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CoyoteNZ
I'm the drone guy. I've got the little nuggets all over the place sneaking around before the team makes contact.

I can draw a map and relay this information to my team, I can keep track of moving targets and relay this, and I can monitor escape routes are still viable.

But I want to add dice. I'm sure I've read it in one of the books somewhere, but I can't remember where, is there any way of me adding dice to my team mates attacks, it tell g their smart links where a target is they can't see or aiding them in any other way dice wise?

As I said, sure I've seen it, but I've got a lot of books and I can't remember where frown.gif


CoyoteNZ
Thanee
Dunno. Maybe something like the TacNet from SR4? smile.gif

Bye
Thanee
Backgammon
Technically, the extra information should allow you to do Surprise Tests with your team members being sitting in ambush (+6 dice). You can essentially repeatedly lure them into ambushes.

You could also slap some automatic weapons on your drones and spray Suppressive Fire from above. That's gonna ruin someone's day fast.

SR4 had a generic rule that, at the GM's discretion, if a team had superior information, the GM could could grant +1 to +3 dice for all actions. That isn't in SR5 (that I remember) but your GM might allow it. Then again if he does, I also expect you're drones are gonna start getting knocked out of the sky on a pretty regular basis.

Careful what you wish for smile.gif
CoyoteNZ
QUOTE (Thanee @ Jun 22 2016, 06:50 AM) *
Dunno. Maybe something like the TacNet from SR4? smile.gif

Bye
Thanee


There is a new version of TacNet in one of the books. Can't find it now, I have two many books; but from memory it cost a fortune frown.gif
CoyoteNZ
QUOTE (Backgammon @ Jun 22 2016, 07:46 AM) *
You could also slap some automatic weapons on your drones and spray Suppressive Fire from above. That's gonna ruin someone's day fast.


One of my drones did that. Poor thing is smoke and ash now frown.gif
Mantis
QUOTE (CoyoteNZ @ Jun 21 2016, 03:08 PM) *
There is a new version of TacNet in one of the books. Can't find it now, I have two many books; but from memory it cost a fortune frown.gif

The stupidly over priced PTAC is in Run & Gun on pgs 104 -105. I have no idea how the SR4 Tacnet went from 3000 a rating point to half a million and up in SR5. It's like who ever was pricing things decided to do it in Pesos or something. Most of the prices seem too high by a factor of 10.
JanessaVR
QUOTE (Mantis @ Jun 21 2016, 06:56 PM) *
The stupidly over priced PTAC is in Run & Gun on pgs 104 -105. I have no idea how the SR4 Tacnet went from 3000 a rating point to half a million and up in SR5. It's like who ever was pricing things decided to do it in Pesos or something. Most of the prices seem too high by a factor of 10.

You guys just keep supplying more and more reasons justifying my sticking with 4e.
Mantis
QUOTE (JanessaVR @ Jun 21 2016, 09:59 PM) *
You guys just keep supplying more and more reasons justifying my sticking with 4e.

Oh you don't need more reasons. The ones you have are enough. We tried it for a while and it ended up being the almost edition. That is, you could almost make the character you want, but not really. You could almost do all the same things you could in 4th, but not really. You could almost play the game with just the core book, but not really. So many good ideas in there with terrible execution. I'm sure those who are fans of 5th will disagree and good on them but for me and my group it was a failure. This 'revamp' of the tac-net is just one of many examples why.
Sendaz
QUOTE (Mantis @ Jun 21 2016, 09:56 PM) *
The stupidly over priced PTAC is in Run & Gun on pgs 104 -105. I have no idea how the SR4 Tacnet went from 3000 a rating point to half a million and up in SR5. It's like who ever was pricing things decided to do it in Pesos or something. Most of the prices seem too high by a factor of 10.

Actually I always suspected they thought it was $3000 and converted it to (nu)yen which would jump it up to 313216 yen and then added a bit on top for 2070 inflation/converting to nuyen. biggrin.gif
Thanee
QUOTE (JanessaVR @ Jun 22 2016, 07:59 AM) *
You guys just keep supplying more and more reasons justifying my sticking with 4e.


Yeah, SR5 surely has some issues. Pricing is strange in many places (cyberware is too expensive, also).

But there are quite a lot of good ideas in there as well. smile.gif

Bye
Thanee
KCKitsune
The things I hate about 5th edition is that they got rid of the half Essence rule for cyber/bioware, the wireless rules are completely insane, and the cost of a deck is so ludicrous that NO hacker would ever be able to get a good one.

