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Rotbart van Dainig
QUOTE (SR4-1.3 @ p. 123, Using Instruction)
Teaching requires an Instruction + Charisma Test. For every 2 hits achieved in this test, the student receives an additional die for making the test to learn the skill.

To increase the net hits of a studend by just 1 hit, that rule requires the tutor to have at least 18 dice when teaching, statistically speaking - which makes the skill essentially useless.

Also, this is the only case in SR4 that 'per 2 hits' is used, so this seems like a SR3 leftover.
Brahm
I just noticed that in the sample characters a lot of the Contacts are Fixers with a Connections rating of 2. That seems off from the examples given in the Connections Table where a street-level fixer is 3. Same thing with having a Mr. Johnson at level 3 when a low-level Mr. Johnson is given as an example of a 4 and a Street Doc at a 2.

This isn't a big thing, and our group just uses Connection as an indication of the level of services that they are willing to make available to you. So you could theoretically have a Mob Boss Contact with a Connection 1. But that isn't the way the rules appear to be written.
Bull
QUOTE (Brahm)
I just noticed that in the sample characters a lot of the Contacts are Fixers with a Connections rating of 2. That seems off from the examples given in the Connections Table where a street-level fixer is 3. Same thing with having a Mr. Johnson at level 3 when a low-level Mr. Johnson is given as an example of a 4 and a Street Doc at a 2.

This isn't a big thing, and our group just uses Connection as an indication of the level of services that they are willing to make available to you. So you could theoretically have a Mob Boss Contact with a Connection 1. But that isn't the way the rules appear to be written.

One of two things...

1) The sample contacts are "newer" contacts, just starting in the biz, and aren't even up to your "low level" fixer/Mr J. Possible.

2) They have a better connection rating, but they're not willing to pull out the stops for <I>you</I>. They may be loyal as hell, but maybe, for whatever reason, there's only a certain amount they're willing to do for you. Maybe a perceived insult, maybe "orders from above", maybe threats against their freinds/family/loved ones.

<shrug>

Unfortunately, the listed examples in the book are just that, examples. With the new contact system the way it is, you need to be flexible. Aftr all, just because you have a Corp Exec contact with a 1/1 doesn't mean that's all they can do.

Bull
Brahm
Wendigos still don't have the Sapience power listed in this printing. Surely this is not intentional since they are all Magicians?
Moon-Hawk
I'm not sure ALL Wendigos are sapient. I think the process of becoming a wendigo typically shatters the mind of the Ork. Perhaps sapient wendigos are the exception, not the rule. *shrug*
Brahm
QUOTE (Bull @ Aug 1 2006, 12:31 PM)
Unfortunately, the listed examples in the book are just that, examples.  With the new contact system the way it is, you need to be flexible.  Aftr all, just because you have a Corp Exec contact with a 1/1 doesn't mean that's all they can do.

That's how we play it, and it provides a lot of flexibility, it just isn't expressly written in the rules that way. It is described as what they can do, not what they will do for you. Wish they would have put in a sentence or two about handling it this way. I guess that's something to add on the list for the Shadowrun Companion type of book that eventually comes out. indifferent.gif
Brahm
QUOTE (Moon-Hawk @ Aug 1 2006, 12:33 PM)
I'm not sure ALL Wendigos are sapient.  I think the process of becoming a wendigo typically shatters the mind of the Ork.  Perhaps sapient wendigos are the exception, not the rule.  *shrug*

In the past Ghouls have been described that way, the SComp has that table for the transformation to a Ghoul. But Ghouls are given the Sapience power, even though the text explicitly states The transformation destroys the victim’s intellect in some cases, but many ghouls remain quite intelligent.
LilithTaveril
Page 143: Can we get definitions of what a short burst is? The term "short burst" is also used for the Fubuki description, but no actual rules are given. I have found a "short burst" under SR3, and I note that it's the exact same as the 2-bullet burst under "Not Enough Bullets."

Edit: Note, RunnerPaul pointed me to a section that deals with this. It's under the Long Burst section. But, for quick reference, can we have ", also known as a short burst" added between "3 bullets" and the period on 142? As it stands, the burst-fire term definitions for three-bullet bursts also require referencing the Full-Auto Mode section for beginners.
Rotbart van Dainig
It means 'narrow burst', as opposed to 'wide burst'.

