I've got some runners who need to take down a power station. It needs to be down for a period of one week, and must cost at least (insert large but nonastronomical figure here) to repair.
First, a bit about the power station. It's modeled after the station in Brainscan, though it is not that station, nor am I running Brainscan right now. It's got slightly more automated security, live guards come by every once in a while, but there isn't a little league game going on nearby.
The method chosen by the players at the moment is that they're going to steal a van, fill it with an improvised fuel-oil and fertilizer bomb, and blow the place to Hell and back that way. The van they're thinking of is a basic box van, not too big, probably something like an ordinary U-Haul.
So how much of the stuff should they need to blow the station to pieces, and also how much damage should it do if they cram the thing to the gills? How much should this cost?
The station is reinforced concrete but not serious hardened materials.
~J, menace to society
Full Version: Explosives Questions
How does the place actually generate the electricity? Then best way to wreck a power station is probably to destroy the electromagnetic turbines that turn rotary motion into vurrent. Fixing they would take a lot of time and money. An improvised truck bomb might not do the job though, as the blast footprint might not get the turbines. Dropping an big bomb on the place would probably work better, as you'd get a better blast pattern.
Just distributiong thin strands of conductinve material over the site will also keep it down for a while, as the material will promote blowing out equipment. (see earlier thread about graphite anti power plant bomb).
The power plant will probably have a premeter fence and concrete barriers, so just getting your truck bomb close enough might require some work...
Any mucking around in the power plant is likely to leave you trapped by the cops outside.
My best seat of the pants plan would involved rigging the truck bomb for remote control, then a conventional assault on the power plants premiter defenses to get teh truck bomb past them. This hopefully give the team plenty of time to make a getaway (though that depends on the surrounding area). Adding the graphite fibers (or similar) to the truck bomb would be a bonus.
Just distributiong thin strands of conductinve material over the site will also keep it down for a while, as the material will promote blowing out equipment. (see earlier thread about graphite anti power plant bomb).
The power plant will probably have a premeter fence and concrete barriers, so just getting your truck bomb close enough might require some work...
Any mucking around in the power plant is likely to leave you trapped by the cops outside.
My best seat of the pants plan would involved rigging the truck bomb for remote control, then a conventional assault on the power plants premiter defenses to get teh truck bomb past them. This hopefully give the team plenty of time to make a getaway (though that depends on the surrounding area). Adding the graphite fibers (or similar) to the truck bomb would be a bonus.
Think Oklahoma City.
It isn't a power plant, it's more of a transformer station.
And I remember Oklahoma City, but that doesn't tell me how much they need to just waste this building
~J
And I remember Oklahoma City, but that doesn't tell me how much they need to just waste this building
~J
How big is the building? As was demonstrated in Oklahoma, two 55-gallon drums of properly mixed AN-FO explosive will gut a building that stands (if memory serves) about 14 stories tall. I've heard experts remark that if the two barrels had been on opposite sides of the building, it would have dropped like a stone.
The short answer? 55 gallons is too much. 20 gallons might be too much. And remember, ammonium nitrate is on several government chemical watch lists right now, and probably still will be in 205x and 206x.
I'd also suggest a Demolitions (B/R) check for whoever is doing the mixing. While not real hard, you can still screw up the mixture and lose effectiveness.
The short answer? 55 gallons is too much. 20 gallons might be too much. And remember, ammonium nitrate is on several government chemical watch lists right now, and probably still will be in 205x and 206x.
I'd also suggest a Demolitions (B/R) check for whoever is doing the mixing. While not real hard, you can still screw up the mixture and lose effectiveness.
| QUOTE (cykotek) |
| two 55-gallon drums of properly mixed AN-FO explosive will gut a building that stands (if memory serves) about 14 stories tall. |
If the office building had been a power station, the generators would have been intact in that building. How high the building is doesn't really have anything to do with it either, since the explosion happens at ground level. If taking out whatever controls the generators is enough, then a rather small amount (a 3-digit figure of TNT kgs) can do the trick, depending on a huge number of variables such as the floor plan of the plant, how near you can get the truck, etc.
| QUOTE (Crusher Bob) |
| My best seat of the pants plan would involved rigging the truck bomb for remote control, then a conventional assault on the power plants premiter defenses to get teh truck bomb past them. |
Completely agreed. There's absolutely no way you can just drive a truck filled with explosives into a power station.
