see themselves in the mirror so they think they got Infected?
Jack VII
Did you know it is as easy to shoot a troll at 50 meters as it is to shoot a Shiawase Kanmushi microdrone at 50 meters?
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Epicedion @ Sep 27 2013, 09:07 AM) *
Of course studies show that the average person, if asked to do a simple counting task while watching a video, won't notice a man in a gorilla suit walk slowly through the frame.


For the vast majority, that is absolutley true. And entertaining to watch. smile.gif
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Jack VII @ Sep 27 2013, 11:43 AM) *
Did you know it is as easy to shoot a troll at 50 meters as it is to shoot a Shiawase Kanmushi microdrone at 50 meters?


Only if you don't take size into account. smile.gif
Jack VII
QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ Sep 27 2013, 12:39 PM) *
Only if you don't take size into account. smile.gif

Where is that modifier listed? (Serious question, I think the current situation is a little crazy)
Sendaz
QUOTE (Jack VII @ Sep 27 2013, 12:43 PM) *
Did you know it is as easy to shoot a troll at 50 meters as it is to shoot a Shiawase Kanmushi microdrone at 50 meters?

Yes, but I would sooner shoot out the microdrone.

One hit and it's down.

Unless using suitably heavy firepower, shooting the troll just gives away your position to said troll who will happily come over and discuss the error of poor target selection.
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Jack VII @ Sep 27 2013, 12:53 PM) *
Where is that modifier listed? (Serious question, I think the current situation is a little crazy)


Arsenal, page 161. There is a table with modifiers listed, smile.gif
ElFenrir
I'm guessing we're talking SR5 Core Book, RAW, not SR4 or any other older edition, or borrowing old rules for new editions, by the look of the thread. wink.gif
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (ElFenrir @ Sep 27 2013, 01:10 PM) *
I'm guessing we're talking SR5 Core Book, RAW, not SR4 or any other older edition, or borrowing old rules for new editions, by the look of the thread. wink.gif


Ooops... Indeed we are, missed the tag.
bannockburn
Did you know it's perfectly possible to easily disarm an opponent with a shotgun on wide choke without injuring them in any way whatsoever?
FuelDrop
QUOTE (bannockburn @ Sep 28 2013, 07:37 AM) *
Did you know it's perfectly possible to easily disarm an opponent with a shotgun on wide choke without injuring them in any way whatsoever?

Did you know you can disarm 3 people in one shot with a shotgun on wide choke without injuring them in any way whatsoever?

The expression on their faces is priceless.
Epicedion
QUOTE (FuelDrop @ Sep 27 2013, 07:46 PM) *
Did you know you can disarm 3 people in one shot with a shotgun on wide choke without injuring them in any way whatsoever?

The expression on their faces is priceless.


Negative. Medium and wide spread can't be used with called shot. Says so right at the end of the description of each.
FuelDrop
QUOTE (Epicedion @ Sep 28 2013, 10:10 AM) *
Negative. Medium and wide spread can't be used with called shot. Says so right at the end of the description of each.

Drat. Back to the drawing board!
Isath
Did you know that the average Person will still need one success one a roll of two dice, to notice the next person or say... a neon sign, a running crowd, yelling or gunfire... well, something obvious,large or loud.

While I would rule, that the obvious should not need a roll... the Threshold for it still is one (1)...
FuelDrop
QUOTE (Isath @ Sep 28 2013, 11:20 AM) *
Did you know that the average Person will still need one success one a roll of two dice, to notice the next person or say... a neon sign, a running crowd, yelling or gunfire... well, something obvious,large or loud.

While I would rule, that the obvious should not need a roll... the Threshold for it still is one (1)...

Sounds like RL. I have met people at work who LITERALLY DID NOT NOTICE THE BUILDING THEY WERE LOOKING FOR while standing right in front of it. Oh, and the building was a store with big neon signs all over it.

Let's be honest. Most people tend to coast through the daily grind with as little effort as possible, so epic fails at noticing something obvious aren't out of the question.
Isath
Sure... but I allways though of things like that, as glitches... and sometimes critical ones.
FuelDrop
QUOTE (Isath @ Sep 28 2013, 11:31 AM) *
Sure... but I allways though of things like that, as glitches... and sometimes critical ones.

My day job is collecting shopping trolleys for a supermarket (for now. I'm working on getting my book published, but that's another story). We get people who've lost their cars a couple of times per day. Fair enough. About 1/3 of these people will describe their car as being a completely different colour, brand, or type to what it eventually turns out to be (In one instance a white hatchback was described as a red SUV).