BTW, is it intentional that the Adeptpower Improved Ability <Vehicle Skills> is both missing in the Main book and Street Magic?
LilithTaveril
Rothvan, nope.

QUOTE (Long Bursts @ page 143 of SR4)
Like short bursts, long bursts can be fired as narrow or wide bursts.


This either means a three-round burst is a short burst, or that a short burst has the same firing options as a normal burst.
Rotbart van Dainig
QUOTE (LilithTaveril)
Rothvan, nope.

You, my friend, seem to have a reading comprehension issue:

QUOTE (LilithTaveril)
The term "short burst" is also used for the Fubuki description

No, it isn't - read again.
LilithTaveril
QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig)
QUOTE (LilithTaveril)
Rothvan, nope.

You, my friend, seem to have a reading comprehension issue.

QUOTE (LilithTaveril)
The term "short burst" is also used for the Fubuki description

No, it isn't - read again.

Meh. Sorry about the name.

QUOTE (Yamaha Sakura Fubuki @ page 307 of SR4)
the bullets are stacked in-line in each of the four barrels, allowing the firing of ultra-fast short bursts.


After that is when it states the gun may only fire narrow-bursts. And, no, it's not an issue with reading comprehension. It's an issue with a term that has a set rules definition under SR3 and which was thrown into SR4 without anything more than hints about the definition that could refer to two things. I'm asking for this to be clarified beyond the shadow of a doubt.
Rotbart van Dainig
QUOTE (LilithTaveril)
It's an issue with a term that has a set rules definition under SR3 and which was thrown into SR4 without anything more than hints about the definition that could refer to two things.

There are no 'ultra-fast short bursts' in SR3, either.
LilithTaveril
No, but there are short bursts. I'm figuring the "ultra-fast" is mostly fluff to explain why it suffers SA recoil instead of burst recoil.
Oracle
You are misinterpreting the text in the same way you did in the 'Corporate Citizenship' thread.
LilithTaveril
Oh, yay, being trolled now... How fun.

Oracle, if you don't have something constructive to post, then back off. If you want to prove that statement, then post conclusive evidence that proves it.
Oracle
The fact that you are the only person so far to have problems with understanding the different kind of bursts should tell you something. rotfl.gif
Adam
Hey folks,

this thread is not for ongoing discussions. Please move them to another thread -- thanks.
Rotbart van Dainig
QUOTE (SR4v3 @ p. 236, Data Sprite)
Skills: Computer, Data Search, Decrypt

There is no skill 'Decrypt' - it should be 'Hacking'.

QUOTE (SR4v3 @ p. 236, Data Sprite)
Complex Forms: Browse, Edit, Transfer

There is no utility 'Transfer' - 'Exploit' is missing for ilegitimate data retrieval.
NeoJudas
I have no idea where the "errata" for Street Magic should go, so instead of starting a new thread (or trying in the event I'd fail utterly), I thought I'd toss this one out here.

In the Spell List found at the back of the book in the Manipulation Category there is a spell listed as "Aspected Mana Static" (pg 189). There is no such spell in the Grimoire Chapter that we can find.

Believe me when I saw, given the title's potential meaning, this is certainly a spell formula I'm interested in seeing.
cyniclaus
It has already been mentioned that the Lone Star Lieutenant is listed as having the incorrect name for his taser, but it has not been mentioned that on page 276, his main fire arm is listed as a "Browning Max-Power with a Smartlink". Perhaps a Colt Manhunter with a Smartlink or an Ares Predator IV would be more appropriote, since the SR4 book has stats for them and the Browning Max-Power isn't listed.

Thanks!
blakkie
Like NeoJudas, I'm reporting here here a Street Magic Errata I believe I've found.

http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?showtopic=14886
Mistwalker
Ingram Smartgun.

Described as having a gas-vent 2 and a sound suppresor. Not possible, as both are barrel mounted items.