Wow, what a fantastic way to get the FBI to start reading the Dumpshock forums. I know it can be hard to find players in some places, but I'm not sure this is the way to do it 
.
.
Um, the lookup I did showed that 2,200 kilograms of ammonium nitrate was used in Oklahoma City. That would be an Ares Roadmaster full of the stuff. And the graphical representations I've seen of the truck showed that the thing was completely packed with the explosive in a sort of honeycomb configuration, not just a couple of barrels in the back of the truck.
Where are you getting this "two barrels" figure?
(Side note: driving a truck full of explosives into it would be "easy" -- "just" send a smaller bomb in first to blow through one of the concrete barricades.)
Also, what's the facility made out of? If it's old/big enough, there might be some plasteel-7 used in its construction, facilitating solvent usage... even if there isn't, you need to find a weak-point or use a lot of explosive. Like, hundreds of kilos.
Although if you're just trying to shut the place down for a while, you might be better off contaminating it or messing with the more delicate components than just slamming a bomb into it. A 'dirty bomb' (
) of some sort would shut the place down regardless of the actual structural damage, and keep it closed until decontamination completed. And it might not require the wholesale slaughter of whatever personnel are on-sight, to boot!
-Albert
Where are you getting this "two barrels" figure?
(Side note: driving a truck full of explosives into it would be "easy" -- "just" send a smaller bomb in first to blow through one of the concrete barricades.)
Also, what's the facility made out of? If it's old/big enough, there might be some plasteel-7 used in its construction, facilitating solvent usage... even if there isn't, you need to find a weak-point or use a lot of explosive. Like, hundreds of kilos.
Although if you're just trying to shut the place down for a while, you might be better off contaminating it or messing with the more delicate components than just slamming a bomb into it. A 'dirty bomb' (
) of some sort would shut the place down regardless of the actual structural damage, and keep it closed until decontamination completed. And it might not require the wholesale slaughter of whatever personnel are on-sight, to boot!-Albert
Ok the building in Brainscan is not a power plant its a little transformer substation, the kinda deal that sits on the edge of town and converts those high tension lines into something more usable in cities. There's no legend on the map but my guess, and I'm being generous is about 60 feet by 25 feet. It's only perimeter defenses are a chain link fence and the fact that it sits on a 1 foot slab of concret. There are transformers outside the substation. It's only got one door. Really the way I'd go about messing it up is drive the truck through the fence, crash into, or through the transformers, anybody got any idea how sturdy those are? Back the truck in against the door, hopefully open it some too. Rig the back door on the truck to open, and have it open, then blast the bomb. I'd go with something pretty small seeing as it's going off in a confined space. I'd probably also put some nails and other things to act as shrapnel to make sure any equipment gets broken.
Speaking as a GM the way I'd do this is have someone roll demolitions knowledge and try to figure it out, given enough success, call timeout for a bit and sit down calculate barrier ratings, and then figure out how big a bomb you'd need to knock the walls down. Give that amount to the players as the ideal "just right" amount to use. They'll use a bit more, so I wouldn't have a problem saying if it all goes to plan the building comes down. And I'd estimate if everything goes to plan it could come off in around 30 seconds tops. Quite simply they'd never see it coming and could likely not stop it. You rig the truck and the team just has to get clear after the building comes down.
Speaking as a GM the way I'd do this is have someone roll demolitions knowledge and try to figure it out, given enough success, call timeout for a bit and sit down calculate barrier ratings, and then figure out how big a bomb you'd need to knock the walls down. Give that amount to the players as the ideal "just right" amount to use. They'll use a bit more, so I wouldn't have a problem saying if it all goes to plan the building comes down. And I'd estimate if everything goes to plan it could come off in around 30 seconds tops. Quite simply they'd never see it coming and could likely not stop it. You rig the truck and the team just has to get clear after the building comes down.
