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FrostyNSO
I have heard (and very vaguely remember) that Rockers used to be a character archetype, actually with a description in the books.

What is the premise for the "Rocker"? Why does he run the Shadows? Is he a rocker first, or a shadowrunner first? Are Rocker shadowrnners common? If you're playing a Rocker elf, are you required to sport a mullet?
Zeel De Mort
I remember you got them in CP2020 anyway. I think. Don't know where they were in SR, but I wouldn't be much surprised if they did exist in an earlier edition.
Fortune
QUOTE (FrostyNSO)
If you're playing a Rocker elf, are you required to sport a mullet?

Why wouldn't you?

Rockers were in SR1.
DrJest
Yes, the Rocker was an archetype from SR1. The biggest problem with it was finding a reason why they were running the shadows. For your basic garage bands and low-income pub-circuit talent, I suppose it was a means for extra cash (especially if SINless) or to finance your ongoing bid for fame and fortune.

There was also a media sourcebook, Shadowbeat (my copy of which mysteriously disappeared some years ago dammit) that included a segment on musicians. It categorised performes by their fame, and noted that the more famous a rocker was the less successful he'd be as a runner (I believe the quote was: "Hey - wasn't that..?" "Sure was! Wonder what he was doing in our R&D lab?")

I could see a SINless pub-circuit rocker making a good Face for a team when gigs were thin on the ground.
GrinderTheTroll
The Rocker archtype had to be one of the more confusing ones in SR1. I suppose you could akin them to "The Face" contact from SR3, but we all just laughed everytime we saw The Rocker.

/boggle.
DrJest
She looked pretty dire, actually. The last time I saw someone like that, I woke up to them after Iron Maiden at the Hammersmith Odeon and about a dozen pints wink.gif
GrinderTheTroll
Her or the Wage Mage, LOL.
DrJest
Heh, yeah, competing for Slightly Suspect Slapper of the Year award 2050 smile.gif More Tim Bradstreet, say I.
Fortune
I've had worse. eek.gif biggrin.gif
Kanada Ten
The rocker archetype is one of the better examples of how Shadowrun wasn't all about "steal the secret prototype" but also included elements of the underworld (and what a great game it is to have a simstar running from her past of Mafia bankrolling, Yakuza modifications and drug habits) and the media (in the nanosecond world of the future where fame fades faster than washable ink in the machine how does on pay for their rock and roll lifestyle? blackmail? scams? could she be a con artist?). The collision of law, life, fame and favors - that's the rocker.
Crimsondude 2.0
What a novel idea--a celebrity running from their shadowy past. It's make a good pre-gen adventure, I bet.

Shadowbeat is one of those SR1 books I enjoy for the visceral experience--especially the humor (as opposed to the pathological sence of dread you get reading the UB sourcebook, or Bug City in probably the only good example of such writing in SR2).

But, yeah, it had rules for playing a Rocker, Simstar, or Reporter, as well as a couple of archetypes. I especially enjoy the idea of a Performance Test.

Shadowbeat also introduced the Open Test.
Kanada Ten
QUOTE
What a novel idea--a celebrity running from their shadowy past. It's make a good pre-gen adventure, I bet.

frown.gif <sniffle> I wasn't saying it was my idea <sniffle> nyahnyah.gif
Crimsondude 2.0
I'd hope not.
Zen Shooter01
I liked the Rocker, and want to see it rise again in SR3.

Instead of a street gang, your PCs could be a band seeking gigs, shelter, and a recording contract while trying to survive in the urban jungle. And Rockers made very interesting NPCs.

But the real value of the Rocker material were the solid rules about performance skills, which SR3 doesn't have - not even in SOTA64, with the Artist's Way Adept.
FrostyNSO
Isn't it just an open test?
CircuitBoyBlue
Actually, the open test was multiplied by charisma, with some modifiers for good equipment or having a Sasquatch in the band.

I found the rules a little constricting for other types of performances. We usually house rule it so that if it's something like writing a novel, you multiply by the average of charisma and intelligence, because it seems like a good book relies as much on the author having intelligence and good perception as it does on charisma. Still doesn't feel perfect, but you're right; it's better than anything in 2nd or 3rd editions.

The reporter archetype rules were pretty neat, too. Haven't come across a chance to use them, but I can easily see one. I had an idea once about having a group of political operatives using those rules. Of course, they'd be highly unethical, basically running around trying to dig up dirt about the other guy (which is fine), and then when they failed setting him up in compromising situations in pre-arranged conditions conducive to the rotodrone with the holocam getting a good shot (not so much). But alas, this hasn't happened yet. Just as well, I still haven't thoroughly read the rules on pix value and how stories get spiked and what-not. All this time with the book, and only the sections on popular entertainment have really gotten my attention.
Mr. Man
QUOTE (FrostyNSO)
What is the premise for the "Rocker"?

