Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: Delta Cyber removed turns into...?
Dumpshock Forums > Discussion > Shadowrun
malichai
Assuming that you can successfully remove Delta grade cyberware from someone, what is it then considered?

Used Beta? New Beta? If you have a connection to sell cyber at full value, would it sell for the value of a piece of new beta cyber or a piece of used beta cyber?

If you installed it into someone else, would it be installed as beta-grade without any stress points or as standard used beta cyber?

I realize this probably isn't detailed anywhere, so what are your judgement calls on this?
Fresno Bob
It becomes a beautiful butterfly.

Ostensibly, as it is custom fitted, it would be worthless to someone else.
Lindt
Beta with stress points (aka VERY expsenive repairs)
malichai
QUOTE (Voorhees)
It becomes a beautiful butterfly.

Ostensibly, as it is custom fitted, it would be worthless to someone else.

No, according to Man and Machine, page 11:

"Used deltaware cannot be purchased, but if you can otherwise acquire it, you can have it installed as if it were betaware." So it's still useful to others.

Regular cyberware turns into used cyberware
Alpha cyberware turns into used alpha cyberware
Beta cyberware turns into used beta cyberware

Delta cyberware turns into used beta cyberware
or
Delta cyberware turns into beta cyberware
Krazy
IMG I would place a very high target for successful removal of the ware (because of the integrated nature) and a high TN for implantation due the the custom nature of delta. betaware can possibly match another person, whereas delta is very custom, so if you use the old delta as a base, and have a surgeon with the tech and the know how, it would work. but as beta essence. I don't use stress points, unless the cyber is obviously damaged. but I tell the PC were they got hit based on damage caused, what was showing, etc.
hyzmarca
Deltaware wouldn't be that difficult to remove, you just have to get rid of all of the fleshy bits. Remember, when a runner picks up used Deltaware in the field it won't be from a willing doner. It probably won't even be from a living doner unless the characters are particulary sadistic.

Samurai just says "That is some whiz dermal sheathing." It took 5 shots to take that guy down. They usualy go down in two. I want it." then pulls out his combat knife and vat of fleh eating worms. No biotech skill required. So long as he cuts through the fleshy bits and avoids the metal and plastic bits it'll be alright Its not difficult. Bioware, that requires a Biotech test.
BitBasher
Actually it requires a biotech test to remove any cyberware or bioware, there's even rules for cyber removal in the books. To sucessfully remove beta the TN isn't very happy.
hyzmarca
The rules for cyberware removal are in man and machine under the surgery rules. Everything in that section implicitly assumes that the surgeon intends for the patient to live. Hacking appart a dead bodyisn't surgery. It is, at best, taxidermy.
SpasticTeapot
On the other hand, you have to consider that nano-sized tendrils are extruded from cyberware into huge amounts of bodily tissues. With the exception of spurs (which need new custom-made bone mounts), dermal plating (which needs a little alteration) and bone plating (which is only good for scrap unless you're the original owner's clone), it's no small matter to get the thing out without destroying many of the expensive bits. Admittedly, this is easier if you're not worrying about the tissues you're removing the 'ware from, but either way it's a tricky thing to do.
I might put the TN on a sliding scale; if the surgeon wants to leave the original owner alive and save a good deal of the nano-connections, there's no modifier; wheras if the surgeon is trying to rip out all the major components with the intention of replacing all the connections or merely integrating it into a lesser form of the 'ware's connections (for example, Wired Reflexes II to Wired Reflexees III), drop it to something lower.
Sandoval Smith
QUOTE (hyzmarca)
The rules for cyberware removal are in man and machine under the surgery rules. Everything in that section implicitly assumes that the surgeon intends for the patient to live. Hacking appart a dead bodyisn't surgery. It is, at best, taxidermy.

Just hacking apart a body isn't going to net you very good cyberware either. Especially for those really delicate bits, like eyes, or probably most anything with a DNI, perfect removal will be pretty much impossible. That's why used delta gets the downgrade (that, and fitting something custom fitted for someone than the current recipient is going to have problems of its own).
Wounded Ronin
Hey, I know. If you want cybereyes, chop of the whole head.
hyzmarca
Right, then you throw it in a vat of flesh eating worms. Wait a week and nothing will be left but bone and electronics.

Although Idid always assume that the nanowires that connect to the nervous system were packaged seperatly and connected during surgery. Considering how delicate they must be there would always be the possibility of one being broken during handling and it was just be easier for the surgeon to connect the wires to the nervous system first then connect them to the cyberware.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Dumpshock Forums © 2001-2012