In the Immortal words of Blazing Saddles. Don't Shoot Mongo, you'll just make him mad.

You don't threaten a guy like that. Threatening him is basically telling him that he needs to kill you, before you kill him. There is no threat, there is only kill or kill not.

Exactly. So if you put two points of magic towards mana-based abilities, you can only cast to Force 2 safely and overcast to Force 4 maximum.

Not abilities, just skill tests. The Force of the spell has nothing to do with the skill test to cast a spell. They are in different sections of the spellcasting sequence (SR4A p. 182 ff.). Mystic Adepts are disadvataged enough. Don't screw them even more by using house rules from the erroneous FAQ.

Ok, so you're saying that maximum force is determined by total magic, and the Magic dice for the Spellcasting Test are determined by how many you allocated for it? I guess that makes more sense.

Yup

Exactly, that's what i was trying to say in my post.

It sounds to me like the sammy's player and the GM are colluding to screw your character. Get the GM and the sammy's player around a table and explain that this bullshit is not on, and that you will leave the game if they don't cut it right the fuck out. Thing is, you need to be willing to actually walk away.

Actually, when I said the GM has his own plans for the sammy, I meant in the "Wanted by the European Government for several acts of Terrorism" sort of way. I'm currently trying to decide if we give this guy a chance and protect him, or if I sell him to the Europeans and pay off my debt.

The latter sound appropriate to me, if your character has knowledge of the warrant and reward.

It's a question that isn't answered explicitly in the rules, but I lean towards that interpretation, myself. Adepts use the total magic rating for things such a maximum levels they can take in an adept power (the example character has one point in adept abilities, and uses it to get four levels of Rapid Healing), so I would see mages, similarly, using their full Magic rating to determine if spells do physical Drain or not.

However, I would probably only let them use the Magic points allocated to mage abilities to soak Drain, as I do consider Drain to be a "Magic-linked dice pool" used in conjunction with magical skills.

I wish they had simply taken a few more sentences and explicitly stated where the split rating applies, or doesn't (I feel the same way about splitting dice pools). The FAQ is useless regarding this question, because under their interpretation, the canon mystic adept example, above, would not be possible.

Say what now? Magic isn't part of the drain resistance test, that's Willpower + <tradition-dependent Drain stat>.

Yeah, you're right.

Would be good except recoil accrues along all of your arms. So first burst -2 comped by your centering, burst 2 -5 dice -centering -3 dice, third burst -6 4th -9 then on to the to the second round of bursts 5th -12 6th -15 7th -18 and you finish at -21 if you didn't have to change targets. All of these penalties are doubled for using shotguns.

Recoil comp (don't forget that optional rule in Arsenal about drones and high strength working to comp recoil) helps a lot though.
Get high enough dicepool and you get an awesome goon whacker.
Don't expect to hit anything with a remotely decent dodge.
And if you ever have the need to kill that many people in one round, I'd consider just going for chunky salsa capable ordnance.

Thats because the FAQ ruling is over -three years old- and written for -fourth- edition.
It directly contradicts the newer, more recent Anniversary edition in which the rule regarding the mystic adept split was clarified and updated.

In 2009, when catalyst updated their FAQ page, they -didn't- bother to timestamp their new rulings or remove old rulings that didn't apply because the rules changed.

Congrats; using the FAQ for mystic adepts means throwing the rules back half an edition.



Formerly, mystic adepts had to keep track of the split with anal-retentitness attention to detail, because half the value was used for one thing, half the other. Random things like foci addiction values, or which value you get to use for some metamagics in which you rolled magic. It was generally a pain in the ass. So stop using the outdated faq.

Now you know, and knowing is half the battle!

No, uncompensated recoil carries across all multiwielded weapons, then is doubled because its a shotgun.
All you need is 3 points of RC per gun. Whether from personalized grip, using an aa-16(with comes with a gasvent), or just having a high strength, its not too hard. You can carry over and double 0 as much as you like, but its still 0.

@Mystic Adepts: The FAQ was wrong in 4th edition as it is in Anniversary Edition. The lines are identical in both books, in SR4 the relevant text is on p. 186 f.

Never trust the SR FAQ.

I was about to point that out myself. I do think you can glean good things from the FAQ occasionally though.

Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

"Which would you rather have? A clock that is always wrong (because it is 5 minute fast) or one that is right twice a day? Eh?" "Sold!"

if my clock is 5 minutes fast all the time, I can compensate for that.

