Rajaat99
Nov 23 2006, 04:24 AM
Ysrthgrathe was killed by Aina, this is Canon.
Now for the speculation:
Bone Crown has to be Jeremiah Adams, of the Cult of the Seventh Seal.
I believe Ibn Eisa may be a horror, but he may just as easily be a Master Shidem.
Any others I'm missing?
Kagetenshi
Nov 23 2006, 04:41 AM
Juan Atzcapotzalco.
~J
PlatonicPimp
Nov 23 2006, 05:34 AM
Wraiths
And maybe the Shedim themselves are horrors.
Ophis
Nov 23 2006, 08:38 AM
Calzoerca - Polish dragon, probably horror corrupted.
Grinder
Nov 23 2006, 09:52 AM
Ristul may still be around.
Artificer maybe too, just think of the Arc.
Ophis
Nov 23 2006, 09:57 AM
Oh yeah and whatever awoke in Teeside, england and got the area sealed of. I suspect a horror.
NightmareX
Nov 23 2006, 04:12 PM
QUOTE (Grinder) |
Ristul may still be around. |
Ristul will always be around.
Rajaat99
Nov 23 2006, 05:55 PM
QUOTE (Kagetenshi) |
Juan Atzcapotzalco.
~J |
Do you think he could be a specific Horror from ED era?
BookWyrm
Nov 24 2006, 03:04 AM
Ibn Eisa was revealed as a Master Shedim in (I believe) Shadows of Asia & the SR4 history update.
Mortax
Nov 24 2006, 06:40 AM
QUOTE (PlatonicPimp) |
Wraiths
And maybe the Shedim themselves are horrors. |
Given what -H- (almost certainly Harlequin) said in the original post on wriaths in PAoE, I'd say the wraiths are at least minor horrors.
As for shedem, don't know. Don't know Earhdawn well enough.
Ophis
Nov 24 2006, 07:45 AM
I think Shedim are anew thing, Wraiths are a form of horror construct in ED(i think), and are mentioned as being harbingers of the arrival of the horrors.
Grinder
Nov 24 2006, 09:00 AM
ED has demiwraiths, a special form of animated corpses that are not necessarily created by Horrors and thus no Horror constructs.
I don't think that Shedim existed in ED.
NightmareX
Nov 24 2006, 10:10 AM
Also note that in ED ghouls were horror constructs (or the result of horror magic somehow - the line between the two is blurry).
Grinder
Nov 24 2006, 02:18 PM
Ghouls are Horror constructs. No HMMVV confusion over various editions here
fistandantilus4.0
Nov 25 2006, 04:48 PM
QUOTE (BookWyrm) |
Ibn Eisa was revealed as a Master Shedim in (I believe) Shadows of Asia & the SR4 history update. |
Think it was System Failure IIRC
Only one I've used out of the ED books in SR so far is Cathrune, messing with Mercs again.
TheRedRightHand
Nov 25 2006, 08:07 PM
Could someone give me a brief overview of the Horrors? I mean our they individuals? or "concepts" or a hive? or what? And where can I learn more about them?
and...
QUOTE |
Artificer maybe too, just think of the Arc. |
Does this imply that Deus was a horror? (or corrupted by a horror?)
fistandantilus4.0
Nov 25 2006, 09:10 PM
ok, brief overview.... they're extraplanar creatueres (sorta demon-ish) that feed off negative emotions such as pain, hearache, sorrow, hate, jealousy, betrayal, that sort of thing. And they work hard to invoke those emotions in sentient beings. Some are mindless eating machines, some are supergenious diabolical mastermind. THey have a large range of very f'ed-up powers. A large variety of types exist, from the hordes of "gnashers" to the really nasty unique ones.
For learning more about them, lots of first edition adventures for one. Also, anything havign to do with the Earthdawn system, which is essentially the precursor/4th world to Shadowrun's 6th world.
Artificer is basically a horror that makes traps and can control machines. So the Arcology would be a wet dream for him/It. He/It feeds off of people dying in his traps.
That work?