Hello you fine, fine Homeland Security People.
As I am _not_ going to try and look up "Car Bomb Building 101" on the net, I'm just going to do some random speculating here.
Points of access to the power station?
Since your players are throwing subtlety out the window, use three different car bombs.
First - attack a perimeter fence, enough explosive to make a hole and draw a lot of attention.
Second - run a slightly larger explosive into the entrance. Bigger explosion, oh hell - this was the diversion, quick! Front gate!
Third - run the primary explosive through the now-breached and presumeably lightly defended security fence. Oh frag, the diversion we're ignoring is the primary assaul...boom.
You might take a note and make efforts to seriously impede any traffic from approaching the facility. Primary and secondary check points before the main entrance, stone blocks ringing perimeter and a reinforced steel-concrete shell protecting the primary power facility.
Odds are, if the players are thinking this, someone else thought about it too and has taken steps to prevent it.
-Siege
As I am _not_ going to try and look up "Car Bomb Building 101" on the net, I'm just going to do some random speculating here.
Points of access to the power station?
Since your players are throwing subtlety out the window, use three different car bombs.
First - attack a perimeter fence, enough explosive to make a hole and draw a lot of attention.
Second - run a slightly larger explosive into the entrance. Bigger explosion, oh hell - this was the diversion, quick! Front gate!
Third - run the primary explosive through the now-breached and presumeably lightly defended security fence. Oh frag, the diversion we're ignoring is the primary assaul...boom.
You might take a note and make efforts to seriously impede any traffic from approaching the facility. Primary and secondary check points before the main entrance, stone blocks ringing perimeter and a reinforced steel-concrete shell protecting the primary power facility.
Odds are, if the players are thinking this, someone else thought about it too and has taken steps to prevent it.
-Siege
| QUOTE |
| I've got some runners who need to take down a power station. It needs to be down for a period of one week, and must cost at least (insert large but nonastronomical figure here) to repair. |
| QUOTE |
| Ok the building in Brainscan is not a power plant its a little transformer substation, the kinda deal that sits on the edge of town and converts those high tension lines into something more usable in cities. |
How effective would it be to just take down some of those towers that carry the high tension lines? Those things are pretty big, so they have to take a while to build, and they're completely unguarded. Put some explosives on a few of the supports of each one, on a timer, and a line of them will fall like trees.
But, despite the fun of trying to come up with ways to do this, what you're asking for is how much fertilizer they'll need. The answer is that those details are going to require knowledge of the composition of these products in the future, which we don't have. If I was the GM, I'd assume a van-full would do it, assign a difficulty for setting it up correctly, and make someone roll for it. Basically, the number doesn't matter. Just pick something (the 2200 kg for Oklahoma City is probably reasonable) and go with it. I can't really see a situation where 1000 kg vs 2000 kg vs 3000 kg is going to make a big difference. Just make sure the quantity can fit in a reasonable van/suv and run with it.
One thing to point out, though, is that keeping some place without power for a full week is going to be rough. Power companies tend to be pretty motivated to keep the system working. I would be surprised if they couldn't get a temporary system working in under a week. Of course, as the GM, you could go easy on them with that.
On the other hand, those places aren't very well guarded. I would be surprised if a stealthy group of runners couldn't kill or incapacitate everyone inside without an alarm being raised. At that point, drive the van up to the building at your leisure, or place shaped charges on the inside.
Out of curiosity, why are they trying to do this?
