Firstly, the system gets a test to detect the intrusion when the character breaks in (see Breaking In, p. 221). After that, the text on p. 222 suggests the following: security hackers, patrolling IC, and glitches. Hackers and IC would have to be equipped with the Analyze program to watch for Stealthy icons. I particularly like using glitches to bring the attention of a hacker or IC onto the hacker while critical glitches trip an alert right away. Technically, as well, the host could be running the Analyze program itself, giving it not only the intrusion test(s), but the chance to notice the hacker's icon when they log in to the system, but this would be up to the GM's interpretation of the Analyze program's ability to perform rudimentary matrix perception tests without the interaction of a Pilot or Hacker.

I run it as yes. The text in the book states "Each time you make a test to hack in, however, the target node also gets to make a free Analyze + Firewall (Stealth) Extended Test. If the node detects you--whether you hack in or not--an alert is triggered." I see the Extended Test as having an interval of the same length as the Extended Test to hack on the fly. Thus, for every interval of the hacker's extended test, the target node makes an Analyze + Firewall (Stealth) test, adding any hits to all previous hits like any other Extended Test. Thus, if the node beats the hacker's stealth before the Hacker beats the system's Firewall (plus any mods for security/admin access), an alert is triggered. However, since after breaking in the hacker will no longer be performing "a test to hack in" the system stops getting this free test and must rely on secondary detection methods like those above.

There is the intrusion test which depends on whether your hacking on the fly or probing the target. If hacking on the fly, it's an Analyze + Firewall (Stealth) extended test as explained above. If probing the target, it's a single Analyze + Firewall (Stealth) test when the intrusion is successful. After that the system/device may not get another test at all, unless the GM rules that the system's Analyze program can run rudimentary perception tests similar to a character's Analyze program as described in the last paragraph of p. 217.

Turn off the commlink, turn off the commlink's wireless capabilities, skinlink their commlink, engage the hacker in cybercombat, use agents (IC) to engage the hacker in cybercombat, shoot the hacker, have friends shoot the hacker, etc.

That's up to the GM. I ran one system that had a seperate file storage device so that needed to be detected prior to the files being available to the hacker. Thus, there was a Perception test necessary to find the file storage device followed by a data search + browse extended test to find the file in question. However, there's no real need for that first perception test unless the GM is trying to pull a fast one.

I thought the other few questions you asked were nicely handled by Guye Noir.

An Analyze (interpret sensor feeds) + Edit (create/update map) agent would do the trick.

Well, if I were going to do that the first thing would be an extended Data Search + Scan test to locate the RFID transmissions in the building. As a GM, I would assume that the RFID information that would be transmitted by the tags would indicate whether the tag is on an employee or, say, a wall hanging or fluorescent light bulb. The threshold on that test would be high and would depend on the size of the area being searched. If the player wanted to limit the information to, say, just people in motion, I'd lower the threshold because the Scan program could quickly remove certain data from the overall system. The interval would be based on the Search Table (p. 220) so since you're searching one network for data, it'd be 1 combat turn.

Now to present the overlay, you could have gotten the floorplan from some form of public archive prior to the run. Perhaps you had someone fast talk their way into the building to scope out the hallways and what not. I long for the days of the old orientation system cyberware. If that one comes back, then you could be making the floorplan on the fly based on what that cyberware is able to produce. Without a pre-run map available, I'd probably allow another Data Search + Browse test with a hard threshold within the network to try and find any maps that the system maintains -- perhaps for fire alarms or even for internal employee tracking. If the hacker can find such a map at this time, then it's a simple matter of putting the little dots from the RFID's in the first search on top of the overlay from the second and viola! you have an overlay showing the location of anyone not in the party.

Course this relies on the fact that the employees have embedded chips, that there isn't signal dampening technology in effect somewhere (producing empty sections of the map) etc. Thus, it's going to change from host to host. The availability of such an overlay would probably be best determined prior to the run during legwork, I'd say.

Gear is too ugly to copy from the excel spreadsheat, so i'll add that as a clicky in a moment as soon as i get hosted. One minor rule the GM allowed was he let me code and build my own software and commlink. as this is an idiots guide, i dont think the costs of such things really matter, but i'm letting everyone know of that now. i think that's the difference though, and im not sure if it's a "difference" he was just liberal in the amount of time that was usable prior to game start time.


geargear

Not that it matters, but the history for the character went something like this:


My past is mostly a mystery to me. All i know is what Jenny Heathrow (contact 1 6/4 the only true friend thats stuck with me through the rest of this story) and Ken Redbull Mcduff (fixer 4/5) Have told me.

Apparently, my mind works on a 15 year cycle. Every 15 years on my half-birthday, i've dropped into a coma, only to wake up 6 months later, on my birthday. No clue as to who i am.

