The Great CGL Rumors and Speculation Thread Options

[nemafow]

After reading everything through and becoming a little frustrated and unhappy. Can anyone comment on when we can expect an OFFICIAL statement addressing the whole picture?
Don't get me wrong, I do appreciate the insight from people that know a little of whats going on inside (by actually being involved in the matter) but it would be great to have it down on a black and white.
Comments floating around might not be 100% true, especially if the person is unhappy and or have a skewed view of the whole thing.

Rumours have the tendency to go off on a tangant for the worse of everyone.

[JM Hardy]

After reading everything through and becoming a little frustrated and unhappy. Can anyone comment on when we can expect an OFFICIAL statement addressing the whole picture?
Don't get me wrong, I do appreciate the insight from people that know a little of whats going on inside (by actually being involved in the matter) but it would be great to have it down on a black and white.
Comments floating around might not be 100% true, especially if the person is unhappy and or have a skewed view of the whole thing.

Rumours have the tendency to go off on a tangant for the worse of everyone.

As I said, I have asked the managers to address certain issues. They are meeting tomorrow--I can't offer any promises, but I hope to hear from them soon.

Jason H.

[Cardul]

You know, people..all we know for why Ms. Harding left is "personal ethics." It could easily be something other then embezzlement.
For all we know,(and no, I am not asking for confirmation on this), it could be them paying the people at the top before paying the
freelancers. Additionally, even if it *IS* embezzlement, we have seen another game company in recent years survive from such a
thing. I think the biggest issue is Adam Jury leaving. To my knowledge, he did most of the layout for CGL.

However, these are all just rumours right now. It could be something else entirely going on. Bad book-keeping before they hired on
Ms. Harding is always a possibility. It could also be possible that some of the rumours are coming from people who have a grudge
against Catalyst. I really think we should wait for something to be posted.

IF Loren Coleman *DID* embezzle the funds, he can easily resign, without a golden parachute, to protect the company. HOWEVER,
since we have nothing concrete yet, we really should just take a deep breath and wait.

[Method]

I think the biggest issue is Adam Jury leaving. To my knowledge, he did most of the layout for CGL.

They could find plenty of talented people to do layout. My issue is that for as long I've "known" Adam (in an internet community sense- I don't know him personally but we first chatted on the old Undernet #shadowrun mIRC channel circa '97 iirc) he has been dedicated to making SR the best game money can buy, be it in an unofficial or official capacity. I can't imagine that he would resign over anything trivial, which is why this seems to me like a really bad sign.

[Draco18s]

Actually there is, typically it is used to protect share holders (and depositors at banks) from embezzlement by the corporate bigwigs. I forget what it is called, though it may only apply to banks.

I know that there is Credit Default Swap,* which is a more bizarre form of insurance. So I wouldn't be surprised. But I don't know what its called either.

*As I am sure most of us Americans are aware these days. Recently heard a story on the radio about a book The Big Short about the creation of that form of insurance and the people who made big using it.

[Dr.Rockso]

The LEs are on a boat making their way slowly to the US. Nothing that has happened has affected the existence of the boat or the LEs. Once they're in, they'll be shipped.

Jason H.

Alright, thanks for putting my mind at ease.

[Demerzel]

http://catalystgamelabs.com/2010/03/17/cat...-press-release/

[Dr.Rockso]

Interesting, thanks for posting that.

[Semerkhet]

http://catalystgamelabs.com/2010/03/17/cat...-press-release/

Edit: Started out too accusatory. That official statement is worded in such a way that it could be embezzlement or an honest mistake. I'm certainly not in the know.

[JM Hardy]

I put the statement in a separate thread just to increase it's visibility. Thread here.

[HappyDaze]

I'm almost certain no one would buy a WotC 5th Edition ShadowRun

I'd certainly be willing to give it a chance, but I'd rather see Shadowrun as a Savage Worlds setting. I gave Catalyst's version a chance, and while I don't care all that much for it, I still love Shadowrun as a gaming setting. If it can continue on without Catalyst, I won't shed a tear.

[Gronk]

Forgive me if this has lready been covered, but it seems they have a press release up about it:
http://catalystgamelabs.com/2010/03/17/cat...elease/#respond

[Werewindlefr]

Forgive me if this has lready been covered, but it seems they have a press release up about it:
http://catalystgamelabs.com/2010/03/17/cat...elease/#respond

Does this sounds like a softer, corporate way to confirm what Frank said in the first post, or am I paranoid?

Anyway, congrats on the reactive PR. At least we know what's happening. Thanks for the (quasi)-honesty.