I'd have to second the "what are they trying to do" question. That really determines the best responses... does the place need to be completely annihilated? If so, explosives are definitely it. But what kind and how are they placed? Is the facility a tough nut to crack, security-wise? If so, carefully placed charges aren't an option, and you'll have to be crude about things. Is collateral damage an issue? If so, fuel-air explosives are better for completely destroying shit without causing spillover, and much harder to trace. If not, conventional explosives are much cheaper and easier to make, not to mention *find*. Does the facility require on-site personnel to operate? If so, your little raid will be a carefully premeditated multiple-homicide terrorist attack -- it might be smarter to just make the facility uninhabitable (or inoperable) rather than toppling it. Forcing an evacuation and a week's decontamination (or repairs) would be cleaner (and might even be cheaper) than the brute-force approach. For that matter, what about persistant harassment -- if you pay the workers double, they might have that facility back up in a week, but what can they do if a few spirits using the "Accident" power (or a well-placed second bomb, or a decker/rigger interfering with communications amongst the repair effort) shut the place down every two days?
But if blowing the place to Hell is really the best option, then you need to tell us how big the place is and what materials it's made out of.
And I do hope you say "Plasteel-7"
-Albert
But if blowing the place to Hell is really the best option, then you need to tell us how big the place is and what materials it's made out of.
And I do hope you say "Plasteel-7"
-Albert
| QUOTE (SirKodiak @ Jul 26 2004, 04:41 AM) |
| One thing to point out, though, is that keeping some place without power for a full week is going to be rough. Power companies tend to be pretty motivated to keep the system working. I would be surprised if they couldn't get a temporary system working in under a week. Of course, as the GM, you could go easy on them with that. |
This specific station must be down for a week. The power company can route around, just as long as they can't get this station online again that quickly.
| QUOTE |
| Out of curiosity, why are they trying to do this? |
It's what they got hired to do.
I'll try to get dimensions for you, but as I said, it's reinforced concrete.
~J
Depending on how and where the substation is built, there are different considerations for the design of the reinforced concrete (RC) structure. For example, concrete is weak in tension but great in compression, so is the substation designed to withstand lateral loading? A substation in an earthquake zone or typhoon country would be designed against lateral loads.
A car bomb parked next to an RC structure built to withstand lateral loading would do better exploding on the roof.
A car bomb parked next to an RC structure built to withstand lateral loading would do better exploding on the roof.
| QUOTE (toturi) |
| Depending on how and where the substation is built, there are different considerations for the design of the reinforced concrete (RC) structure. For example, concrete is weak in tension but great in compression, so is the substation designed to withstand lateral loading? |
That's the purpose of the rebar. It is, as you say, weak in compression and great in tension. When their powers combine, they become the mighty entity known as reinforced concrete.
But depending on how you design it, you put in either more or less steel. If more, yes, it does become stronger in the tensile zone but correspondingly it become weaker in the compressive area. Putting in more steel isn't a cost effective solution since steel is much more expensive than concrete and is weaker in the heat resistance aspect as well as in the unltra low duration dynamic loading aspect, which forms a major component of most explosions.
So unless a building is specifically built to withstand explosive loadings, for example some US embassies (that I know of), most buildings are surprisingly easy to make unsafe with explosives
So unless a building is specifically built to withstand explosive loadings, for example some US embassies (that I know of), most buildings are surprisingly easy to make unsafe with explosives
As has been implied, making a power plant unusable for a week is not very difficult. Does the place require actual human controllers present at all times? If so, I might even suggest a chemical attack: nerve agents will stick around the surfaces for at least a week, and cleaning up the whole place will take really damn long. Just blowing up the main power lines leading out of the plant would take the whole place out for a long while.
I'm mostly concerned with the "must cost at least (insert large but nonastronomical figure here) to repair" bit. Repairing power lines or transformers doesn't cost that much, and neither does a chemical clean-up. I'd expect the most expensive systems in the power plant are the generators themselves (depending on exactly what kind of power plant this is) and the computer hardware controlling the plant. Getting those is really difficult without using very large amounts of explosives and getting them really close.
As for Oklahoma, alledgedly McVeigh told his lawyer that the bombed weighed in at about 4,800lbs of ammonium nitrate + nitromethane (13 barrels with 350lbs of ammonium nitrate and 20lbs of nitromethane each). By far the most often quoted bomb weight is 4,800lbs, with 4,000lbs a distant second, and anything else only quoted by some "I don't have any proof but I'm still the only one who's right" people.
