Full Version: Initiation and Ally spirits...
I was reading MITS, specificially, the section about taking Familiar as an ordeal for initiation. Here's the question: when you take the Familiar ordeal, do you have to pay the karma for both the initiation AND the Ally spirit, or just the ally spirit?
Both. 
But the cost of the Familiar has to be at *least* equal to that of the initiation. So no creating a Force 1 ally spirit with no extras for that 5th grade of initaition. But a Force 10 ally spirit with 100 Karma worth of extras is more than enough to qualify as the Familiar ordeal for your 1st grade of initiation (which you still have to pay for in addition to the Familiar).
But the cost of the Familiar has to be at *least* equal to that of the initiation. So no creating a Force 1 ally spirit with no extras for that 5th grade of initaition. But a Force 10 ally spirit with 100 Karma worth of extras is more than enough to qualify as the Familiar ordeal for your 1st grade of initiation (which you still have to pay for in addition to the Familiar).
the bonus, of course, is that you essentially get 2 magic points by initiating with the Familiar ordeal. the +1 magic from initiating, and the magic point you don't have to give your ally spirit. not a bad deal.
I suddenly feel sorry for everyone who bothered to make one before MitS came out.
| QUOTE (Crimsondude 2.0) |
| I suddenly feel sorry for everyone who bothered to make one before MitS came out. |
Don't. In the 2nd ed Grimoire, there was a little sentence that said the Ally automatically cost as much as the initiation itself. It didn't matter if it would normally be a thousand-karma ally, it cost exactly the same. I for one am glad that loophole is now thouroughly closed.
Not that. The part about how you used to end up with no change in your Magic value because the Initiation's gain of +1 pt. was negated by the -1 from making an Ally.
from a power gaming point of view, id pay 9 karma for a 500,000 karma ally
| QUOTE (Crimsondude 2.0) |
| Not that. The part about how you used to end up with no change in your Magic value because the Initiation's gain of +1 pt. was negated by the -1 from making an Ally. |
Well, at least in 3rd Edition, you couldn't have an Ally Spirit anyway unless you had MitS. If you were using an older sourcebook, then you were using an older sourcebook. And if you were using an older sourcebook for one aspect, you were doubtlessly using it for the other -- such as the old rules for Initiation which were insanely more powerful (considering they gave you every metamagic technique for starters). So while doing so "screwed you" in way of your Familiar, MitS "screwed you" in way of your initiation.
| QUOTE (Crimsondude 2.0 @ Oct 23 2004, 09:55 PM) |
| Not that. The part about how you used to end up with no change in your Magic value because the Initiation's gain of +1 pt. was negated by the -1 from making an Ally. |
I believe that in the Grimoire, you still didn't lose a point of magic to conjure the ally. So don't feel bad at all, the only change was a massive abuse loophole getting nailed shut.
| QUOTE |
| So while doing so "screwed you" in way of your Familiar, MitS "screwed you" in way of your initiation. |
Not quite. Graduated initation was first introduced in Awakenings, so all MitS did was make a previously reccomended rule into the canon one.
Ah, indeed. Probably a good thing I never made one.
As for getting access to all the metamagic there were only six until Awakenings was released, and at each point the GM could limit the access to new metamagics until MitS made it mandatory. Besides, most of the powers weren't really useful when you were running a Grade 0 or 1 Initiate (Grade 0 also sucked, and good riddance).
As for getting access to all the metamagic there were only six until Awakenings was released, and at each point the GM could limit the access to new metamagics until MitS made it mandatory. Besides, most of the powers weren't really useful when you were running a Grade 0 or 1 Initiate (Grade 0 also sucked, and good riddance).
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