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Arethusa
post Mar 16 2005, 04:46 AM
Post #1


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Suffice it to say that most of the old timers around here know I think a lot of SR3 was crap(py), but primarily, that I saw combat and weaponry as the most easily fixed (and, to some degree, most necessary to fix). For a while, I actively pursued a revised ruleset, though due to real life and community lack of interest, I eventually left it on indefinite (and likely now permanent) hiatus. I also worked on new rules for dying and staying conscious that (hopefully) made a hell of a lot more sense, and a set of canon compatible new guns that never saw much of a response. Raygun obviously has his set of well known rules, though those mostly stay within SR3 as much as possible. Austere never got around to putting up a website (because he is a very bad person), but he uses three part damage codes (probably the first thing that occurred to me as missing and necessary when I started getting into SR3 a bit over a year and a half ago) and has really quite detailed rules.

So, really, primer over with, I'm wondering where the Dumpshock is on the issue of more realistic weapons rules now that SR4 is on the horizon. Personally, beyond wanting the rules to finally be sensible and internally consistent, I'd really appreciate rules consistent with real life. Even Spycraft, which deviates heavily from reality in its rules in order to create a specific effect (ie it's a game about James Bond and Cate Archer, not a realistic combat and espionage sim), has managed a very admirable amount of realism in its handling of combat and weapons. I would very much like SR to finally take note of this and stop beating everyone senseless with the Abstraction Stick. Of course, then there's melee, which is simultaneously worse off and harder to fix for a number of reasons.

And, since I've heard that developers will likely read this, get your opinions out.

And hire some of us as consultants! Self interest rocks! And I hear that Raygun guy is ok, too. Austere's kind of a jerk, though.
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Posts in this topic
- Arethusa   SR4 Firearms   Mar 16 2005, 04:46 AM
- - Austere Emancipator   Thanks for the vote of confidence. Frankly, I agr...   Mar 16 2005, 10:28 AM
- - Critias   For the most part, I'm fine (in a "this i...   Mar 16 2005, 10:46 AM
- - Raygun   Well, I hate to say it guys, but I think any reque...   Mar 16 2005, 11:09 AM
- - Smed   They are likely to be very far along in the proces...   Mar 16 2005, 01:45 PM
- - Catsnightmare   Either way, I'm just hoping heavy pistols get ...   Mar 16 2005, 02:04 PM
- - Smed   QUOTE (Catsnightmare) Either way, I'm just hop...   Mar 16 2005, 02:18 PM
- - mmu1   One thing I'm hoping for is a revision of the ...   Mar 16 2005, 02:50 PM
- - Zen Shooter01   There are reasons for these weirdnesses. Whether y...   Mar 16 2005, 02:44 PM
- - Grinder   Realism and rpg rules mostly aren't compatible...   Mar 16 2005, 03:10 PM
- - MYST1C   QUOTE (Zen Shooter01)If you reduce HP damage to 7M...   Mar 16 2005, 03:17 PM
- - Austere Emancipator   QUOTE (Zen Shooter01)Heavy pistols have such a ste...   Mar 16 2005, 04:46 PM
- - MYST1C   QUOTE (Austere Emancipator)QUOTE (M¥$T1C)Like...   Mar 16 2005, 05:41 PM
- - GrinderTheTroll   I'm going to venture a guess that in the inter...   Mar 16 2005, 05:50 PM
- - Kagetenshi   QUOTE (Austere Emancipator) As body armor manufact...   Mar 16 2005, 06:00 PM
- - GrinderTheTroll   QUOTE (M¥$T1C) But IMHO the SR damage codes d...   Mar 16 2005, 06:13 PM
- - Critias   QUOTE (Kagetenshi) Likewise with damage by caliber...   Mar 16 2005, 06:40 PM