[Cardul]

Well, it really could have just been bad book-keeping like they say. If the owner who got the
funds is, indeed, paying them back, then it is not as bad as embezzlement, since it was just
an actual accounting error, not embezzlement(like happened with Palladium). If the non-disclosed
owner really is Mr. Coleman, then we can expect some of the payment to be coming out of his
payment and royalty payments for Shadows of Faith when/if it ever comes out.

[LurkerOutThere]

Mein gott people seem really really quick to hold a funeral here. I am saddened to see some of the departures but discussion of a whole new company might be premautre. CGL has produced good products and they have turned profits. If those profits did get misused that is unfortunate and might affect the companies ability to finance further print runs.....or it might not affect it at all. The simple truth is a profitable company can and often does bounce back from fraud and mismanagement my memory could be fuzzy but Paladium and SJG have both suffered from this in the past. The point i'm trying to make is despite the losses it is quite possible that the license will stay with CGL if another buyer isn't waiting quite literally in the wings. It might become a percentage license to make up for the cash shortfall and additional underwriters might be necessary until any fraudulently lost funds can be recovered, and a recovery is never total but you can get back a lot.

I guess what I'm saying is looking at X gaming company or Y company might be a touch premature, the corpse ain't cold yet, in fact it's not even a corpse.

[Cardul]

I guess what I'm saying is looking at X gaming company or Y company might be a touch premature, the corpse ain't cold yet, in fact it's not even a corpse.

Aff...just because they were punched in the gut does not mean they are out of the fight...
Heck, Palladium was kicked in the nuts, and it still came back to where it was *AND*
got back their Robotech RPG license at the same time.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

Does this sounds like a softer, corporate way to confirm what Frank said in the first post, or am I paranoid?

That's the kind of white-wash PR you get from a spin doctor.

[Jaid]

i wouldn't really describe palladium as being in particularly wonderful shape, actually. the few employees there are working extremely long hours just to keep things running, from what i understand.

[emouse]

That's the kind of white-wash PR you get from a spin doctor.

No company rep is going to take a bad situation and make it worse by setting the house on fire and bringing the possibility of a lawsuit frenzy even if a fire later turns out to be warranted.

On the upside, it does make it sound like the 'current owners' are aware of the scope of the problem and cooperation may be going on with 'one of the owners' (another reason to take a softer touch), which will mean better survivability for the company.

It could well be a case of "we won't call you a crook and press charges if you pay it back" is in play.

[LurkerOutThere]

i wouldn't really describe palladium as being in particularly wonderful shape, actually. the few employees there are working extremely long hours just to keep things running, from what i understand.

Actually i'm given to understand employees putting in long hours for lower then wonderfull pay is what drives the hobby, or pretty much any industry. Fact is I don't know many if any full time game devs or at least people that use it as their primary or only means of support, but I do know a lot of them who do it on the side either for love or for money.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

No company rep is going to take a bad situation and make it worse by setting the house on fire and bringing the possibility of a lawsuit frenzy even if a fire later turns out to be warranted.

Of course not. That's why the non-denial denial exists, after all.

[tweak]

That's the kind of white-wash PR you get from a spin doctor.

I get the mishandling of money thingy.

What I don't get is what happened to cause people to jump ship during a recession. Something doesn't add up.

[emouse]

I get the mishandling of money thingy.

What I don't get is what happened to cause people to jump ship during a recession. Something doesn't add up.

Do you mean leaving the company? I think they're referring to freelancers who were owed money and have made it clear that even if they're paid they have no intention of returning.

Though it's also possibly referring to some people, possibly who were supposed to be keeping an eye on things, who are resigning in order to keep from being fired. Again, no company is going to say something bad about or publicly detail the situation around an employee quitting, but they'd be well advised not to put their former employer on a recommendations list when they go job hunting!

[Werewindlefr]

Something doesn't add up.

Which is why I'm almost convinced that Frank's version is the correct one, and that the post on the CGL site is a softer, "read between the lines" one. But since I have no proof, I can't know for sure and CGL gains the benefits of the doubt.

[emouse]

Which is why I'm almost convinced that Frank's version is the correct one, and that the post on the CGL site is a softer, "read between the lines" one. But since I have no proof, I can't know for sure and CGL gains the benefits of the doubt.

The only conflict I really see between Frank's depiction of the situation and CGL's press release is that CGL is asserting that they can survive the situation, while Frank is painting a picture with no out for CGL.

To me, the gentle wording of the CGL release implies that all parties involved are still on relatively friendly terms in working to sort this out, and that neither side has resorted to pursuing legal action yet.

Further reading between the lines and assuming that both versions are right implies that there could be a stash of money involved that is large enough to keep the company going. The wording of the press release could well be a part of the delicate negotiations that have or are currently going on between the parties involved.