Maybe they should modify it like the Ares Alpha, and make it chamber design gives 2 points of recoil compensation, rather than gas-vent 2.
Ophis
Not possible with accesssories but It could be with intergral devices built in. The stuff listed in gun descriptions doesn't take up mounts unless it says it does.
Case793
If you look at what a gas-vent and a sound supressor do, it appears impossible to me to fit them on the same gun. A gas-vent uses gas channeled in a specific direction to counter the rise of the gun-barrel. A sound supressor traps the gas from the barrel to prevent it from leaving the muzzle at supersonic speed. So basically the two items are doing two completely opposite things.
Besides, when I remember correctly, the old Cannon Companion, which still is the best we have concerning rules for building and modding guns, stated that only one device can be used per mount.
Triggerz
Ok, it's not exactly a typo, but I thought I'd suggest it here anyways as it has to do with clarifying the way the rules should be used. Quite often, it is not obvious whether a particular bonus is subject (or not) to the attribute or skill caps.

In another thread, hyzmarca suggested:
QUOTE
They should clearly mark all powers, cyberware, spells, and drugs that add dice with an A for augmented or a B for bonus, just as they would clearly mark the ammo capacity of a gun. [...]

Bonuses are identified with a (+), are paired with a specialization, and do not count towards the augmented caps. Augmentations are just a plain () and do count towards the cap.

That particular notation allows one to quickly and easily distinguish between augmentations and bonuses, which is an important distinction but one which is not nearly as clear as it should be.

My suggestion is a similar notation system for stats [Stat (spec) (other spec) value (augmented value) (+bonus) (+other bonus)] or [Stat value (augmented value (spec) (+bonus) (other spec) (+other bonus)] if the former is too confusing. So a character with Reaction 3, Improved Reflexes 2 and combat sense 4 would write [Reaction (dodge and surprise) 3 (5) (+4)]


I think that having all powers, cyberware, bioware, equipment, spells and drugs marked explicitely as either an augmentation (A) or a bonus (B) would be tremendously useful. I'm suggesting it here because a future errata could easily include the various lists (adept powers, cyberware, spells, and so on) with (A) or (B) for each of them. Ideally, the "augmentation" and "bonus" terminology should be used consistently throughout the book, but a simple list would be awesome to start with and would be enough to address the present ambiguities.
Moon-Hawk
Adding too many labels in the books could get cumbersome, I'm not sure, but I'm 100% for a complete list as web supplement.
Larsine
Page 99: Smuggler

"Moderate Allergy to Sunlight (+10 BP)", but according to page 81 Sunlight is a common substance (worth 7 points). so it should be:
"Moderate Allergy to Sunlight (+15 BP)", and thus give the Smuggler another 5 BPs.

Lars
Dantic
QUOTE (Larsine)
P. 228, 1st column: INTRUSION COUNTERMEASURES
Wrong: More proactive IC programs may be loaded with additional utilities such as Exploit or Stealth, and may actively pursue intruders if they leave the node or even track the intruder back to his originating node and attack him there.
Right: Most proactive IC programs may be loaded with additional utilities such as Exploit or Stealth, and may actively pursue intruders if they leave the node or even track the intruder back to his originating node and attack him there.

I think this is correct in that they intend to say that the IC which would track an intruder down is more proactive than the average, not that the majority of IC considered to be proactive may have these programs.
Lovesmasher
QUOTE (Case793)
If you look at what a gas-vent and a sound supressor do, it appears impossible to me to fit them on the same gun. A gas-vent uses gas channeled in a specific direction to counter the rise of the gun-barrel. A sound supressor traps the gas from the barrel to prevent it from leaving the muzzle at supersonic speed. So basically the two items are doing two completely opposite things.
Besides, when I remember correctly, the old Cannon Companion, which still is the best we have concerning rules for building and modding guns, stated that only one device can be used per mount.

I assumed that it was an Ingram-unique tech. If you disperse and redirect the force enough, it should serve both purposes. If not, then it can easily be explained as one of those things that they said to excuse for game purposes.
Bull
Locking this down to pave the way for a new thread for the 4th printing, as hopefully all of these have been caught and attended to smile.gif

Once the 4th Print (and the new PDF version) are released, we'll start up a new thread.

Thanks to everyone who's posted for their help nailing down these pesky little bugs! smile.gif

Bull
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