- - Pthgar   I somewhat agree with Critias. The determinig fac...   Mar 16 2005, 06:48 PM
- - Kagetenshi   QUOTE (Critias) Right now my Ares Predator II can...   Mar 16 2005, 07:01 PM
- - mfb   which is so stupid it makes me blind. the only thi...   Mar 16 2005, 07:11 PM
- - Austere Emancipator   QUOTE (Kagetenshi)Given that as I remember a lot o...   Mar 16 2005, 07:43 PM
- - apple   I always propose: [with a caliber example] light ...   Mar 16 2005, 07:51 PM
- - Critias   QUOTE (Kagetenshi) QUOTE (Critias @ Mar 16 20...   Mar 16 2005, 08:07 PM
- - Kagetenshi   Simple: all weapons with the same ammo and differe...   Mar 16 2005, 08:43 PM
- - moosegod   Critias, I'm pretty sure SR3 says that the amm...   Mar 16 2005, 08:37 PM
- - mfb   no, i just double-checked. ammo can be shared betw...   Mar 16 2005, 08:44 PM
- - Austere Emancipator   QUOTE (Kagetenshi)Simple: all weapons with the sam...   Mar 16 2005, 09:15 PM
- - hobgoblin   QUOTE (moosegod) Critias, I'm pretty sure SR3 ...   Mar 16 2005, 10:39 PM
- - Kagetenshi   QUOTE (Austere Emancipator) Do you want to come up...   Mar 17 2005, 05:31 AM
- - Arethusa   QUOTE (Austere Emancipator) Thanks for the vote of...   Mar 18 2005, 06:28 PM
- - Vuron   I suspect one method of making it easier to sort t...   Mar 18 2005, 08:35 PM
- - Fortune   QUOTE (Arethusa) I don't know. A number of ot...   Mar 19 2005, 12:59 AM
- - Kagetenshi   QUOTE (Arethusa @ Mar 18 2005, 01:28 PM) QUOT...   Mar 19 2005, 01:04 AM
- - Fortune   I really don't want to see hit locations intro...   Mar 19 2005, 01:17 AM
- - Vuron   Hit locations are generally a clunky bad idea that...   Mar 19 2005, 01:16 AM
- - Arethusa   QUOTE (Kagetenshi @ Mar 18 2005, 08:04 PM) QU...   Mar 19 2005, 01:27 AM
- - Kagetenshi   Agreed. I suppose that I can't categorically s...   Mar 19 2005, 01:28 AM
- - Arethusa   QUOTE (Kagetenshi) Agreed. I suppose that I can...   Mar 19 2005, 01:22 AM
- - Fortune   QUOTE (Kagetenshi) The best solution is to drop ca...   Mar 19 2005, 01:23 AM
- - Vuron   The other thing about hit locations is that it wou...   Mar 19 2005, 01:23 AM
- - Cynic project   QUOTE (mfb) which is so stupid it makes me blind. ...   Mar 19 2005, 01:28 AM
- - Vuron   Standardizing on a handful of ammo types for Nato ...   Mar 19 2005, 01:53 AM
- - Austere Emancipator   QUOTE (Vuron)The other thing about hit locations i...   Mar 19 2005, 02:05 AM
- - Kanada Ten   I'm not sure if I stand for or against "c...   Mar 19 2005, 02:11 AM
- - Arethusa   You could do that, but that's just as wrong as...   Mar 19 2005, 02:05 AM
- - Vuron   If anything it seems like the current trend is tow...   Mar 19 2005, 02:07 AM
- - FrostyNSO   For Developers : With the FN Five-Seven and the H...   Mar 19 2005, 02:15 AM
- - Arethusa   I don't know. I've yet to hear anything f...   Mar 19 2005, 02:18 AM
- - FrostyNSO   We've used the P90 for years and have had noth...   Mar 19 2005, 02:24 AM
- - Vuron   I'm not sure it's entirely realistic to ex...   Mar 19 2005, 02:27 AM
- - Arethusa   QUOTE (FrostyNSO)We've used the P90 for years ...   Mar 19 2005, 02:29 AM
- - Austere Emancipator   Re: Lethality of PDW-calibers, I have to admit I j...   Mar 19 2005, 02:36 AM
- - Arethusa   That's about how I feel. Especially on the la...   Mar 19 2005, 02:42 AM
- - FrostyNSO   QUOTE (Arethusa)Yeah, but how many people make a h...   Mar 19 2005, 02:44 AM
- - Vuron   QUOTE (FrostyNSO) We've used the P90 for years...   Mar 19 2005, 02:55 AM
- - Arethusa   QUOTE (FrostyNSO)QUOTE (Arethusa)Yeah, but how man...   Mar 19 2005, 02:56 AM
- - Vuron   Hell there is absolutely no reason I can see why t...   Mar 19 2005, 03:05 AM
- - Wounded Ronin   QUOTE (Raygun) Well, I hate to say it guys, but I ...   Mar 19 2005, 03:59 AM
- - Kagetenshi   QUOTE (Arethusa) Since we're on the subject, o...   Mar 19 2005, 06:56 AM