I'm mostly concerned with the "must cost at least (insert large but nonastronomical figure here) to repair" bit. Repairing power lines or transformers doesn't cost that much, and neither does a chemical clean-up. I'd expect the most expensive systems in the power plant are the generators themselves (depending on exactly what kind of power plant this is) and the computer hardware controlling the plant. Getting those is really difficult without using very large amounts of explosives and getting them really close.
As for Oklahoma, alledgedly McVeigh told his lawyer that the bombed weighed in at about 4,800lbs of ammonium nitrate + nitromethane (13 barrels with 350lbs of ammonium nitrate and 20lbs of nitromethane each). By far the most often quoted bomb weight is 4,800lbs, with 4,000lbs a distant second, and anything else only quoted by some "I don't have any proof but I'm still the only one who's right" people.
I have to admit, I still love the idea above about checking if the facility uses plasteel-7. I have images in my mind of flying a crop duster overhead with the solvent, and watching every piece of equipment fall THROUGH the building, into the foundation. I think that would pretty effectively destroy a power station.
I think the chemical attack combined with prompt infiltration and destruction of either the turbines or control systems with explosives would probably be the most effective attack. You might want to hire additional runners, as you've got a lot to do before the cops come.
How about just soaking the place with salt water while the live guards are out?
I imagine everything getting rusty would cost a fair bit to fix and gum up the system fairly well. Might take longer than a bomb, though.
And it's a little less of a "OMG, we're being attacked!" sort of sabotage.
-karma
I imagine everything getting rusty would cost a fair bit to fix and gum up the system fairly well. Might take longer than a bomb, though.
And it's a little less of a "OMG, we're being attacked!" sort of sabotage.
-karma
Any problem in SR can be solved by a rock(or troll or cow) from sufficient altitude or an abundance of explosives. This should make them the final resort unless you are just sick of the GM pulling surprise opposition on you.
What type of power plant is it (no, I didn't read oll the posts)? Most power production methods can generate more power than the plant can actually process. So dump some more fuel in the coal bin, pull out a few control rods or something similar. Mess up the combustion rate, fission rate, or cooling process and that should do all the damage you need.
The above requires a competant decker or worse depending on the power production facility type.
What type of power plant is it (no, I didn't read oll the posts)? Most power production methods can generate more power than the plant can actually process. So dump some more fuel in the coal bin, pull out a few control rods or something similar. Mess up the combustion rate, fission rate, or cooling process and that should do all the damage you need.
The above requires a competant decker or worse depending on the power production facility type.
| QUOTE (Herald of Verjigorm) |
| The above requires a competant decker or worse depending on the power production facility type. |
In case of a fission power plant in a civilized western country in the 2060s, it requires a radiation- and heat-resistant mecha inside the core while all the main, secondary and tertiary protective mechanisms are off-line.
In case of a rather cheap plant, I suppose a very competent decker could at the very least shut it down and make it stay shut down for quite a while. Expensive plants are going to be protected against spikes with "überfuses", switching which will probably not cost a large-but-non-astronomical-number-of-nuyen.
[Edit]Some power plant types might be vulnerable to such an attack. Those using heat to power turbines, for example. I'm not sure about how those operate and what kinds of failsafes they have. But at least they are not as obviously foolproof as fission plants are (these days, in the western world).[/Edit]
It workes better for combustion plants. Easier to overide the loading mechanism so that it just keeps pouring more fuel into the fire. Too much heat will eventually melt some of the mechanisms.
As for any variety of nuke plant, yes any modern facility would have many levels of fail-safe.
As for any variety of nuke plant, yes any modern facility would have many levels of fail-safe.
| QUOTE (Austere Emancipator @ Jul 26 2004, 12:33 PM) |
| [Edit]Some power plant types might be vulnerable to such an attack. Those using heat to power turbines, for example. I'm not sure about how those operate and what kinds of failsafes they have. But at least they are not as obviously foolproof as fission plants are (these days, in the western world).[/Edit] |
From what I understood, fission power plants do use heat to power turbines. Perhaps you're referring to using fossil fuels? Although I suspect that the environmentally friendly methods tend to be the least well guarded and probably the easiest to destroy.
