As the sub title suggests, does programming require tools? I know in Sr3, i think you just needed a computer system to do it...

Since programming isn't a build/repair test I'd say No.

it isnt?

I'd suggest checking out the relavent section - its in Matrix, P76.

But you basically need

A) Time. Lots of it, depending on the program that you're coding.
B) A good computer (programming) skill
C) A computer with enough memory - preferably double the amout required for the program free.

Added bonuses

A) Knowledge skills in the relvent programming field - these reduce the TN for the programming test, allowing more successes, thus less time.
B) Programming suite, of a level equal to your programming skill - this will roughly halve the time and may give complimentary dice.
C) Access to a mainframe.
D) Time

Minimally, yes, I think it would require a commlink or computer of some sort... probably with a good enough system to run the program you eventually intend to create.

You can't just create a program using a coconut and some string.

@Westiex

There is no Matrix book in SR4.

I totally see the need for a Software Kit. Basically I see that as the SR equivalent of MS Visual Studio. Without the Software Kit you're basically programming in Notepad. Ask any professional programmer you know and they'll tell you that coding in an IDE like Visual Studio certainly makes things easier/faster than doing it in Notepad. So, an SR *could* program without the tools, but I could certainly justify the penalty given in the B/R modifiers table.

And what kind of program would a software facility be?

I think, in the Unwired book, we're likely to see the "Programming Suite" program return to SR4 - which was basically this same concept, except that it had ratings (which tools do not, really).

For the time being, saying a player needs a 500 software tool (suite) to program without penalty seems fine to me.

Course, if your shadowrunners have months to sit around writing programs, you sort of need to kick them in the rear and give them some missions to do.

Ummm,

sorry to disappoint, but I program for a living and I use a simple text editor, as do many people I know.

It is quite common to do so on Linux/UNIX systems and derivates.

It depends on what you are coding, in what language etc.

There are however various other tools, like Revision Systems, Debuggers, Compilers etc etc.

Also, there are enough free tools about which are in no way inferior to commercial, proprietery products.

As such, I am unsure you require anything other than the hardware (as operating systems seem to be implied in those costs in SR)

Thank you

bladepoet

Thanks Brahm, that was basically my point. I certainly don't want to wade into another thread that tries to reconcile SR and RL computing. (No one even THINK the word "encryption" please)

Obviously there is some tool, either included with the OS or Freeware. It may not give you any extra dice though. I would rule an advanced IDE would give you dice on some types of programs(big complicated ones), because although you could write it all in a text editior the bigger the program the harder it is for your brain to keep track of and thus why the IDEs exist.

Ha-ha! Renraku Teng.

it's easily possible that programming in SR is impossible without specialized tools. today, sure, you can just open up any text editor and start typing in code--but SR code is not text-based, it's VR-based. see, what happens is, you take code objects and assemble them like legos. the code objects themselves come from LA LA LA NOT THINKING ABOUT IT.

One the same topic, is there any rumours/indications there will be rules on expert systems that can be made/bought to make the programs??