2 dice sounds about right for most people's casual perception, going up to 5 when they're specifically searching for something.
thorya
QUOTE (FuelDrop @ Sep 27 2013, 11:44 PM) *
My day job is collecting shopping trolleys for a supermarket (for now. I'm working on getting my book published, but that's another story). We get people who've lost their cars a couple of times per day. Fair enough. About 1/3 of these people will describe their car as being a completely different colour, brand, or type to what it eventually turns out to be (In one instance a white hatchback was described as a red SUV).

2 dice sounds about right for most people's casual perception, going up to 5 when they're specifically searching for something.


That's not failing a perception check, that's failing a memory check (still Log + Int I think?). I do that if I've taken my wife's car sometimes. I come out thinking I'm looking for my car and can't find it, but usually I see her car and it jogs my memory (must have gotten a chance to reroll because I succeeded on a perception check).
Isath
Again I agree... What you say, is more about general awareness and beyond the question, if you notice something obvious though. It does however, give a fine example, of why the intuition of a character is important for device security.
SpellBinder
Only if a device is completely unattended does it use only its Device Rating for Matrix defense tests.

Simply having your gun (Device Rating 2) in your worn holster means it gets to use your [likely higher] Intuition or Willpower; you need not do anything else.
Jaid
QUOTE (SpellBinder @ Sep 27 2013, 11:46 PM) *
Only if a device is completely unattended does it use only its Device Rating for Matrix defense tests.

Simply having your gun (Device Rating 2) in your worn holster means it gets to use your [likely higher] Intuition or Willpower; you need not do anything else.


in contrast, owning a rating 7 commlink that you never use means it is forced to use your (likely lower) intuition or willpower. because merely owning a device is sufficient to instantly link it up with your mind and erode it's superior security software.
FuelDrop
QUOTE (Jaid @ Sep 28 2013, 01:04 PM) *
in contrast, owning a rating 7 commlink that you never use means it is forced to use your (likely lower) intuition or willpower. because merely owning a device is sufficient to instantly link it up with your mind and erode it's superior security software.

The term you are looking for is 'nut behind the wheel'. There are all sorts of things an average user might do to weaken their own defenses:
look up p0rn on dodgy sites,
answer spam e-mail,
password negligence,
installing a Norton product...

That said, merely owning the device shouldn't compromise it.
Jaid
QUOTE (FuelDrop @ Sep 28 2013, 01:13 AM) *
The term you are looking for is 'nut behind the wheel'. There are all sorts of things an average user might do to weaken their own defenses:
look up p0rn on dodgy sites,
answer spam e-mail,
password negligence,
installing a Norton product...

That said, merely owning the device shouldn't compromise it.


according to the rules, you have to go to some pretty extreme lengths to own something and not replace your own stats for the device rating. merely having *access* to the device means it uses your stats.
thorya
Does this mean that all corporate devices, etc. are set to the lowest common denominator?

i.e. because a corp employes 1 person with an intuition of 1, any devices they have access to/were the last to use, are super easy to hack?
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (thorya @ Sep 28 2013, 09:11 AM) *
Does this mean that all corporate devices, etc. are set to the lowest common denominator?

i.e. because a corp employes 1 person with an intuition of 1, any devices they have access to/were the last to use, are super easy to hack?


By the rules, at least, that sounds right. *shrug*
Angelone
QUOTE (thorya @ Sep 28 2013, 11:11 AM) *
Does this mean that all corporate devices, etc. are set to the lowest common denominator?

i.e. because a corp employes 1 person with an intuition of 1, any devices they have access to/were the last to use, are super easy to hack?


Dark Helmet: So the combination is... one, two, three, four, five? That's the stupidest combination I've ever heard in my life! That's the kind of thing an idiot would have on his luggage!
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Angelone @ Sep 28 2013, 12:48 PM) *
Dark Helmet: So the combination is... one, two, three, four, five? That's the stupidest combination I've ever heard in my life! That's the kind of thing an idiot would have on his luggage!


Note to Self: Change the combination on my Luggage.
Jaid
well, it uses the attributes of the owner. which leads back to a question from another thread: what or who is the owner of corporate devices? it can't be the corporation itself per se, it has to be some designated matrix-capable thing that the corporation owns.

unfortunately, from what i recall, there was a lot of discussion, and the conclusion was that you just have to house rule it.
SpellBinder
The Yamaha Growler is actually slower by 50% when on a smooth level driving surface than it is off it.
Shemhazai
Did you know that casting a direct combat spell with Spellcasting 6, Magic 6 and no negative modifiers against someone with Body/Willpower 3 has an expected damage of 3?
Voran
Would the average person have difficulty finding a child with a poor stealth score playing hide and seek, because they no longer fall under 'obvious'?
Tymeaus Jalynsfein
QUOTE (Shemhazai @ Sep 29 2013, 02:46 AM) *
Did you know that casting a direct combat spell with Spellcasting 6, Magic 6 and no negative modifiers against someone with Body/Willpower 3 has an expected damage of 3?


