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Large Mike

I could have just emailed him directly, but I think the SR public would be interested in this:

McMackie, will you be making a character generator for fourth edition?

If not, what sort of donation would make you reconsider?
frostPDP
And by donation, we mean "How much can we pay you to do this for us?"

I would love to see a chargen program and the like, but I would love for some form of house-rule input to exist as well. If that's not possible, no big deal but its still a great idea!
Jrayjoker
I am a big fan of the current incarnation, and would fully support (financially if necessary) the development of a SR4 generator.
DrJest
I think most of us would be prepared to chip in a few quid to persuade the man smile.gif I think NSRCG sees a heck of a lot of use anyway (and not just for PC's - took me a fraction of the time to whip up some NPC's for a projected run recently). Of course, first find out if McMackie plans to play SR4... wink.gif
Eldritch
Guys, I don't think Mackie has posted in DS since the announcement......
Aku
doesnt really look like he has been around

QUOTE (mcMakie's info)

mcmackie  Posted on: Mar 20 2005, 03:50 PM


is his last post, so if he's here, he's not showing it.
Eldritch
Yeah, I'd been following his board over in CP, his lack of posting came about the same time SR4 was announced frown.gif
Jrayjoker
Maybe he died of shock.
Shadow
Well, since SR4 is completly different than SR3 it isn't like he can just modify the curent program. He would have to start over from scratch. That would be a heck of a lot of work that he may not be willing to do. For any amount of money.
FrostyNSO
I'd be pretty frustrated if my labour of love was just essentially made obsolete by one press release.
Jrayjoker
Who knows unless he decides to fill us in?

The NSRCG will always have its adherents and users. Just look at all the folks here who will not be using SR4.
Edward
Considering the arguments over SR4ís worth I would be very surprised if he would give a firm yes before he has at lest looked at the system.

Edward
Shadow
It may be a coincident but I think his silence speaks volumes.
Fahr
McMackie has been very busy with his real job lately. (from his e-mail to me when he sent me the NSRCG3 source)

I am thinking of starting on a NSRCG4 if he doesn't have the time. but I would obviously need the books first smile.gif

that is likely why there has been little talk of a next gen, I don't know enough to know if I would be diving into a little work or a lot, and wether of not it would even be neccesary to have a char generator.

-Fahr
Eldritch
smile.gif Maybe SR4 will be so simple, so streamlied you'll only need an abacus to create a character!


GaiasWrath8
Well if any one makes a new CG, please make sure you have the cyber limb thing down. There were so many problems with it.

1. Each cyber limb or partial cyber limb lessened the cost and essence of a bunch of items when installed together.
2. ECU lessened when you Alpha or Beta the limb.
3. Unbalanced str or qui? Good luck with that one.

There are a few other little things, like the eyes and ears always taking .5 essence, but this is not true if you alpha grade them.

Bla Bla, don't get me wronge, I love the CG and would not be able to play on-line with out it. smile.gif I just wanted to put in my two sence.

Then again, in SR4 they might not even have cyber limbs the way we think of them.
GrinderTheTroll
What would be great, is if in general, RPG game manufactures started creating these tools and made them available for download. Since so much can be done with software and RPGs, it almost seems a waste to not have some program, database or files to help GMs and players.
mcmackie
Sorry, been kinda of chilling and not reading the boards. One of you was kind enuff to send me the link so that I could chime in... hmm (rubs chin, pretends to think about it)...
As some said, it would depend on how the rules are implemented. I've offered up my code to any interested parties so it could be used as a framework...
That said, to do it right... it should be done in Java so that it could be supported on multiple platforms (anybody volunteering?). I have some ideas about that as well. I use Visual Basic 6 because Paolo's original code was in VB4. It would be an incredible amount of code to redo in another language.
I'm conflicted about the "simple" nature of the proposed changes. On one hand, it is much easier to code rules that follow a basic guideline with no exceptions. On the other hand, those exceptions sometimes give the "flavor" of the game.
For example, I'm working on the MJBB alternate generation rules. One of the basic rules that is messing with me is:
1) If using point-based generation
2) Attributes cost 2 points
3) Unless you're doing low-level generation
4) and the attribute you're working on is over 4
5) then your point cost is 3
Before I could do a simple tradeoff, now I got all kinds of complications. What if you change your mind about an attribute and reduce it, now I've got to give you back 3 points instead of 2 (if over 4) etc.
On the other hand, the rule is in place to encourage the creation of non-olympic (above average) characters. If you remove it, you might lose the 'flavor'.
The current character generation system is rife with these kinds of exceptions so I can see the attraction of 'simplifying'. (You don't want to see my code! smile.gif )
I really need to see the new rules before I can weigh in.
Note: I really don't play much anymore but the community has been great and I felt I owed it to maintain the generator. What this means, is that depending on the difficulty, the challenge, and Real Life ™, will determine what happens.
Note2: I'm not a college student (graduated almost 20 years ago) so while donations are appreciated (really! helps buy books), they're not the sole incentive. biggrin.gif (yes, I'm really that old!) eek.gif
Eldritch
Whew!