I know how to do and use everything i did before, but none of the people. At First, im told, i had alot of people behind me, helping me. But as this became a recurring problem, they slowly dwindled away, until there were two. I am now 8 years into my cycle. Hopefully, this time, i'll know what th frag is going on, before i get to 15 and ahalf years.

Because Data Bombs are programs, and too many programs will lower your Response/System. If a typical commlink is like a typical PC, only with unlimited memory, even the average user could have hundreds of files. You wouldn't even be able to get close to securing all of them before you crashed your OS.

Let's assume that Zurich-Orbital, the super-nasty holy grail of the Shadowrun matrix, has an even 10 in all stats. It handles millions of transactions per day, and has multiple accounts for each and every megacorp on the planet. Even with this supersystem, if it tried to Data Bomb only 100 of the trillions of accounts it has, it'd come crashing down. And that assumes that Z-O would have no IC running at all!

who was this directed at?

Um, Technomancer's minds are not nodes. They are PERSONAS. There is a key difference there. Though they have have the stats of a commlink, they do not have any storage or a PAN. Ergo, their minds cannot be "hacked," and you cannot do any of the things listed bellow, which can only be done to nodes and networks.

Yeah, firewall is just for combat purposes.

The persona can go anywhere a regular persona could; that is to say anywhere in the Matrix. doesn't matter iif its right next door or 3 continents away, so long as the node/device is linked to the matrix.

For a Technomancer to have a PAN, they would have to have a commlink pretty much, in which case the System, firewall, response and signal of the commlink would be used.

Think of it this way. A node is like a website. a PAN is like a personal webpage and email account, cell phone and PDA all rolled into one. Your commlink is like a computer with a server hosting the PAN. The persona is like a mouse, keyboard, moniter and webrower; they are the tools that let you interact with the webpage/nodes. The Matrix is like the internet.
Any clearer?

The analogy I gave above does not work with technomancers. They break the rules some.

No technomancers cannot be hacked. They have no data storage in their bodies. It specifically says this in the rulebook. any datastorage must be done on an external device.

All Technomacers have commlinks...
Their commlinks are just organic.

Thyme...

im not entirely sure i agree with that interpetation...

as for a technomancer being able to maintain a PAN, its up for grabs. basicly the book dones not say either way. neither when it comes to hacking that organic "comlink" that technos call a brain...

only definitive thing we know is that they cant store files...

we can however guess somewhat.

if we say that the general matrix traffic and the PAN works on the same protocols, then yes in theory a techno can maintain a PAN. hell they can "reboot" their "comlink" so...

what you can and cant do if you try to hack it is a diffrent thing alltogether...

i would allow a hack, but at the time of entry, the hacker would experience something similar to a bad acid trip or something

no software would work (including when trying to take on the firewall. the programs should spit back some strange errors like incompatible node and stuff like that), and the number of things a hacker could do would be limited to maybe checking the subscriptions and some other general "browsing"...

Yeah, I don't see any reason to think that technos are immune to hacking.

Aside from being very unbalancing, it'd also mean that every corporation everywhere would toss out their existing computers and just plug technomancers into cubicles.

Quiet ... don't give the run away to my players 'Course, they don't visit the boards as far as I know .....

Mmm, what exactly are you hacking? There's nothing to break into, because there's no node there. There's nothing to access, and nothing stored on the technomancer. You could hack any gear that the techno has, but that's not the same as hacking the persona.

That's not to say that technos are immuned to matrix actions; you can attack them in cybercombat, for example. However, if you were to try to break through their persona, you'd find that there's no "there" there. There's no account to access, no node, and no programs running.

The biggest reason that corps don't replace all their computers with techomancers is the same reason that they don't replace all their regular employees with mages or adepts. There just aren't that many folks available, and they're not suited to everything, anyway.

I hear you and I don't discount the possibility that I'm wrong. Here's what I'm working from:

Assumption from the text: Technomancers use the Matrix, and therefore they have access codes.

Assumption: A device or a network is a node. Technos still have PANs (actually they are a PAN), despite not having any integrated data storage units. Any device can have data storage nowadays, so a techno could keep his files in his glasses or watch or electronic socks if he declares it.

Assumption: Since a techno is their own commlink (complete with a subscriber list), you have to have a valid login to communicate with them (even if it's an "anonymous" login, I imagine, like when you're in active mode). Something that uses logins can potentially be hacked.

Oh, and a node doesn't need to have programs running to still be a node.

well, hmm it does sound quite interesting, but no, i hadnt read, or even heard of the book before now. It was made up in a 5 minute "oh crap!" moment when i realized i hadnt written a backstory, and was looking for the easiest "out" possible.

aim for the copy of the technos persona thats allways present (just like everyone else allso have a copy of their persona in their home comlink. or atleast thats my interpetation).

a black hammer program (or blackout, or attack for that matter) cant target a node directly. they target icons: personas, agents and ice...

Fair enough, and I'll operate from the converse assumption that I may be wrong.