- - Arethusa   Heh. Don't think I've forgotten Fringewor...   Mar 19 2005, 07:16 AM
- - Kagetenshi   I'll admit that in my sleep-fogged state your ...   Mar 19 2005, 07:21 AM
- - Arethusa   They're not. They never really hit a final ve...   Mar 19 2005, 07:23 AM
- - Raygun   QUOTE (Arethusa @ Mar 19 2005, 02:56 AM) QUOT...   Mar 22 2005, 03:38 AM
- - FrostyNSO   QUOTE (Raygun) Because it came with the ninja cost...   Mar 22 2005, 04:22 AM
- - Kagetenshi   QUOTE (Raygun) QUOTE (Kagetenshi)Raygun's Basi...   Mar 22 2005, 05:56 AM
- - Raygun   QUOTE (FrostyNSO)QUOTE (Raygun @ Mar 21 2005,...   Mar 22 2005, 06:56 AM
- - Kagetenshi   My big problem with it isn't armshots being le...   Mar 22 2005, 07:20 AM
- - Austere Emancipator   QUOTE (Kagetenshi)My big problem with it isn't...   Mar 22 2005, 07:27 AM
- - Fortune   His point is that, even taking all that into accou...   Mar 22 2005, 07:41 AM
- - Kagetenshi   Again, that makes sense just fine for a lot of sho...   Mar 22 2005, 07:42 AM
- - Critias   In CP:2020's hit location (as it applies to bu...   Mar 22 2005, 07:46 AM
- - Austere Emancipator   QUOTE (Fortune)His point is that, even taking all ...   Mar 22 2005, 07:55 AM
- - Fortune   I just don't see the need in multi-success-bas...   Mar 22 2005, 07:52 AM
- - Kagetenshi   IRL in a combat situation you'll be talking pe...   Mar 22 2005, 07:55 AM
- - Arethusa   QUOTE (Critias)Okay. So, I lied. That's not a ...   Mar 22 2005, 07:58 AM
- - Critias   QUOTE (Arethusa) Unfortunately, it wouldn't wo...   Mar 22 2005, 09:01 AM
- - Arethusa   I have not. That sounds incredibly cumbersome, an...   Mar 22 2005, 09:04 AM
- - Critias   I wouldn't quite call it unplayable (since, we...   Mar 22 2005, 09:32 AM
- - Arethusa   QUOTE (Critias)where do you figure a Manabolt hits...   Mar 22 2005, 09:47 AM
- - FrostyNSO   Raygun: You have a PM.   Mar 22 2005, 09:59 AM
- - Critias   QUOTE (FrostyNSO) Raygun: You have a PM. Awww...   Mar 22 2005, 10:01 AM
- - Arethusa   Balls to your fun, where the hell's the answer...   Mar 22 2005, 09:57 AM
- - DrJest   Things I like about Shadowrun's combat system:...   Mar 22 2005, 10:07 AM
- - Demosthenes   QUOTE (Critias) QUOTE (FrostyNSO @ Mar 22 200...   Mar 22 2005, 10:07 AM
- - Austere Emancipator   QUOTE (Arethusa)When you shift to a location syste...   Mar 22 2005, 12:13 PM
- - Arethusa   QUOTE (Arethusa) Balls to your fun, where the hell...   Mar 23 2005, 02:31 AM
- - FrostyNSO   Sorry, I think I missed your question. Was it the...   Mar 23 2005, 02:39 AM
- - Arethusa   Yeah.   Mar 23 2005, 02:52 AM
- - FrostyNSO   There are a lot of variables that need to be taken...   Mar 23 2005, 03:02 AM
- - Arethusa   I'm not saying there aren't little things ...   Mar 23 2005, 05:24 AM
- - FrostyNSO   I'm not calling it the be all and end all of w...   Mar 23 2005, 05:58 AM
- - Kesh   One reason to favor an SMG/PDW over an assault rif...   Mar 23 2005, 08:06 AM
- - Raygun   Well, after talking to Frosty over PMs all yesterd...   Mar 23 2005, 10:45 AM
- - Austere Emancipator   QUOTE (Kesh)Compactness seems to be another consid...   Mar 23 2005, 10:49 AM
- - Critias   Hopefully there's no hard feelings there, Rayg...   Mar 23 2005, 11:46 AM
- - Papadoc   Take a look at some of the video on this site to g...   Mar 23 2005, 12:16 PM
- - Austere Emancipator   The Search-function is your friend: The Box O...   Mar 23 2005, 12:25 PM
- - Vuron   So currently we really have no idea whether the 9 ...   Mar 23 2005, 02:47 PM
- - DrJest   QUOTE I think it's astonishing that people ar...   Mar 23 2005, 03:35 PM
- - Critias   Same as with flechettes in Shadowrun. Against som...   Mar 23 2005, 03:31 PM
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