Full Version: Tattoo Magic
Magic in the Shadows, page 78
| QUOTE |
| One the inks are prepared, the artist can begin work. The size of the tattoo (as measured in square centimeters) must be at least the quickened spell's Force, squared, times 100. |
So, for instance, let's say that someone wants a Force 6 spell quickened to them. The area of the tattoo would be 36x100, right? That's 3600 square centimeters, 1417.323 square inches, 118.110 square feet?? I've been up literally all night and I may be completely backwards on this, but good LORD.
yup.
Damn.
I declare shenanigans.
I declare shenanigans.
I just looked at my MitS and that's what it says...kind of boggles the mind...on the other hand it does sort of provide a limit on powerful a spell one can quicken like that.
1 square inch is 6.4516 square cm (2.54*2.54).
1 square foot is 144 square inches (12*12).
3600 sq. cm = 558 sq. in
558 sq. in = 3.875 sq. ft.
If the rear torso is 2ft by 2ft (4 sq. ft) it could hold it.
A square meter = 100cm x 100cm. = 10,000 sq. cm.
So 3600 sq. cm is about 1/3rd of a square meter.
1 square foot is 144 square inches (12*12).
3600 sq. cm = 558 sq. in
558 sq. in = 3.875 sq. ft.
If the rear torso is 2ft by 2ft (4 sq. ft) it could hold it.
A square meter = 100cm x 100cm. = 10,000 sq. cm.
So 3600 sq. cm is about 1/3rd of a square meter.
Doesn't a square foot have more than 12 square inches?
I thought that 144 square inches made up a square foot, in which case it'd end up as 9.8 square feet for a force 6 spell tattoo.
*shrugs* maths has never been my strong point, so I may well be getting confused, it doesn't take much to get me that way
edit.. beaten to it, but it seems I was only half wrong, looks like my maths is getting better
I thought that 144 square inches made up a square foot, in which case it'd end up as 9.8 square feet for a force 6 spell tattoo.
*shrugs* maths has never been my strong point, so I may well be getting confused, it doesn't take much to get me that way
edit.. beaten to it, but it seems I was only half wrong, looks like my maths is getting better
Which, for most folks is their whole damn body.
| QUOTE (OurTeam) |
| 1 square inch is 6.4516 square cm (2.54*2.54). 1 square foot is 144 square inches (12*12). 3600 sq. cm = 558 sq. in 558 sq. in = 3.875 sq. ft. If the rear torso is 2ft by 2ft (4 sq. ft) it could hold it. A square meter = 100cm x 100cm. = 10,000 sq. cm. So 3600 sq. cm is about 1/3rd of a square meter. |
Yeah, my math sucks...still, I'm pretty tall, but I don't think my back is 2' x 2'.
Yes, which would work for those Yakuza/Japanese full body suit tatoos.
it's worth it, i think. i mean, anything you tattoo above force 4 is basically immune to dispelling, especially if you expend extra karma to raise the effective force even further. i really don't want to see people with more than one undispellable quickened spell on them.
Supposedly, an average adult male has a skin surface area of around 2 square metres, you'd be able to get a fair few spells on that, if you wanted to be totally non-skin coloured.
Obviously a troll or ork would have no problems getting a high force tattoo, assuming they could find someone to do the inking and casting for them.
Obviously a troll or ork would have no problems getting a high force tattoo, assuming they could find someone to do the inking and casting for them.
Well I'm 5'10" and on the skinny side to say the least. An i KNOW i can get 1200 Sq Cm's of tatoo on my chest. It's easy 30cm across and 40cm down. So add in the side's and Back and i could get a Force 5 on my torso, so just add upper arms etc and it's easy done. Now Get someone who's ork or Troll sized (Not that the Yak's will tatoo them mind) and it's easy to rack up some damn hard spells.
| QUOTE (AIM-54 @ Feb 28 2005, 12:28 PM) |
| I'm pretty tall, but I don't think my back is 2' x 2'. |
Yup. You're right. It would take more than just a rear torso unless you were one of those really large gamers.
(or a Sumo wrestler)I just spread out one of my T-shirts (size XL) on a table and measured the rear fabric. It is 24" by 27". So it would take more than just rear torso, it would have to stretch out to my sides and down below my belt-line.
/Edit: Don't go on a diet or you'll lose your spell.
Also limits to how much of your own Tatoo you can do. One of my players was all excited about this untill he realized how much size just a Force 6 would take, how much room would be left after a Force 6 and how much of it he couldn't do himself.