The source for the rocker archtype in SR was probably Eclipse by John Shirley. The only worthwhile part of this book (and the part that shows how a rocker-type character could plausibly become involved with runner-types) is excerpted in Mirrorshades.
Wounded Ronin
There's something supremely badass about a game system that effectively gets sidetracked into rules about throwing good rock concerts but spends the rest of its time on blowing things up with guns that can actually kill you instead of doing d4 damage.
Zen Shooter01
The reporter was another great idea that's gone by the wayside. The 6th World -- and the 5th, as we all know -- is soaked in media. Somebody digs all that up, and they get paid ridiculous money for it. If I had pictures of Britney Spears sunbathing topless, I could make 100 grand in about two hours.

It was an interesting campaign alternative that's been sadly ignored in SR3.
Wounded Ronin
I think that's because a lot of people don't understand how most reporters are incredibly frantic and running around everywhere trying to get an exciting story with general applicability.
Snow_Fox
most people have commented onthe official entrys for "Rocker"- SR 1st Ed and Shadowbeat- I love the line about "Wasn't that?" I visualize Bruce springstein with a rocket launcher.

as for why, I can only think of the anti-establishment message of such diverse people at Arlo Guthrie and Twisted Sister.

Hard core punkers might be more willing to just get off on the mindless destruction. "Frag me man, we trashed that lab good." "Yeah, like that time when we got toasted in Windsor with those twin groupies and burned up the hotel room."

More message oriented rockers might be more willing to do runs for the right cause. "If four people do it, they might htink it's an organization, an' if 50 people doit a day, they might htink it's am obvement and that's what it is, the alice's Restaurant anti-massacree movement and all you got to do to join it is to sing out the next time it comes around on the guitar....You want to end war and stuff you gotta sing out loud."- Arlo Guthrie
mfb
it could be part of the image, i guess. the rocker portrays himself as a cool, fight-the-system shadowrunner; in order to market himself (assuming he lacks corp backing), he's gotta have some street cred.
Edward
I would think that many corp backed rockers would portray themselves as badass shadow runners, because they are far to valuable to actually risk on a real run that is what stunt doubles are for.

Now that would be an interesting adventure. “I want you to do this run and get recognised as our star but not leave enough evidence for a prosecution”

In truth all his runs are probably simulated and he has pistols (posing with hand canons) 1(6)

Edward
Crimsondude 2.0
Like the hooks in PR to set up milk runs that the football player troll from the Seahawks can participate in.

Fun stuff.
Zen Shooter01
You're all thinking of Fred Durst as shadowrunner. But a lot can be done with a struggling band trying to make it in the Barrens, dodging exploitative managers, vampire groupies, gang violence, drug problems, the police, whatever, while hunting for gigs and a big recordng deal.

You're all right - why the heck would a media megastar run on the side? Which is why the band starts out as media nobodies.
Crimsondude 2.0
Reads the Durst comment. Ouch.

Anyway, I see your point about the rocker-runner. it makes sense, and it's an interesting hook on their motivations--short-term and long-term.

Megacelebrities would run because controversy moves units. Other than that, well there's the example of the player in PR. Or there are method actors and mad-genius directors who want them to do hands-on research for that new runner sim where the superstar finally plays a bad guy uber-runner, and being able to put 5 bullets into two people in 1.4s is great--against dummies. But the director wants the real deal, and he has an impressive string of sims to his credit.
Cray74
QUOTE (FrostyNSO)
What is the premise for the "Rocker"? Why does he run the Shadows?


I think rockers lacked a premise, and thus were removed as an archetype.
Fortune
That's because they weren't really an 'archetype' in the first place. Anyone can be a Rocker ... they just need an appropriate skill.
FlakJacket
QUOTE (Crimsondude 2.0)
Like the hooks in PR to set up milk runs that the football player troll from the Seahawks can participate in.

Sorry, blonde moment. PR?
Fortune
Prime Runners
Zen Shooter01
Fortune, anyone can be a decker, street samurai, face, or covert ops with the appropriate skill(s), too.
hyzmarca
Poser Bands would be interesting. Elf Poser bands, Vampire poser bands, and the best, Elf/Vampire poser bands.

My public would be horrified to learn that the Squatches from Lenny and the Sasquatches are actually Trolls under the influance of Physical Mask.


The best would be a five-person ninja poser band with a Sammy with many oddly placed spurs, a flashy pyro Mage, a heavily surged Minotaur keyboardist known as the "Doktor of Funk", and a lead singer who is a social adept with 12 dice of Athletics (silly ninja backflips). One of them would have to be short and young looking, one of them would have to be cocky to the point of arogance, and one of them would have to be a girl. ALso, one of them would have to be a rigger with the skills to build a realistic looking five-part combining robot.
Kanada Ten
QUOTE (hyzmarca)
The best would be a five-person ninja poser band with a Sammy with many oddly placed spurs, a flashy pyro Mage, a heavily surged Minotaur keyboardist known as the "Doktor of Funk", and a lead singer who is a social adept with 12 dice of Athletics (silly ninja backflips). One of them would have to be short and young looking, one of them would have to be cocky to the point of arogance, and one of them would have to be a girl. ALso, one of them would have to be a rigger with the skills to build a realistic looking five-part combining robot.

