Hello all,
Following my last game of SR, we had some debate going on, on the usage of the Shapechange spell.
First, can you shapechange (or "critter" form) to a human ?
I've seen a few dicussions going on the web on the fact that you could shift to human, but not to meta, and only if you're not a human yet ...
Basically, seems like it's possible to shift to human, but with some limitations according to some GMs ...
Is there any official rulling on that ?
If it's possible to shift into a human, can you take someone's appearance ? If so, what's the point of the mask spell ? (except if you have good physical attributes in the first place)
If not, then what do you look like ?

As mask doesnt let you change radically your appearance (a dwarf can't look like a human, a human can't look like a troll etc ...) it's in a lot of cases of very limited value. At the same time, if shapechange is limitless, the value of mask is even more pointless.
Was there any official ruling on this ?

It all boils down to whether you consider humans, or metahumans, to be "critters". I would say no, myself. If your GM says yes, then that would make shapechange pretty much the default disguise spell as well as the default combat buffing spell (due to the Attribute boost). Note that clothing and gear are not affected - a scrawny human transforming to a hulking ork might rip his shirt and find his tighty whities constricting him like a vice. There have been developers/freelancers, etc. chiming in on this issue, but no official eratta.

The issue is that if you can't shapechange into a human, there is no way to change appearance with a spell when you're not human/elf/ork, as Mask will let you change into something similar in shape or size.
The question is arising for a Pixie, to "masquarade" as a human for social interraction. In the end, there is no way to do that if Shapechange can't be used to transform into a human.
The point would be the same for a Troll or a dwarf.
In my opinion, Mask is very restrictive in what it can do, while shapechange if allowed to shift to human raises much more questions.

But seeing what magic is able to do, it would be wierd there is no way to appear human when you're big or small.

Talk with your GM about creating (either outright fiat "yes this spell exists and you can know/learn it" or "sure your character can research creating that spell") a custom spell that'll do what you need it to.

This was the solution we chose at our table.

We could research a Limited Manipulation Spell (that was Sustained) that could change you into a Specific Metatype (appearance of your choosing) and you could assign net hits at 1 attribute point per net hits (rather than 1 attribute point to all base physical attributes per net hit as some read it - crazy; so not as good an exchange rate as the Shapechange Spell). This weas a physical Change, not an illusion. You still had to satisfy the Body requirements of Shapechange (for initial targeting). So if you were an average human (Body3) wanting to shift to a Troll, your Troll was Body 5 (Very Baseline for a troll, though you could add your bonus attributes to Body as normal for shapechange). And yes, sizing of clothing/armor was an issue, good reason to hav other spells to alter such things.

So...

Spell: [Metyatype] Form

It was a good investment for certain chartacters... My Mage had 5 versions of that particular spell. was a very good spell.

The errata of Street Grimoire clarified that it was +1 to one attribute per net hit.

It makes illusions such as Physical Mask so useless it's not even funny: you can do much more, you don't even have to care about resistance from other people or even sensors, and you get to boost your stats. Only vulnerability would be astral perception but then, so do all spells.
Seems completely broken.

And before you compare it to Shapechange, take into account that you just can't interact with anyone while it's taking effect (or not in any meaningful way at least).

+1 over the "base critter Physical Attribute". Assuming you consider metahumans to be critters, their baselines would be those listed on p. 66 of the BBB, i.e. all ones for humans. Furthermore, the base Body of the target form (again, 1 for humans) can only be 2 away from the caster's BOD. So not exactly free lunch, it would only work at all if your mage has Body <=3 and to actually get a stat boost, you need quite a few net hits or the mage has to be a clumsy pushover.

My personal interpretation: Shapechange lets you shift into a random member of a (sub-)species, including Homo Sapiens X, but not into a concrete specimen. The result might not even be the same for two applications of the spell on the same target.

True for the attributes.
Still, you get a cheap spell (drain of F-3) that has at least the huge advantage of not being resisted by anything. And let's be honest, even with something like four successes, a mage is not likely to loose much, even for a human base. To say nothing of other meta-types. And four successes is not exactly difficult to get, even at chargen.

Body 3, you could become anything, for example a troll. Let's say you have 4 successes, you could have Body 5, Agility 3, Reaction 3 and Strength 5. Odds are you just increased at least two of your four physical stats. Plus of course no one can recognize you and it's impossible to see through the spell (since it's a manipulation spell and not an illusion one). All of this for a single spell with a drain of F-3?

I still think it's completely broken and shouldn't be allowed.

Since the spell currently is not in any of the books, it is not quite the free lunch you seem to think it is.

At our table, each Metatype required a spell, so Troll Form, Human Form, Satyr Form, etc. Not exactly cheap (an Adept could get there far easier with the Shapechanging Adept Abilities). If you cannot buy them for your Tradition (since it is a custom spell) then you have to create them, which takes time, and then you spend 5 karma each on the ones that you want. To cover the Base Book Races, that is 25 Karma, not counting any others you might want along the way. So, not especially cheap. They still have to be sustained, so you have a spell active that is detectable from Astral unless you have the capability to hide such thinbgs (which requires 2 Initiate Grades Minimum (Masking and Extended Masking) and must be of a Forece less than or equal to your Magic for the Metamagic to hide it). In the end, MOST players would never buy such a spell selection unless they are singly dedicated to increasing their spell selections for versatility.

I'm pretty sure that Shapechange is not supposed to allow anything but actual, mundane critters (i.e. animals).

Humans (and metahumans) are no critters.

The first sentence ("... though the subject retains human consiousness.") strongly implies that human =/= critter.

Also: "Consult the Critters section ..." -- do you see any humans/metahumans there?


As for the pixie not being able to pose as a human... *shrug* So, pixies have some disadvantages, too? Seems absolutely fine to me.

Bye
Thanee

Well, it would have to be all 3s for humans (average attributes), but as above... they are not in the Critter section (they would have all 3s, though, if they were there).

Bye
Thanee

Which is why you need to Create a CUSTOM Spell that is similar to Shapechange, but that allows one to change into a Spaient, Sentient Metahuman (rather than Mundane Critter - it was also restricted from allowing one to gain supernatural abilities, so while you could look like an infected, you could not have the powers of an Infected). And since One spell would be too powerful for that, we limited it into requiring a spoecific Metatype Spell for each Metatype. So Troll Form was separate from Orc Form, which was different from Dwarf Form. I never saw anyone take a Ghoul Form spell... after all, who wants to emulate a Ghoul? Especially when you don't get the supernatural benefits of such an emulation. The spells are great for blending in with a certain subset of metahumanity, if that is your goal, and they especially excel at rapid disguise implementation (assumming you have ways around the equipment and clothing dilemmas).

Yeah, custom spells could do that, of course.

Bye
Thanee

If there are pixie characters at the table, are there also paranoid bunker riggers / deckers / otaku / technomancers who only ever interact with real people via remote manservant / bust-a-move drones / emotitoys? If so you have a few options:

• trodes and drones for interactions yourself
• design your ally spirit (perhaps your familiar) with the (meta)human form(s) you want and as it interacts with people for you, hover beside it on the astral using its sense link to see what it sees on the physical (eg read signs, menus, etc) and giving it instructions
• prepare a vessel and possess it whenever you need to (a metamagic technique in SR3; available via endowment in SR4). Depending on funding your vessel could be a homunculus, or a clone (of someone else), or a freshly expired corpse (if you need finger prints and retinal scans of a legitimate employee to bypass biometrics, etc.) or for more "innocent" scouting it could be a critter people pay no attention to like a mangy stray cat or a half-starved crow.