So how many of what force tatoos could you put on your body? Wouldn't Trolls have more space to work with over dwarves?
Any good ideas about how to determine "available tatoo-able area" as a function of Body?
So how many of what force tatoos could you put on your body? Wouldn't Trolls have more space to work with over dwarves?
Any good ideas about how to determine "available tatoo-able area" as a function of Body?
The question that arises then, if you tattoo a force 1 spell on a baby, and the baby grows, stretching out the tattoo, does the force of the spell grow too? ; )
Hum, I know I'm a taller than average, but I could easily have such a tatto (Force 6, 3600 square centimeter) on my torso (front and back) without even needing to use the limbs. Some kind of eastern dragon wrapping around my torso, for example.
It's a lot but I'm sure you've seen the concept art about tattooed warriors from oriental inspired pieces.
The average human bodies has between 14 to 18 square feet of skin (just checked that up on google) and that means according to my calculation between 13006 and 16722 square centimeters.
Enough for one level 12 spell, roughly, or 16 level 3. Of course, Troll have more skins
It's a lot but I'm sure you've seen the concept art about tattooed warriors from oriental inspired pieces.
The average human bodies has between 14 to 18 square feet of skin (just checked that up on google) and that means according to my calculation between 13006 and 16722 square centimeters.
Enough for one level 12 spell, roughly, or 16 level 3. Of course, Troll have more skins
| QUOTE (Smiley @ Feb 28 2005, 01:24 PM) | ||
Magic in the Shadows, page 78
So, for instance, let's say that someone wants a Force 6 spell quickened to them. The area of the tattoo would be 36x100, right? That's 3600 square centimeters, 1417.323 square inches, 118.110 square feet?? I've been up literally all night and I may be completely backwards on this, but good LORD. |
3600 cm^2 is 60cm * 60cm, which is a 23.622 in * 23.622 in. Easily doable on a human.
So, what you forgot to do was consider that while 1in=2.54cm, dividing Xcm^2 by 2.54 doesn't give you in^2. Dividing Xcm^2 by (2.54^2, or 6.4516) gives you in^2. And to get feet, you have to divide not by 12, but by 144 (12^2).
IOW, 3600cm^2/6.4516= 558.0011in^2/144=3.875ft^2. 4 square feet is plenty of room.
Same as OurTeam said.
So, Charon, there a lot of troll Yakuza in your game universe?
A useful article for this discussion is located at Pubmed. I believe access to the full text is free, and has a lot of nifty graphs:
Edward H. Livingston and Scott Lee, "Body surface area prediction in normal-weight and obese patients", Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab. Vol. 281, Issue 3, E586-E591, September 2001
Body Surface Area calculator (using the Dubois equation, which as stated in the above journal article, is inaccurate for obese people and infants):
http://www-users.med.cornell.edu/~spon/pic...alc/bsacalc.htm
Edward H. Livingston and Scott Lee, "Body surface area prediction in normal-weight and obese patients", Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab. Vol. 281, Issue 3, E586-E591, September 2001
Body Surface Area calculator (using the Dubois equation, which as stated in the above journal article, is inaccurate for obese people and infants):
http://www-users.med.cornell.edu/~spon/pic...alc/bsacalc.htm
???????
confused now!
torz x
There's a whoooooole old thread where they calculated various skin areas for the average of each metatype....
Amusing thread.
Amusing thread.
Amusing is one word. I prefer a statement: It's a thread that causes blood to gush from your eyeballs.
| QUOTE (Crimsondude 2.0 @ Feb 28 2005, 05:02 PM) |
| So, Charon, there a lot of troll Yakuza in your game universe? |
Yeah, they earn a lot of kudos point from the oyabun for performing a flawless tea ceremony.
Seriously though, an Oni troll covered in mystic tattoo is vaguely cool and definitely scary for players.
This came up on the list a while back so thank Hahns Shin for this. One common method of calculating Body Surface Area (BSA) is the Mosteller method. The formula is,
BSA (m²) = ( [Ht (cm) · Wt (kg) ]/ 3600 )½
Take the height in centimeters, multiply it by the weight in kilograms, divide by 3600 and then take the square root of that number. As an example take a 5 foot 10 inch, 150 pound person and convert it to metric - 177.8 cm, 68.2 kg. This'd give you a BSA of something along the lines of 1.84 meters squared or 18,353 square centimeters.
On arms and legs area, the best guesstimate is the 'rule of nine' one. This says that each arm is nine percent of the total BSA, each leg is double that - eighteen percent, the front and back are eighteen percent each, the head adds another eight percent leaving two percent or so for unmentionables and miscellaneous bits. All of this is from the New England Journal of Medicine, with another plastic surgery textbook saying that the neck apparently takes up 1/15 of the total BSA.