SR4-WTF?
Given that laundry list of SR3 exceptions needed in your code I would be a bit surprised if much code beyond some data lists of spells and equipment, with edits, will be worth carrying forward. There will still be SR4 exceptions, but large contiguous sections of overlap seems unlikely. The actual rules text will bear it out one way or another.

Plus that is a good point about a Java rewrite anyway for portability reasons.

Too bad Fanpro doesn't have WotC level resources available. The Character Generator that shipped with D&D 3.0 was a great addition to the rules that didn't require a fan to pour all his sweat into it, and allowed it to be available when the rules first shipped.
Jrayjoker
QUOTE (SR4-WTF? @ Jun 6 2005, 08:05 PM)
Too bad Fanpro doesn't have WotC level resources available. The Character Generator that shipped with D&D 3.0 was a great addition to the rules that didn't require a fan to pour all his sweat into it, and allowed it to be available when the rules first shipped.

I found the program they provided a bit cumbersome, especially for their level of resources. And having it locked for higher level and specialty characters without providing an update really dissapointed me.
SR4-WTF?
QUOTE (Jrayjoker)
QUOTE (SR4-WTF? @ Jun 6 2005, 08:05 PM)
Too bad Fanpro doesn't have WotC level resources available. The Character Generator that shipped with D&D 3.0 was a great addition to the rules that didn't require a fan to pour all his sweat into it, and allowed it to be available when the rules first shipped.

I found the program they provided a bit cumbersome, especially for their level of resources. And having it locked for higher level and specialty characters without providing an update really dissapointed me.

It wasn't perfect, for example you couldn't equip magic items you bought to have it update the character. But it is still a great quick basic NPC tool. I don't often use specialty classes for NPCs anyway, plenty of power and flexibility in the base classes. You suppositely could also configure it's data tables, but I never bothered with that sort of thing.

No update for it, not even for 3.5 I believe, but there eventually was a another program they sold that had an incompatible file save format. It did lots of PCs, monsters, some map stuff, and random treasures. I never have used it though.
Tanka
While I personally think Java is a waste of a language, I do agree that NSRCG should be multi-platform. And, sadly, the only language that is known in the CompSci industry for that is Java.

I may pick Java back up eventually, and if so I'd be willing to write a few helpful functions (maybe try to keep the .dat usage?) for it -- if not code some of the more "Ow, brain!" bits and pieces.

...This is all assuming I'll be able to afford the books when they come out, heh...
Gyro the Greek Sandwich Pirate
QUOTE (mcmackie)
"That said, to do it right... it should be done in Java so that it could be supported on multiple platforms..."

A Mac user salutes you, sir!

Not that that might be such an issue anymore, but shmeh...it's the thought that counts. biggrin.gif
Kagetenshi
It'll still be an issue. Well, unless you dual-boot or run something like Virtual PC, and in the second case that means it isn't an issue now (last I checked NSRCG isn't the most resource-intensive program).

Maybe Python rather than Java?

~J
BlackSmith
I could do some Java bashing IF it is allowed to make new homepage for the program (no offence McMackie).

Keeping in .dat is good idea IF it is included also information about essence/weight/price reducions from other items. (e.g. IF instaled=cyberarm THEN EssenceCost = EssenceCost - 0,20)
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