If they made rules for building your own deck then I could see how Deckers would work, but if you want to be a Decker, you pretty much are just a Decker. In 4th edition you could be a Decker and Street Sammy. Hell, if you wanted to, you could be a Decker/Support Mage (Heal/Fix/Fashion/Makeover). With Chummer4, I made a number of characters and the Decker/Mage was not half bad. His skills in a firefight sucked badly, but he could deck well and could heal up teammates. The Decker/Sammy build was good in a Firefight AND in cyberspace.
Backgammon
QUOTE (Mantis @ Jun 21 2016, 09:56 PM) *
The stupidly over priced PTAC is in Run & Gun on pgs 104 -105. I have no idea how the SR4 Tacnet went from 3000 a rating point to half a million and up in SR5. It's like who ever was pricing things decided to do it in Pesos or something. Most of the prices seem too high by a factor of 10.


The costs were Errata'd. They are still quite high, but... less quite high.

P. 105, ADJUSTMENTS IN PERSONAL
INTEGRATED TACTICAL NETWORK COSTS
Costs are changed as follows:
Level I: Avail 12R, cost 115,000
Level II: Avail 18R, cost 325,000
Level III: Avail 18F, cost 855,000
KCKitsune
QUOTE (Backgammon @ Jun 22 2016, 08:47 AM) *
The costs were Errata'd. They are still quite high, but... less quite high.

P. 105, ADJUSTMENTS IN PERSONAL
INTEGRATED TACTICAL NETWORK COSTS
Costs are changed as follows:
Level I: Avail 12R, cost 115,000
Level II: Avail 18R, cost 325,000
Level III: Avail 18F, cost 855,000


"Quite High"? How about "Completely fragging insane"! You can get a level 3 PITW or a Level 3 Deltaware Synaptic Booster and 135,000 nuyen.gif extra to spend on other things like Fake SINS, or you can get a Fairlight Excaliber cyberdeck... implanted (Delta grade for giggles), a Delta grade datajack, and a Ford Americar, and still have 7,000 nuyen.gif to play around with.
Mantis
QUOTE (Sendaz @ Jun 22 2016, 12:26 AM)
Actually I always suspected they thought it was $3000 and converted it to (nu)yen which would jump it up to 313216 yen and then added a bit on top for 2070 inflation/converting to nuyen. biggrin.gif

That is at once the saddest and yet most likely explanation I've seen yet. It would explain so much.

QUOTE (KCKitsune @ Jun 22 2016, 07:54 AM) *
"Quite High"? How about "Completely fragging insane"! You can get a level 3 PITW or a Level 3 Deltaware Synaptic Booster and 135,000 nuyen.gif extra to spend on other things like Fake SINS, or you can get a Fairlight Excaliber cyberdeck... implanted (Delta grade for giggles), a Delta grade datajack, and a Ford Americar, and still have 7,000 nuyen.gif to play around with.

No kidding. Funny thing is that in 4th ed they talk about high school sports teams using tac-nets to aid in play strategy. So these things would be pretty damn common. And along comes 5th ed with the PTAC. Nope, not common anymore. No non-professional sports team is going to use this. Hell, even some of the poorer pro teams won't use it because they can't afford it. Yet it gets included as stuff shadowrunners would use except, as you point out, you can get much more useful gear for less money.
JanessaVR
QUOTE (Mantis @ Jun 21 2016, 11:33 PM) *
Oh, you don't need more reasons. The ones you have are enough.

LOL! I am so tempted to add this to my signature...
Aaron
Teamwork Tests?
Mantis
QUOTE (JanessaVR @ Jun 22 2016, 10:51 AM) *
LOL! I am so tempted to add this to my signature...

Feel free. smile.gif
Mantis
QUOTE (Aaron @ Jun 22 2016, 11:05 AM) *
Teamwork Tests?

Aaron are you trying to help the OP? Why would you do that when we were all setting off on a nice tangent? Tangents are fun. nyahnyah.gif
KCKitsune
QUOTE (Mantis @ Jun 22 2016, 01:34 PM) *
No kidding. Funny thing is that in 4th ed they talk about high school sports teams using tac-nets to aid in play strategy. So these things would be pretty damn common. And along comes 5th ed with the PTAC. Nope, not common anymore. No non-professional sports team is going to use this. Hell, even some of the poorer pro teams won't use it because they can't afford it. Yet it gets included as stuff shadowrunners would use except, as you point out, you can get much more useful gear for less money.