Of course these figures are for regular humans only, metahumans are going to throw things off a fair bit.
BSA (m²) = ( [Ht (cm) · Wt (kg) ]/ 3600 )½
Take the height in centimeters, multiply it by the weight in kilograms, divide by 3600 and then take the square root of that number. As an example take a 5 foot 10 inch, 150 pound person and convert it to metric - 177.8 cm, 68.2 kg. This'd give you a BSA of something along the lines of 1.84 meters squared or 18,353 square centimeters.
On arms and legs area, the best guesstimate is the 'rule of nine' one. This says that each arm is nine percent of the total BSA, each leg is double that - eighteen percent, the front and back are eighteen percent each, the head adds another eight percent leaving two percent or so for unmentionables and miscellaneous bits. All of this is from the New England Journal of Medicine, with another plastic surgery textbook saying that the neck apparently takes up 1/15 of the total BSA.
Of course these figures are for regular humans only, metahumans are going to throw things off a fair bit.
| QUOTE (FlakJacket) |
| Of course these figures are for regular humans only, metahumans are going to throw things off a fair bit. |
ya know, i really dont think they'd be THAT significalnt of a difference, perhaps a percent here or there, but aren't most meta's relatively proportional to humans?
Elves i would think would be about the same.
trolls might be longer in the arms and legs, with slightly less torso?
dwarves are relatively proprotional.... though perhaps given their density you might have to do some playing with the weight...
it would just be the base number that would change....
| QUOTE (FlakJacket) |
| This came up on the list a while back so thank Hahns Shin for this. |
Wow. That was a long time ago, I think... 2 years maybe?
| QUOTE (Crimsondude 2.0) |
| So, what you forgot to do was consider that while 1in=2.54cm, dividing Xcm^2 by 2.54 doesn't give you in^2. Dividing Xcm^2 by (2.54^2, or 6.4516) gives you in^2. And to get feet, you have to divide not by 12, but by 144 (12^2). IOW, 3600cm^2/6.4516= 558.0011in^2/144=3.875ft^2. 4 square feet is plenty of room. |
Woo, THAT makes a bit more sense. Thanks. I've never been a mathematician by any means.
I withdraw my previous declaration of shenanigans.
| QUOTE (hahnsoo) |
| Wow. That was a long time ago, I think... 2 years maybe? |
A little over three years actually. Since it was such a handy post I saved it.
| QUOTE (Smiley @ Feb 28 2005, 04:39 PM) | ||
Woo, THAT makes a bit more sense. Thanks. I've never been a mathematician by any means. I withdraw my previous declaration of shenanigans. |
Neither am I. I just had a high school chemistry teacher (actually, I had the easy one, who was taught by the other) who was a tremendous hardass (academically) who made us do proofs forever. Cool guy. Hard class.
The first thing I did when I read your post was mentally make a list of fractions, conversion multipliers, and variables.
You bastard.
| QUOTE (Charon) |
| Seriously though, an Oni troll covered in mystic tattoo is vaguely cool and definitely scary for players. |
Oni are an ork metavariant, not troll!
Which begs the quiestion (and I've no MitS at hand to tell me) -- Can you make these tattoos on other people? I happen to have a mundane PC with an awakened PC as an uncle who knows enchanting. And he has knowledge: tattoo designs himself.
Would the uncle be able to cast, say, improved initiative +3 dice on his nephews tattoo?
Would the uncle be able to cast, say, improved initiative +3 dice on his nephews tattoo?
IIRC it doesn't work that way, the tattoo has to be specifically designed and ink prepared to act as a focus. It has to be specifically done that way from the beginning, and I believe a special skill is involved, and a metamagic.
Ah... Bugger. So much for my PCs plans of being the fastest mundane draw that ever lived.
But it is still possible to have a mage perform this procedure on someone else. In fact, that would be the only way for someone to get something like a Force 6 spell, seeing as it would be all but impossible to do the job on yourself.
Here are some notes I made from a previous thread.
[ Spoiler ]
| QUOTE (tisoz) |
| Here are some notes I made from a previous thread. |
Hey, thanks a lot, tisoz!
| QUOTE (nezumi) |
| The question that arises then, if you tattoo a force 1 spell on a baby, and the baby grows, stretching out the tattoo, does the force of the spell grow too? ; ) |
Tatooing babies? Hmm, that's very shadowrunny.
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