If my clock is right twice a day because it doesn't' tell time and it's stuck. I'll never know WHEN it's right those two times.

Are you seriously discussing the idiom?

she started it

It's called a joke.

Unless it tells military time (IE: it's broken at 17:38:42).

Unless that was intended as an insult to me, which would make it false. I'm correct far more often than twice a day - just not neccessarily always on these forums. Even then I'm fairly correct around these parts also.

And if it was directed at someone else... it's been a long day. I may or may not get back to that one.

It was not intended as an insult. It was merely to emphasize that the FAQ seems to be more wrong than right.

Ahh, so option #3 turned out. I'll admit that the FAQ is buggy, but there's some good stuff to glean from there as well. At least it doesn't confuse bow and crossbow usage even more.

You need to strongly state, OOC, that the other player is currently threatening the integrity of the group with his actions. If he pushes it the way he is, it will lead to the a player vs player situation. He has already told you in OOC that he will get violent/kill your character. He sounds like someone I would not be playing with. I strongly suggest you start looking for a new group, with weather or not you tell the GM/other players depending on how you think they will react to that news.

Also, the character being a dept collector for the Vory?! Why the hell would a group of runners let such a being into their group and go on runs with them? That isn't an "In" to the group, that is an opponent/enemy. The fact that he told you violence is coming OOC means the player is a problem.

I wouldn't put this all on the guy playing the debt collector without having more background information. Player vs. player type stuff is considered acceptable at some tables. If it isn't acceptable at your table you should make that clear before giving a new character background fluff that encourages their PC to go after other PCs. Particularly since it sounds like this guy was rolling a new sheet because his previous character was killed over a "conflict of interests," which sorta makes me wonder if he wasn't already killed before due to the actions of other PCs.

Actually the fact that he was told OOC that is not how In Dept works and he still came back with killing the other character, it places the blame most solidly on him.

Yeah, because he should totally be expected to play his character in line with someone else's quality. So yeah, I would say a big chunk of the blame lies on him, but it's a bit silly to act like the best way to fix this is to start quietly looking for a new group. At the very least you could try, you know, saying that a cycle of pvp violence isn't really your thing first. The OP is already going down that route anyway though, so largely this conversation is academic.

we killed that horse few pages back i think

I still blame the GM.

If a GM relies on a player coming up with an idea for a "gettin in" the group at the expense of that player's happiness than that GM needs to learn to GM a bit better. There are millions of ways you can throw in a character in a game. But from what was stated this particular player had his previous character PKed by the group because of inner party conflict of interest.
Then he made a munchkinated to the max ganger character who most likely was designed to withstand PK attempts and all that without asking the GM if that will suit the campaign and instead of the GM telling him NO he allowed him but had no idea how to bring him in the group until the OP sugested "hey he can hunt me for my In Debt quality and thats how he can get in the group" poor GMing if you ask me.

In reality that character should have been just purely GMs problem or not allowed at all. If I was a graduate i dunno say a Mechanic and went and applied for an Engineer's job, I dont expect the HR department to say "oh we really need you cause we like you but you dont suit the position so im just gonna tack you onto another engineer and make you his problem. you arent qualified but we want you"..thats just retarded

Well, the situation is practically resolved. We had a talk, I convinced him that it was in his best interest to play nice, and then we got attacked by the European Government (his mortal enemy) and got the rest of us pegged as terrorists, so we're considering selling his giant butt to get them off our backs. Fortunately, we made the delivery before we got attacked, so at least we don't have the Johnson coming after us for failing to deliver/getting him attacked by European Strike Jets. All in all, it was a good session.

So is the European Government as an enemy a 10-point flaw, or a 15-point flaw?

10 Point as it is a delusion. Last time I checked there is no Europen Government in SR, heck even Germany does not have a single government anymore. Balkanization is one of the themes of SR.

Well somehow the troll must have forced his delusion onto the other characters and the world around him. Neat trick, more appropriate to another game though.

Honestly, I didn't ask.



So wait, you're telling me the Troll's a mage too? Crap.

We're playing in a slightly modified setting, which is why there is still a pan-European government.

There isn't really one now, technically. Close, but not really. Give it a few decades though.

I was going to say something similar.

Hah, right now we have ALMOST everything there needed to run one: A parliament... and a bureaucratic nightmare.