All in all, it's a moot point. Kag specified it's a transformer station. This would probably be an excellent time for EMP, however. That would most likely burn out quite a pieces of equipment, and there's no way their power station can be optically based.
| QUOTE (nezumi) |
| From what I understood, fission power plants do use heat to power turbines. Perhaps you're referring to using fossil fuels? |
Oops. Yeah. You're absolutely right. Fission power plants do use heat to power turbines. Yup, I meant mainly fossil fuel plants (or combustion plants, as HoV put it).
I got the idea that Kag meant it looks like the transformer station but isn't one exactly? Anyway, it seems to me that a power plant would not be very vulnerable to EMP, since the power lines in such a place are built to withstand some pretty hefty currents. One of those conductive-scrap bombs Crusher Bob mentioned in the first reply in the thread might work better.
| QUOTE |
This specific station must be down for a week. The power company can route around, just as long as they can't get this station online again that quickly. |
Ah, then that's not that hard. Just make the place uninhabitable without serious cleanup, as has been mentioned before. Whichever of nuclear, biological, or chemical is the easiest for them to get their hands on.
The only other thing is that if they're going to want to bring down the entire roof, they're going to want to hit two side of the building. Otherwise they risk leaving part of the building in tact, depending on how the building is built.
Special Atomic Demolition Munition. It has flair, it has style, it has complete overkill. Every decent demolitions runner should have one or two in his closet for a rainy day.
Shutting down a power station for a week would require collapsing a large chunk of the building. It is fairly simply to replace damaged or destroyed parts, but building a new structire requires at least a week, especialy when clean-up time is factored in.
Shutting down a power station for a week would require collapsing a large chunk of the building. It is fairly simply to replace damaged or destroyed parts, but building a new structire requires at least a week, especialy when clean-up time is factored in.
| QUOTE (Austere Emancipator) |
| Does the place require actual human controllers present at all times? |
Nope; humans are only on-site when something is wrong.
| QUOTE (Herald of Verjigorm) |
| What type of power plant is it (no, I didn't read oll the posts)? |
I guess I was misleading. It isn't a power plant, it's a transformer station. The location is down by Auburn near the Salish-Shidhe border, near… 164? Whatever that highway is. I can't find my copy of New Seattle, so I'm working off a map of Seattle from the internet somewhere.
It is a transformer station, I meant to say that it isn't the specific station from Brainscan (next to a baseball field, ultra-low security, etc.).
The monetary cost of repair means that at the least some of the more expensive computer systems or somesuch need to be taken out. As I don't know exactly what that would cost, I didn't specify.
The final thing to keep in mind is that the Lone Star response will be directly proportional to the damage caused, so overkill, while a possibility, is preferably avoided unless it can be done entirely cleanly.
~J
if you want to take out the power station, for about a week, with minimal cost and difficulty... dont bother trying to blow up the powerplant
All you need to do is tke out the BIG ass capacitors that sit between the actuall generators, and the Power Transfer gear (ie, the Big Transformers that turn the power that comes out of the Generator into the 100,000 Volts that they dump into the transmission lines.
The Capacitors will go "pop" with very little actual effort.. as any one who's ever accidentally flicked that little "110/240" switch on the back of a PC power supply will know ... A Few Chaff Rocket rounds in the right place, and they're a couple of dozen Farrads down....
As for the Transformers, a high power rifle will pretty much take care of them .. Current day ones are Filled with oil, to keep them cool. All you need to do is let it all out... wait for an hour.. then Blow up the Capacitor bank. Mr Induction will pretty much take care of the rest...
