New player, currently playing a shaman.

Looking ahead, I want to know what is the drawbacks to Quickening a spell vs using a Sustaining Foci. I read somewhere that having a Quicken means you're vulnerable to Astral assault or something like that.

Generally, is it worth Quickening a few spells? If so, what do people like to do (aside from Stats/Reaction, which would seem apparent)? If not (ie, risk never worth it), then why even have the power?

On a related note, what about Anchoring? Does that have the same vulnerabilities? And can one mitigate these vulnerabilities to some degree with Detect Enemies (so any such attack is forewarned) and Masking?

On a unrelated question, I read somewhere that Foci Addition occurs (that is, a check is made) when a caster uses a higher amount of combined Foci in Force in a single Turn (or something like that) than their Magic Attribute. How does that work when dealing with Power Foci (which increase the wielder's Magic Attribute)? Use the "natural" Magic score or use the score w/ the Power Foci? And if the former, then what good is it to increase one's Magic Stat if it doesn't help stave this off?

Planning on casting increase Attribute INT on Gourry?

Quickening is permanent. Very permanent. Some spells, like detection, a stat increase, reaction increase could be a good idea. Assensing will reveal them and let everyone knoe you are packing. Plus, if the spells are above force 2 they are illegal and you have a built in felony just walking to the stuff shack. Stuff like barriers, armor, obnoxious detection spells like detect life/object and of course invis or levitate would get ugly. Can be dispelled but more karma can be spent to help prevent this.

Sustaining foci are quick and easy to use, can be turned off at will. They are expensive, noticable, can be dispelled and destroyed costing you nuyen AND karma.

Foci can be targeted from the astral plane because they ARE dual natured (when cast on the physical plane) but having active spells does not make you dual natured.

I'll leave anchoring to someone else.

Focus addiction is based off your actual magic rating. Power foci do not increase your magic attribute for this purpose. The total of all foci used in a turn can't exceed your magic rating or you get to test for it.

Nice to see someone recognize the reference

So having a Quickened spell(s) doesn't make you vulnerable to Astral attack, but Foci does?

Yes, stat-increase spells seem tailor-made for Quickening. And keeping them to Force 2 or lower doesn't reduce their effectiveness, and while dispelling a Force 2 is easy, rebuilding it doesn't cost as much Karma. That of course bums the question of whether it's better to quicken at 2, then count on it being cheap to rebuild, or quicken at 6, then count on it being tough to take down in the first place, though expensive to rebuild.

I had speculated on Quickening Detect Enemies (ie, "Spider Sense"), which I don't necessarily see as "obnoxious". I also idly toyed with the idea of Quickening Levitate, then hiding it by staying almost (1 mm) to the ground until actually needed vertical height, though obviously, that could still be seen if someone was particularly observant.

It's probably more pragmatic to link more "active" spells like Barriers, Levitate, etc to something like a Sustaining Foci or an Anchoring Foci.

There's no reason why someone using levitate can't be touching the ground.

~J

Anchoring without a Detection Spell

When an Anchoring Focus is used without a Detection Spell, it is very much like a Sustaining Focus. The only difference is that the Spell doesn't start right away, it starts later when a Keyword or Action triggers it. Its benefits and drawbacks are otherwise the same as a Sustaining focus.

Both have a spell cast into them, and the focus is active from that point forward, even for an anchoring focus where the spell doesn't start till later. Both have the spell active for a while. Both can be turned off (one by removing it, the other by removing or action or word). After getting turned off, both require the magician who bonded the focus to recast the spell before it can be used again. Since the focus, in both cases, is active from when the spell is put into it, both count toward determining if a magician suffers focus adiction. Both require rebonding in order to be used for a different spell.

Examples of Anchoring Foci: Levitate 1 Anchored to a Samurai, so when he falls he says "Mary Poppins" and is gently lowered to the ground. Oxygenate 1 Anchored to a Rigger, so when his Submarine is destroyed he says "Blub Blub" and can breath again. Armor 5 anchored to the Face, who doesn't want to glow most of the time, but when he's under fire he's happy to say the magic word.

Anchoring with a Detection Spell

Anchoring with a Detection Spell requires putting some of the Force Points of the Anchoring Focus toward sustaining a Detection Spell. When the detection spell senses something the other spell is activated either on the wearer or on the target that was detected (as chosen by the magician). Most common example is Detect (Incoming) Bullet anchored with Barrier, Bullet Barrier, Armor or Bullet Armor. Unfortunately with the requirements to split dice among different things with the anchoring, and detection spells being resisted, not all combinations of Anchoring with a Detection Spell are as useful as they might seem at first glance.

Anchoring is something everybody wants to by but nobody wants to sell.

One of the listed examples is a potion of force 4 treat. Consider if you sold 3 of these to a runner teem and they all got badly shot up to serious wound and drank there potions. Your haply swimming at the local beach blissfully unaware what your customers are up to and suddenly must resist 2S stun 3 times. Can you swim to the shore with the wound modifiers. What if it happens during a complicated enchanting? And then there is the fact that they are ritual links to you. If a mage were wiling to ell one he would charge you like a wounded bull.