Sad, isn't it?
FuelDrop
QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ Sep 29 2013, 11:32 PM) *
Sad, isn't it?

yeah, except that casting the same spell on a troll tank who can no-sell an assault cannon will do about the same. The spells have gone from 'I win' against everything to niche spells, I admit that, but the fact that they ignore most defenses IS useful.
Voran
So spells have become 'cherry tapping'?
FuelDrop
QUOTE (Voran @ Sep 30 2013, 02:42 PM) *
So spells have become 'cherry tapping'?

Indirect spells are still doing as much damage as ever, and can punch through armour pretty well, but if you want to actually kill something you should get a gun. Combat magic is best for taking out ITNW, seriously heavy armour, that sort of thing. Lets face it, Street-sams being better at killing stuff than mages isn't really a problem.

At worst, you have to summon a spirit to fight for you.
Shemhazai
Did you know that casting a Clout spell with Force 6, Spellcasting 6, Magic 6 against a troll with Reaction 3, Intuition 3, Body 6, Urban Explorer Jumpsuit (9) and a helmet (+2) (and a point of dermal armor (+1) (total armor 12) has an expected damage of 4 stun?

12 dice to cast = 4 hits, 6 dice to dodge = 2 hits for 2 net hits = DV 8S AP -6
6 + 12 - 6 = 12 dice to resist = 4 hits = 4S damage

Doing that with Lightning Bolt against a real troll tank with Body 8, Full Body Armor (15) and a Full Helmet (+3) (and +1 dermal) for a total of 19 armor has an expected damage of 1P, -5 Initiative Score, and -1 to all actions and Defense Tests (but not Damage Resistance Tests) for 1 Combat Turn.

DV 8P AP -6
8 + 19 - 6 = 21 dice to resist = 7 hits = 1P damage
Slithery D
At least it makes the huger nerf to Counterspelling kind of irrelevant. Higher initiative is now a better way to beat Counterspelling than higher spellcasting/Magic.

SpellBinder
QUOTE (Slithery D @ Sep 30 2013, 07:10 AM) *
At least it makes the huger nerf to Counterspelling kind of irrelevant. Higher initiative is now a better way to beat Counterspelling than higher spellcasting/Magic.
Small bits of lead at supersonic speeds have always been a great way to beat Counterspelling. nyahnyah.gif
BlackJaw
QUOTE (Jaid @ Sep 28 2013, 11:12 PM) *
well, it uses the attributes of the owner. which leads back to a question from another thread: what or who is the owner of corporate devices? it can't be the corporation itself per se, it has to be some designated matrix-capable thing that the corporation owns.

unfortunately, from what i recall, there was a lot of discussion, and the conclusion was that you just have to house rule it.


Security Spiders are often considered the owner of corp devices. If the device really has no owner, then it uses it's device rating.

Page 360: "Since spiders are considered the owners or administrators of a system, they can command any of the devices in that system without having to gain any marks, since they already have the owner mark for all devices. They have the authority to launch or shut down IC, raise or cancel alarms, or even perform an emergency shutdown of the entire system. "

Page 2387: "When a defense test calls for a Mental attribute, use the owner’s rating. Even if she isn’t currently defending or even interacting with the device, her previous interactions and settings affect the defense test. If a device is completely unattended, the Device Rating stands in for any Mental attributes an icon needs but doesn’t have. For example, a device that an owner sets and forgets, like a door lock, uses its Device Rating in place of Intuition as part of the defense pool against a Control Device action."
BlackJaw
Did You Know...

Any wage slave can put protection on their files, but once they do, they can never access them again? There is no way to gain access to a protected file short of cracking the protection, which only a hacker (decker or technomancer) can do via an illegal action.

That the "matrix hates you" so much that the Host a wage slave works in fights him even when he just wants to spell check a report he has legitimate access to? Editing a file is an opposed roll vs the host to even just edit a paragraph of text.

Any wage slave can attempt to disable a databomb, but only hackers can set one? Setting a Databomb is a sleaze action, but disarming one is a Firewall action.

Setting protection on a file has nothing to do with Encryption? The encryption cyberprogram enhances firewall which is not the attribute used to set protection on a file. Similarly, the Decryption cyberprogram improves attack, which is not used to crack protection.

Satellite Up-links don't help get you on the matrix in isolated locations? They cap distance related noise penalties at -5, but do nothing to reduce the static zone penalty. You can just as easily connect to a matrix host in the middle of a -5 static zone (p231: "Remote place with satellite access only") with the sat dish as you can without it.

A Eurocar Westwind 3000 (sports car) being rigged by a person with a rating 1 Control Rig is able to break the sound barrier? If you get a control rig at rating 3 and use the 20% boost from Gearhead you can push it to over 4,580 mph, which more than Mach 6! A GMC Banshee can do better than Mach 12.
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