(Special disclaimer. /me can take no responsibility for any of the consequences of anyone actually tying this in real life. )
((extra special disclaimer. OI. Manweb. Get your Transformer parks sorted out. If you blow up annother one, we'll all be really unhappy)
((( note /me just had to upgrade his UPS due to an oil leak at his nearest Electricity sub-station. The oil leaked out, the Transformer melted, and we were with out power for 11 hours . And this was a small, Local, easily replaceable one. They turned up with one on the back of a truck, moved the cables over, and drove off with the old one. Took 20 mins. tops.)))
All you need to do is tke out the BIG ass capacitors that sit between the actuall generators, and the Power Transfer gear (ie, the Big Transformers that turn the power that comes out of the Generator into the 100,000 Volts that they dump into the transmission lines.
The Capacitors will go "pop" with very little actual effort.. as any one who's ever accidentally flicked that little "110/240" switch on the back of a PC power supply will know ... A Few Chaff Rocket rounds in the right place, and they're a couple of dozen Farrads down....
As for the Transformers, a high power rifle will pretty much take care of them .. Current day ones are Filled with oil, to keep them cool. All you need to do is let it all out... wait for an hour.. then Blow up the Capacitor bank. Mr Induction will pretty much take care of the rest...
(Special disclaimer. /me can take no responsibility for any of the consequences of anyone actually tying this in real life. )
((extra special disclaimer. OI. Manweb. Get your Transformer parks sorted out. If you blow up annother one, we'll all be really unhappy)
((( note /me just had to upgrade his UPS due to an oil leak at his nearest Electricity sub-station. The oil leaked out, the Transformer melted, and we were with out power for 11 hours . And this was a small, Local, easily replaceable one. They turned up with one on the back of a truck, moved the cables over, and drove off with the old one. Took 20 mins. tops.)))
EMPs? How long would it take to replace all of the electronics?
(I don't know how hard it is to get one in SR--probably very since there are no canon rules--but the guys in "Ocean's Eleven" had little problem with picking one up from the local University. Very conveinent, that. Maybe U-dub has one...)
(I don't know how hard it is to get one in SR--probably very since there are no canon rules--but the guys in "Ocean's Eleven" had little problem with picking one up from the local University. Very conveinent, that.
Maybe U-dub has one...)
Given the amount of juice running through the place, it's probably shielded.
~J
~J
The entire facility wouldn't work if it weren't shielded. At best, you might be able to knock out some personal computers. Which are conveniently invincible!
Good point. Well, don't I feel like a 
?
But since you're the GM, is it shielded?
?But since you're the GM, is it shielded?
| QUOTE (kevyn668) |
| But since you're the GM, is it shielded? |
Given Arethusa's post, I'd say yes
And you'd still be able to knock out the personal computers, but the most damage you'd be able to do is fry the power supplies. Data would all be intact.
~J
Could you just throw some wooden shoes into the machinery?
Sabotage!
~J
~J
I thought you'd like that!
My thoughts are that hitting the individual transformers wouldn't work that well, as mentioned above they might just show up with a new one onna truck and do a swap, be out of action for a few hours at most.
You probably need to hit the surrounding support equipment and cabling. That kinda stuff might take ages to get sorted out.
Might be as simple as dousing the switchboxes and stuff with some acidic compounds to melt away all the insulating material. I also suggested a rusting agent above, though that might take some time to work.
I'm personally not a big fan of BOOM solutions if a quiet solution will work just as well.
-karma
You probably need to hit the surrounding support equipment and cabling. That kinda stuff might take ages to get sorted out.
Might be as simple as dousing the switchboxes and stuff with some acidic compounds to melt away all the insulating material. I also suggested a rusting agent above, though that might take some time to work.
I'm personally not a big fan of BOOM solutions if a quiet solution will work just as well.
-karma
| QUOTE (KarmaInferno) |
| My thoughts are that hitting the individual transformers wouldn't work that well, as mentioned above they might just show up with a new one onna truck and do a swap, be out of action for a few hours at most. You probably need to hit the surrounding support equipment and cabling. That kinda stuff might take ages to get sorted out. Might be as simple as dousing the switchboxes and stuff with some acidic compounds to melt away all the insulating material. I also suggested a rusting agent above, though that might take some time to work. |
I guess it dedpends on whether this Transformer station is just a single local substation, or a larger regional 'farm'. If the latter it could be a large cluster massive transformers, that distributes the power to smaller local substations. It would take more than 20 minutes and a flatbed truck to change these sorts of transformers...