The ONLY way I see 'Runners using this is if they pirate it. I, as a player, would never waste that much money for software that gives some nice bonuses, but honestly not THAT nice. There are way too many better things to blow your cash on.
CoyoteNZ
QUOTE (Backgammon @ Jun 23 2016, 01:47 AM) *
The costs were Errata'd.


Ok, that is really annoying.

What is the point of me buying all these darn PDF's if I still have to keep looking up errata!

Update the darn PDF's guys!

/rant over
Medicineman
It's CGL
What did you expect ?
Free Customer Service ?
Pah

Hough!
Medicineman
Thanee
QUOTE (CoyoteNZ @ Jun 23 2016, 04:04 AM) *
Ok, that is really annoying.
What is the point of me buying all these darn PDF's if I still have to keep looking up errata!
Update the darn PDF's guys!


It should happen, eventually. In SR4A, all the PDFs got updated with errata as well.

Bye
Thanee
Mantis
QUOTE (Thanee @ Jun 22 2016, 11:38 PM) *
It should happen, eventually. In SR4A, all the PDFs got updated with errata as well.

Bye
Thanee

Sort of. They also got unerrataed when they added the correct page numbers to Arsenal. Quality control is not Catalyst's strong suit.
Bodak
I would think the biggest advantage to having "the little nuggets all over the place" is Information Guided Fire (from Arsenal) if that still exists in SR5. Get the latest position of enemy units' positions and when they're clustered, soften them up with artillery / RPG before entering the building yourselves (as an emergency response team just passing by). The microdrones can seek refuge in wall cavities at the last minute. Or if big guns are out, simply knowing exactly where and when to fire through the ceiling / wall to ruin their day offsets their home advantage.

In SR4 at least you could use Optimised hardware (from Unwired) to get a +1 dice to rolls (getting the benefit of a virtual Rating 5 tacnet for +500Y). So there might be similar beneficial options in the SR5 books, located just as distantly.

QUOTE (Mantis @ Jun 22 2016, 02:56 AM) *
The stupidly over priced PTAC is in Run & Gun on pgs 104 -105. I have no idea how the SR4 Tacnet went from 3000 a rating point to half a million and up in SR5.
While you're doing the comparison, keep things in perspective with the considerable investment required to run a Battletac System in SR3. SR4 had it (too) easy.
KCKitsune
QUOTE (Bodak @ Jun 25 2016, 10:30 PM) *
While you're doing the comparison, keep things in perspective with the considerable investment required to run a Battletac System in SR3. SR4 had it (too) easy.

Bodak, it's software. There is no hardware you have to buy with the system. If there was hardware you had to buy to get it working then I can see the cost, but software... please NOTHING is that expensive in the software world.
Bodak
QUOTE (KCKitsune @ Jun 26 2016, 03:41 AM) *
QUOTE (Bodak @ Jun 26 2016, 03:30 AM) *
keep things in perspective with the considerable investment required to run a Battletac System in SR3.
Bodak, it's software. There is no hardware you have to buy with the system. If there was hardware you had to buy to get it working then I can see the cost,
Indeed, it is hardware. Implanted cyberware, plus an external Tactical Computer, which required a specific Skill to use:
QUOTE (nezumi @ Mar 27 2010, 12:11 PM) *
1) Battletac components are outside of the availability range of most runners. Since you need a TON of components, this means you really need to know someone to get one.
2) Tactical components really only shine if you've invested 6 skill points in the Small Units Tactics skill, and you have enough members in your group.

Really it's a specialty piece of gear made for squads. If you're running a merc campaign, or see a LOT of combat, it may pay out. Otherwise, you're looking at one squad leader spending an action each turn to boost everyone's initiative by a few points, and he gets a bonus to combat pool, all for about 2 essence + $500k. I can think of a lot of better things to spend that sort of change on.

Now if you're tricky, convince your GM to run on the 2nd edition version wink.gif
See what I mean now?

SR2 had it powerful
SR3 had it costly
SR4 had it powerful
SR5 had it costly
Mantis
QUOTE (Bodak @ Jun 25 2016, 09:17 PM) *
SR2 had it powerful
SR3 had it costly
SR4 had it powerful
SR5 had it costly

I see a trend here. Maybe in SR6 we can it get balanced. I wouldn't think it would be that hard a thing to do. Just don't overdo things in one direction or the other.
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