Using a anchored spell for your own uses is also of limited value. You still take the drain. Maybe being able to apply more spell pool is a small advantage but is it worth the expense.

The only ay I would consider using it is with the armour/det bullets combo or some other reactive defence. Even then your risking drain possibly when you can least afford it. I doubt I would ever use it. There are more useful meta magics.

Edward

I have had question about astral attacks via foci for a long time. Where does it state that an astral caster can channel a spell through the foci in order to affect the foci's user? I have heard this mentioned but haven't actually read it.

That was back in 2nd edition under "Grounding." Spells could "ground" through any dual natured object (or person). It was only useful for physical are effect spells IIRC.

Certainly, I'm not saying it would be triggered very often, or that the runner's life expectancy would be that high if he or she were getting overloaded by targets anyway, but I think it's a reasonable possibility, if one more suited to Detect Life.

~J

Yeah, but what kinda wierdo would quicken Detect Life? (I say wierdo cause one of my boys in my old game did just that) That's something you're suppose to cast when you're after a specific target, or missing people.

Sphynx

One thing to remember is that you can take an astral quest to hide the ritual link that a foci forms... I'm not sure if this hides its link to you altogether or not.

I was serious... are foci visible through clothes\armor\skin?

The way I read it, yes, it absolutely hides the link to you.

In the case of clothing hiding foci, I can see it both ways. I don't remember the books explicitly mentioning this, but I could see the logic of clothes hiding foci. OTOH, if full armor doesn't hide the aura enough to prevent spellcasting, why should clothes hide a focus. I guess I would judge that no, you can't hid foci in clothes. I chose this mostly to prevent munchkinism.

Not that a legal 2 point increase is anything to sneeze at. The problem comes with the ease of dispelling. Even if 4 karma are poured into the quickening, neither the dispelling nor the subsequent drain will be difficult.

These days its +1 att/2 successes up to force of the spell, tgt number = existing attribute.

EDIT - oh, and we kept grounding in our game from SR2. Its just too cool to give up, for both players and GM...

Hm... that sounds about on par with the rest of how SR3 converted magic. That though really encourages Quickening the spell, instead of relying on casting it on the fly. When Quickening, the caster can pour everything they have, pool, foci (if any), Karma pool (if necessary) to get as many successes as they can because they're going for that "one perfect cast" since Quickening means it's forever. And because one generally Quickens in a non-combat situation (ie, home), they don't need to save anything for Drain. It would also suggest redoing the strategy from using minimal Force (since in SR2, force didn't affect the boost) to using maximum Force, which means it costs more to cast, but also more difficult to dispel.

As for grounding, then am I to understand that the official rules for SR3 (no house rules please) is that it only applies when someone has active foci? That a Quickened spell doesn't apply?

If so, then the only real liability to Quickening that I see (aside from the Legal issues) is the issue of Astral Wards. That and your aura probably sticks out (which can be partially mitigated by Masking).

There is no grounding in SR3. You cannot cast a spell from astral space and have its (elemental) effects manifest in physical space.

Yes, the primary liabilities of quickening are passing through wards and barriers and having your aura be that much brighter in astral space. As you said, masking can mitigate that fact. Also, you cannot hide active foci beneath clothes, you can only mask them. The nature of the foci and its power requirements are such that its presence can be detected by astrally perceiving individuals despite being beneath clothing/armor/whatever.

Be aware, though, that there are some unique things out there which are attracted to the kind of astral activity that quickening represents. Namely, Strain III. If you haven't encountered it yet, I'm not going to spoil the surprise, but trust me when I tell you that it's going to wreck your day as a magic user.

Never heard of Strain III. Can you please spoil the surprise?

Being a risk of discovery is one thing; every cyber-user deals with that when confronted with a metal detector or x-ray. People still use illegal cyber because the benefits outweigh the legal and health risks. But if "Strain III" is basically a "GM-fiat-gets-to-screw-the-players-insta-death", then I again ask what's the point of even having a Quickening meta-power?

See MITS pages 90-91.

Never let it get attached to a cyberzombie. Never.

I understand why it might not work to hide it under clothes and I guess I agree with that. But what about inside cyberware? body pockets?

Do you really want all mages to have all their foci surgically attached to the inside of their ribcages? No? Good, now just state that active foci will be astrally visible no matter where on/in a person they are currently held.

If you need a reason, state that the physical body of a living creature does not hamper the astral glow from the focus and the additional coloration can be interpreted with the appropriate assensing test just like any other location of a focus. At worst, this argument can mean that careful examination can assense the gnome attached to the troll's back and hidden from direct view.

That'd be very very bad. It'd open up some serious loopholes. I think that we should stop hijacking and open a new thread.