Modern HVDC converter stations are used to convert the High Voltage DC used for long-distance transmission to lower voltage AC for the local distribution grid and heavy industries, with local substations taking this down to domestic voltages.
See fig 7 in the linked pdf for a good view of a converter station... should take a few days to fix that if it gets trashed.
If you can't get to the PDF, here's another link that you can browse around from
to me, the best bet would be to introduce structural weaknesses in the building itself that make it uninhabitable according to the zoning codes, along with blowing up the actual machinery itself. before they can send in workers to fix the machines, they'll have to send in workers to carefully fix the structural damage. that can take a while.
intelligent usage of cratering charges from SOTA 2063 will do it for you
if it blows chunks out of things, it can mess up transformers
unless its optimus prime, that guy is unstopable i think
if it blows chunks out of things, it can mess up transformers
unless its optimus prime, that guy is unstopable i think
well on totaly disabling something for a week...
unplug and steal every wire you can find, (are there any critters / awwackend critters that like to eat wires?),
spray paint all of the computer moniters so they can not be used,
plug all data jacks,
and weld doors shut,
oh and preprogram the computers with ice to attack the next person who jacks in to fix things,
get some custom power cables that swap positive and negative ( but look the same) and plug in machiens with those. when they get turned on they get fried an might start a fire.
destroy the matrix access...
and if they fix it early,
blow it up
unplug and steal every wire you can find, (are there any critters / awwackend critters that like to eat wires?),
spray paint all of the computer moniters so they can not be used,
plug all data jacks,
and weld doors shut,
oh and preprogram the computers with ice to attack the next person who jacks in to fix things,
get some custom power cables that swap positive and negative ( but look the same) and plug in machiens with those. when they get turned on they get fried an might start a fire.
destroy the matrix access...
and if they fix it early,
blow it up
| QUOTE (Fygg Nuuton) |
| intelligent usage of cratering charges from SOTA 2063 will do it for you if it blows chunks out of things, it can mess up transformers unless its optimus prime, that guy is unstopable i think |
Unfortunately, Optimus was stopped.
| QUOTE (xizor) |
| well on totaly disabling something for a week... unplug and steal every wire you can find, (are there any critters / awwackend critters that like to eat wires?), spray paint all of the computer moniters so they can not be used, plug all data jacks, and weld doors shut, oh and preprogram the computers with ice to attack the next person who jacks in to fix things, get some custom power cables that swap positive and negative ( but look the same) and plug in machiens with those. when they get turned on they get fried an might start a fire. destroy the matrix access... and if they fix it early, blow it up |
I love this.
| QUOTE (kevyn668) |
| Unfortunately, Optimus was stopped. |
And Rodimus was nowhere near as cool.
i forgot the trick with the light bulbs,
first spray paint all the windows,
turn on your flash light
steal all the light bulbs,
(what do they actual use for light in 2060? a phosperesent bulbs?)
and this is probably the last thing you shoud do before you leave
not only is it just damn annoing, but it also limits the repair time to daylight hours, as well as just making life dificult for the poor shmuck hired to repair the place.
you might want to leave him a tip...
first spray paint all the windows,
turn on your flash light
steal all the light bulbs,
(what do they actual use for light in 2060? a phosperesent bulbs?)
and this is probably the last thing you shoud do before you leave
not only is it just damn annoing, but it also limits the repair time to daylight hours, as well as just making life dificult for the poor shmuck hired to repair the place.
you might want to leave him a tip...
Replace the light bulbs/light strips with incendiary material, when they DO get the power back on for lighting, the will wish they hadn't.
| QUOTE (tjn) | ||
And Rodimus was nowhere near as cool. |
But by then the show had Jumped the Shark anyway.
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