You must tell me the name of this band! They'll be famous. FAMOUS I tell you.

notworthy.gif
Fortune
QUOTE (Zen Shooter01 @ Dec 19 2004, 05:29 PM)
Fortune, anyone can be a decker, street samurai, face, or covert ops with the appropriate skill(s), too.

I do understand that, although a few of those would also need the appropriate Cyberware. Any of those would also be pretty piss-poor at their job with only one relevant skill. A Rocker needs only one (arguably knowledge) skill however, and could be any or all of the above, or more.

Archetypes ae examples though, not classes. A character that Decks could also be a Street Sam, Face, Covert-ops, Weapons Tech, and many other roles.

There are a few examples of Rocker-adventurer types in fiction, but my favorite by far was Josie and the Pussycats. biggrin.gif
Kanada Ten
Mine was Frank Sanatra.
Fortune
QUOTE (Kanada Ten)
Mine was Frank Sanatra.

Is that Frank's SINless name? wink.gif
hyzmarca
QUOTE (Kanada Ten)
QUOTE (hyzmarca @ Dec 19 2004, 02:36 AM)
The best would be a five-person ninja poser band with a Sammy with many oddly placed spurs, a flashy pyro Mage, a heavily surged Minotaur keyboardist known as the "Doktor of Funk", and a lead singer who is a social adept with 12 dice of Athletics (silly ninja backflips). One of them would have to be short and young looking, one of them would have to be cocky to the point of arogance, and one of them would have to be a girl.  ALso, one of them would have to be a rigger with the skills to  build a realistic looking five-part combining robot.

You must tell me the name of this band! They'll be famous. FAMOUS I tell you.

notworthy.gif

Super Voltron Ninja Music Squad. They play a lot of 1980's J-pop as well as classic rock ballads.
Kanada Ten
QUOTE (Fortune)
QUOTE (Kanada Ten @ Dec 19 2004, 05:58 PM)
Mine was Frank Sanatra.

Is that Frank's SINless name? wink.gif

It's the illegitimate child of Illinois state representative Jack Franks and musical legend Carlos Santana.
Fortune
Makes sense. biggrin.gif
hobgoblin
QUOTE (mfb)
it could be part of the image, i guess. the rocker portrays himself as a cool, fight-the-system shadowrunner; in order to market himself (assuming he lacks corp backing), he's gotta have some street cred.

hmm, why did that comment make me think of present day rappers?
Zen Shooter01
Artistic skills don't have to be a character or campaign's focus, but instead a good way to provide motivation or just characterization. A Face who runs only until his novel sells, for example.
Snow_Fox
Present rap stars are a great example- not my kind of music so it didn't spring to mind easily, but there's a whole culture of violence. More intelligent ones like Puff Daddy are trying to move beyond the thug look, I think the whole trial thing scared him, but others like ODB took the time inside as part of his cred.
Crimsondude 2.0
Getting shot seven times before your career starts also helps.

Or you can sing about crashing head-on into someone and start winning awards.
Voran
What makes me giggle, if I'm remembering it correctly...is that the version of Rocker in SR1 seemed not like "Hey its the Boss!" or "Hey its the Stones!" but rather "Hey its POISON!" "Hey its White Lion!" Wohooooo!
Crimsondude 2.0
hahaha.

Well, it was written in the waning years of Hair Metal bands.

Plus, I have to wonder how much of SR1 was developed before its release in 1989. It makes sense since they released quite a few SBs written by a small group of people in 1989-90 (viz., Findley and Dowd) over a wide range of topics. They probably had most of Shadowbeat done by late 1989.
RangerJoe
I know this came up recently in a zombie thread (well, not too recently, been off network for nearly two months, but anyhow). When I imagine SR rockers, I imagine Guitar Wolf. I believe this says it all. 'Nuff sed.
FrostyNSO
The SR Rocker is most certainly the progeny of 80's hair bands, that much I remember.

Which is AWESOME.

Now for some reason, I can't picture 'gangsta' rap in the Shadowrun universe. Prolly because my images of SR gangers are all remembered from the 2nd Edition sourcebooks. A lot of them looked like Rockers actually.
Snow_Fox
Think of how they discribe Troll and Ork thrash bands.
Crimsondude 2.0
QUOTE (FrostyNSO @ Dec 19 2004, 08:12 PM)
Now for some reason, I can't picture 'gangsta' rap in the Shadowrun universe.

That's why they added the Or'zet rapper chapter in SOTA64. There are events and people in that book almost identical to RL people and events.

Before that it was all Goblin Rock, which isn't really the same thing now. Is it?
Lantzer
One thing with Rockers. They are a reasonable character subtype for activist-type characters. The basic concept isn't just about the fame and the money - it's about the message. And if they are good at being runners' you don't need to worry about your fame getting you recognized. Masks have been around for centuries. Prosthetic make-up is newer, and very suited to making someone not look like themselves.

Buckaroo Bonzai was a shadowrunning rocker/neurosurgeon/quantum physicist....
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