Something i've been wondering.
Lets say a person gets himself cloned, and through the wonders of deus ex machina, the clone comes out well.
Would it be possible for the clone to awaken -as a adept for sake of argument- if the person who was cloned was a mundane?
Any ideas or suggested reading on the matter is, as always, greatly appreciated.
Full Version: Cloning and the Awakened
No. Magic potential is genetic and so a cloned body wouldn't work. At least in canon no one has tracked down the metagene that makes you Awakened (although at least one corp is close), so it'd probably take more than your typical deus ex machina to pull that one off - then again, if you've somehow managed to handwave your way past the problematic "blank slate" aspect of cloning, this shouldn't be too much of a problem.
Not in SR3. Would not hold my breath for SR4, but who knows how wacky that is gonna get?
Full human cloning is not possible in SR3, usually something stated about the brain and nervous system. So the mundane clone being an adept is moot.
If you houserule that clones are possible, you may as well go another step and houserule they are magical or shapeshifters or whatever.
[edit] pretty much what Synner said only slower [/edit]
Full human cloning is not possible in SR3, usually something stated about the brain and nervous system. So the mundane clone being an adept is moot.
If you houserule that clones are possible, you may as well go another step and houserule they are magical or shapeshifters or whatever.
[edit] pretty much what Synner said only slower [/edit]
The Blank slate issue isn't really a problem if you see the clone as a long-term investment, a child to raise in our image, or spare parts.
However, the metagene problem isn't easy to work around. If you altered it geneticly it wouldn't really be your clone, anyway. It would be a geneticly engineered life form.
The best bet is invitro-fertilization using genetic material from an awakened doner. If you make a few dozen babies with a magician there is a good chance that one of them will end up having a measurable magic potential.
For an army of corp-brainwashed magical assasins it is just as easy to clone an actual Adept. It would be a 5 to 10 year investment for the corp but it will pay off when high ranking members of rival corporations are killed by preteen girl scouts.
However, the metagene problem isn't easy to work around. If you altered it geneticly it wouldn't really be your clone, anyway. It would be a geneticly engineered life form.
The best bet is invitro-fertilization using genetic material from an awakened doner. If you make a few dozen babies with a magician there is a good chance that one of them will end up having a measurable magic potential.
For an army of corp-brainwashed magical assasins it is just as easy to clone an actual Adept. It would be a 5 to 10 year investment for the corp but it will pay off when high ranking members of rival corporations are killed by preteen girl scouts.
| QUOTE (Synner) |
| No. Magic potential is genetic and so a cloned body wouldn't work. At least in canon no one has tracked down the metagene that makes you Awakened (although at least one corp is close), so it'd probably take more than your typical deus ex machina to pull that one off - then again, if you've somehow managed to handwave your way past the problematic "blank slate" aspect of cloning, this shouldn't be too much of a problem. |
If you make an exect, genetic copy of an awakened individual, wouldn't they awaken as well?
If Magic is genetic that is. You don't need to know which gene makes the person magic, your copying all of them.
Now if you were trying to make a genetically engineered supersoldier - Dark Angel, Soldier, etc, then no. No magic. Even if you cloned an awakened, then tried to genetically augnment you might run the risk of damaging the magic gene.
I think the latest canon theory is that it's a mix of genetic and environmental. Meaning that you need the right genes in the right setup, but that environmental conditions which are not yet quantified need to exist also to trigger awakening.
Meaning the exact clone copy of an awakened individual would have the necessary genes (we can assume) but might not experience the same environmental conditions that trigger awakening.
Meaning the exact clone copy of an awakened individual would have the necessary genes (we can assume) but might not experience the same environmental conditions that trigger awakening.
It's complicated. If you can create an exact clone (Dolly the parasheep would not count) then they would have the same potential to Awaken...however, because it has yet to be determined what factor(s) decide the range of a person's Talent, it is unpredictable how that Awakening would express (i.e. a cloned adept might well express as a diviner or conjuror, a cloned burnout might result in a physical magician or a d-class magician).
A wounded magician has to recieve cloned spareparts, if he wishes to avoid essence loss.
That, to me, makes it pretty obvious that the magic is in the genes.
But cloning a baby, and cloning a "blank slate" adult are two different things. Its quite easy to argue that aggressive use of growth enhancing chemicals can kill off the magical nature of a clones DNA.
But produce enough cloned babies, or indeed just children, of an awakened individual, and yes you will produce mages. The quota is 1/100 among everybody, and its semi-canon, that Awakened individuals have increased chance of siring Awakened children.
But, since you can't measure magical ability until the, what, low teens? - Its a considerate investment for a corp to use this method. - Especially when there is such a large open genepool to adopt from. I'm betting there's alot of SIN-less parents who'd sell their awakened child for money, or even a life inside a corp enclave, with security and ok resources.
That solution is ALOT cheaper than cloning mages. Mages are rare, but not THAT rare.
That, to me, makes it pretty obvious that the magic is in the genes.
But cloning a baby, and cloning a "blank slate" adult are two different things. Its quite easy to argue that aggressive use of growth enhancing chemicals can kill off the magical nature of a clones DNA.
But produce enough cloned babies, or indeed just children, of an awakened individual, and yes you will produce mages. The quota is 1/100 among everybody, and its semi-canon, that Awakened individuals have increased chance of siring Awakened children.
But, since you can't measure magical ability until the, what, low teens? - Its a considerate investment for a corp to use this method. - Especially when there is such a large open genepool to adopt from. I'm betting there's alot of SIN-less parents who'd sell their awakened child for money, or even a life inside a corp enclave, with security and ok resources.
That solution is ALOT cheaper than cloning mages. Mages are rare, but not THAT rare.
| QUOTE (weblife) |
| A wounded magician has to recieve cloned spareparts, if he wishes to avoid essence loss. That, to me, makes it pretty obvious that the magic is in the genes. But cloning a baby, and cloning a "blank slate" adult are two different things. Its quite easy to argue that aggressive use of growth enhancing chemicals can kill off the magical nature of a clones DNA. But produce enough cloned babies, or indeed just children, of an awakened individual, and yes you will produce mages. The quota is 1/100 among everybody, and its semi-canon, that Awakened individuals have increased chance of siring Awakened children. But, since you can't measure magical ability until the, what, low teens? - Its a considerate investment for a corp to use this method. - Especially when there is such a large open genepool to adopt from. I'm betting there's alot of SIN-less parents who'd sell their awakened child for money, or even a life inside a corp enclave, with security and ok resources. That solution is ALOT cheaper than cloning mages. Mages are rare, but not THAT rare. |
The problem with piking up mages in their teens is that you have more than a decade worth of social conditioning to overcome. In some cases that will be easy. In other cases that will be very hard. If you want someone who will be loyal to the corp above all else then someone raised and trained by the corp would be a much more reliable resource. If you pick up SINless kids out of the Barrens then you risk picking someone with gang affiliations or moral scruples that are stronger than their obligations to the corporation.
It works for the wagemage but not the top secret special operative.
that's where brain washing comes in. 
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