Yes, but at the rate that government works it'll take decades, even if it could be set up tomorrow.

Well, I figure I should tell you all how it went. I found out, while watching the news, that my 'friend' the Giant was a terrorist and is now being hunted by the Europeans - what I did not find out was that he apparently had support from 'the greatest Hacker in the world' (to use the media's words) which of course was yours truly. I knew he was worth 250,000, but apparently I was worth 500,000 (nice to be loved, or at least wanted, I guess). We narrowly escaped the Europeans once, but eventually we were being attacked by Go Gangers with surface to surface guided missiles, and the party was nearing TPK. Wishing to avoid high velocity lead (or mild steel, as the case may be, pun intended) poisoning, I decided to pop onto my group contact (which is something like a future /b: and full of other Hackers) and post video and GPS coordinates of the giant along with the following text "Found, Europe's Most Wanted." Of course, I didn't know that I was apparently public enemy number one. Things are looking grim for me, no? So we've taken cover behind the burned out shell of our truck, with the street sam off trying to engage the technical in melee (I think I might have gotten the rules wrong, but if it hits him going >60 m/round it deals twice it's body in damage right? That's how we played it, and it very nearly killed him) and I decide now is a good time to let the rest of the team know that help should be on the way, even though 'help' in this case means those guys with fighter jets and paras who were trying to kill us a couple of hours ago (funny how life works, amirite?). The paras show up, but Mr. Street Sam starts lobbing missiles (which he somehow managed to arm) at them. They are French, and I, of course, speak no French (in character, at least, but out I speak rather well, so I got to roleplay defaulting on that check, to great comic effect) so our Technomancer (who does know what I'm worth) says something to the lead para in French. Meanwhile street sam missile javelined (with what may have been a javelin missile) a squad of the paras, and I, in a moment of apparent altruism (really I was just trying to make nice so the French might a. not kill us b. pay us the reward money and c. take us back to denver as our ride was completely trashed) used the back door login I'd installed on the giant's commlink and put him into VR, and then kept him from logging off. Of course, I made the mistake of going into VR to do it - while I was thusly indisposed they took me into custody. Fortunately, some quick thinking on the part of our rigger meant we got payed for the both of us, so we made out pretty good on that end. I, of course, was certain I was going to be tortured and killed, but I burned a point of Edge to avoid immediate death (I managed to convince them that I wasn't the hacker in question, but they took my internal 'link and encephalon just to be sure) and managed to skedaddle before they realized that I was the hacker in question.

What happened to the giant, you ask? I don't know, I don't wanna know, but I'm certain we won't be seeing him again.

Oh, and then I got to start tutoring Google, which has become sapient and self-aware, in Philosophy. I'm currently trying to convince Google that Utopia does not justify the means. And that is where the session ended. Me and a recently emergent A.I., playing tic-tac-toe (I turned down the offer of 'Global Thermonuclear War') in VR.

How did they manage to take your internal commlink and encephalon? Did they just happen to bring a MASH unit with them?

From that description it seems like your game isn't just pink mohawk, it's radioactive pink mohawk that someone's poured gasoline on and set on fire.

... which is fine as long as everyone involved is in the mood for it !

They took me to a surgery on base.



Yeah, try as the Technomancer, Rigger, and I might, it's veered pretty sharply away from the mirrorshades. Hopefully with the loss of the giant street sam we won't need to be attacked with heavy ordnance anymore (seriously, he'd shrug off blows that would drop the rest of the party - fortunately he made pretty good cover) but we'll see.

BWA-AH-HAHAHAHAHAHA!

For a thread about a tetragrammaton cleric, it seems very strange that YHWH has not been mentioned once. Is this cleric a follower of a different four-letters? If so, which ones?

KILL, presumably.

It is in fact a reference to the Hebrew name of God, that is YHWH. But it is more primarily a reference to the Grammaton Clerics, or Tetragrammaton Clerics (they refer to themselves as Grammaton Clerics and at least once as Clerics of the Tetragrammaton, I think), from the film Equilibrium.

Basically I wanted help building a dual wielding adept who uses guns at point blank range/as melee weapons.

And technically you're spelling YHWH backwards (kinda). And He actually does want us to use His correct name. There's some interesting studies that've been done on that.

EDIT: And apparently that wiki page documents it. Interesting.