I'd agree there, provided that they have a service provider. Technos don't really need a service provider to access the matrix, although that's not spelled out in the text, but they would need one for most matrix services (getting mail, receiving calls, etc.). However, an access code only allows someone to get information to you. It doesn't make you a node.

Technos do manipulate the matrix directly, though, and thus don't necessarily need an access code.

Any device is a node, and a network is a collection of nodes. Technos don't necessarily have a PAN, though. Technomancers have a persona without having a device, which is sort of the point. If they have regular devices, they can still have a PAN, and those devices remain hackable.

Keep in mind that a persona is not a node. You hack nodes, not personas. You attack personas, not nodes.

You don't use logins to communicate with a node, you use a login to access it. You pass information between users with a "commcode", but that's not the same as having a login to the node you're sending the information to.

Actually, it does, because outside of the context of a technomancer Firewall and System are programs. I just got served with that one myself in another thread.

TMs have built-in organic commlinks. Commlinks, in order to access the Matrix, must have an access code. TMs must have access codes or they couldn't receive calls, files, and whatnot.

But yeah, the text doesn't really say where they're getting their access codes. It doesn't really say where even normal commlinks get their codes; are there ISPs anymore? Who governs what your access code is? Is it a matter of something hardwired into each comm, like a MAC address on a network card? Fuzzy, fuzzy, and therefore bad.

I'd say they manipulate it directly in the same manner that a commlink manipulates it directly. The Technomancer section in the book says basically "TMs have organic commlinks and sim modules built in to their brains."

Example: If a TM makes a commcall (without running Stealth), what does the caller ID say on the other end? Is it absolutely blank or does it show his commcode?

My understanding is that TMs are their own commlinks, and as such they are effectively an organic "device." So it's not that they have a persona without a device, it's that they have a device without having a commlink.

If you could find a page number saying outright that TMs aren't a node, though, then that'd definitely make me re-evaluate my assumptions.

Absolutely. Point agreed upon and not in contention.

Hrm, another fuzzy thing. Accessing is obviously a form of communication, and I'm basing the "anonymous user" form of login off of real-world access methods.

By that reasoning, if I have no programs running on my commlink, it stops being a node. So that can't be the case.

Edit: Although I suspect the term "program" is getting some mud in here, since it sort of has two meanings in the literal sense and the game-mechanic sense.

TMs have "essentially" a built-in commlink, which is not at all the same thing. I'm pretty sure that the "essentially an organic commlink" metaphor was designed to make it easier to understand technos, without the designers understanding what rules implications players would draw from it.

I don't disagree that technos need an access code to receive calls, files, and other, similar things. Access codes, though, and the synonymous "commcodes" (I think they must have changed terms during playtest and missed the first instance) are just a sort of phone number, and are registered with your Matrix service provider, or MSP, if you will (p. 214). Technos should only need a commcode to receive messages and calls. They can log onto nodes, intercept traffic, compile sprites, and so forth without one. At least, that's my interpretation.

The "organic commlink" thing breaks down really quickly when you try to hold it up to scrutiny. Here are some things that actual commlinks can do which technomancer "commlinks" explicitly can't:

• Store data
  
• Run programs
  
• Receive hardware upgrades through Build/Repair skills
  
• Run an off-the-shelf OS
  
• Have their wireless link disabled with a Hardware + Logic test
  

I suspect that one of those items is also "have users log on", but I can't prove it by the text, except through inference. Note that "logging on" to a node is not the same as "subscribing" to it, although the latter is necessary for the former. Subscription allows you to communicate iinformation, and receive it, but "accessing" a node, or "logging on", lets you take actions on the node itself. Many things in the Matrix can have subscribers or be subscribed, without being nodes, such as user personas, agents, and sprites.

Really, I think that thinking of a technomancer much like an organic agent or sprite is a good way to go about it. Those can have subcribers, and pass data, and run programs/CFs, acting essentially as a persona, but you obviously couldn't "log on" to one.

I think that making a commcall is likely one of those things that a technomancer needs a commcode for, which it would then display on the other end. Of course, I suppose the TM could be using a Spoof CF to fake a new commcode each time, so who knows?

And, conversely, if someone could point out where it says that they are one, I'd toss mine out the window.

The most I could do is point out that the Matrix Jargon section, p. 215, defines "device" as an "individual electronic device", which technomancers are not. However, I'm the first to admit that the terminology gets very fuzzy around TMs, so nitpicking may not be helpful.

You need to communicate with a node to log on to it, but not vice versa. IRL, there are many ways of communicating between two computers on the internet without one logging on to the other. HTTP, VOIP, and IM are ways of passing information back and forth without "logging on", although in Matrix terms they require subscription.

Probably true. I was pointing out that, technically, since Firewall and System are programs, and a "node" has to be running both, without running those you're just a paperweight, not a node.

I dunnno, do I need logic+ surgery instead? or will agility + pistols suffice