TheRedRightHand
Nov 25 2006, 09:52 PM
yah, thanks. They seem very cool, I'm not sure how I'd add them into my campaign, but cool none the less.
fistandantilus4.0
Nov 25 2006, 10:03 PM
Well, soem of the earlier adventures could give you some ideas. Most folks only use them very rarely, as something otherworldly that the PC's are unlikely to know how to deal with. Make for good manipulators or horror style games. With general shadowrun stuff, not so much. A bunch of people just don't like them for SR. Depends on what kind of game you like.
Grinder
Nov 26 2006, 12:36 AM
To get a feeling how Horrors "think", check out either the old Horrors sourcebook for ED or the revised version called Scource Unending. Horrors is one of the bes sourcebooks ever released, a very good read - and it gives you much much insight on the whole Horror topic/ theme.
Kagetenshi
Nov 26 2006, 05:22 AM
QUOTE (fistandantilus3.0) |
ok, brief overview.... they're extraplanar creatueres (sorta demon-ish) that feed off negative emotions such as pain, hearache, sorrow, hate, jealousy, betrayal, that sort of thing. |
This is, I note for the audience, incredibly simplistic. This is a pretty decent overview of the more powerful things, but the key point about Horrors is that they are all different. Artificer feeds off of physical anguish and despair at being trapped. Verjigorm doesn't feed, AFAIK, it just corrupts and tortures Dragons because it really, really hates them. Chantrel's Horror feeds off of the pain of loss and guilt caused by having one's loved ones torn to shreds and knowing that it was because they were your loved ones that they died. Ubyr feeds on life energy, as it were—when it gets done eating, its food is dead but IIRC visibly unharmed (though subjected to great pain). Gnashers feed on your left leg and that tree stump over there.
Ristul feeds on astral space. All of it.
QUOTE (Rajaat99) |
Do you think he could be a specific Horror from ED era? |
I've done some thinking, and while it's improbable, Atzcapotzalco could make a good Mark for the Tempter.
~J
PlatonicPimp
Nov 26 2006, 06:56 AM
Actually, before they made brianscan and answered what deus' goals were for certain, my theory had been that he was Anti-Horror. The Idea being that given all the data he had and the power to process it, Deus made sense of the evidence and inferred the existence of the horrors. SO he decided to do something about it. The arcology, teh experiments, everything was designed to improve human stock so that it was both greatly physically capable, and incredible metally resiliant, to increase scourge survival chances. Anyone who could come through the horrors of the arcology intact and sane wouldn't bat an eyelash at most horrors. I thought it was an interesting tie-in and a twisted way of making all of deus's crazy ultimately a benevolant act. Because I'm a sick fragger like that.
Mortax
Nov 26 2006, 07:55 AM
I must be 2 cause I like that idea.
Ophis
Nov 26 2006, 11:42 AM
Cool someone else had that idea too. It seemed logical with the links between Deus, Renraku and Leonardo.
Jame J
Nov 26 2006, 01:43 PM
QUOTE (PlatonicPimp) |
Actually, before they made brianscan and answered what deus' goals were for certain, my theory had been that he was Anti-Horror. The Idea being that given all the data he had and the power to process it, Deus made sense of the evidence and inferred the existence of the horrors. SO he decided to do something about it. The arcology, teh experiments, everything was designed to improve human stock so that it was both greatly physically capable, and incredible metally resiliant, to increase scourge survival chances. Anyone who could come through the horrors of the arcology intact and sane wouldn't bat an eyelash at most horrors. I thought it was an interesting tie-in and a twisted way of making all of deus's crazy ultimately a benevolant act. Because I'm a sick fragger like that. |
That is a cool way to tie in Horrors and the Scourge...
(No, I don't plan to use it - I keep my ED and my SR worlds separate - but it is cool.)
nezumi
Nov 26 2006, 01:46 PM
What does Scourge Unending have that the Horrors source book doesn't? I have the Horrors book, but not the second.
NightmareX
Nov 26 2006, 02:03 PM
QUOTE (Grinder) |
Ghouls are Horror constructs. No HMMVV confusion over various editions here |
I always took it as proof HMHVV was some sort of mutation from the process Horrors used to create the original ghouls.
NightmareX
Nov 26 2006, 02:03 PM
QUOTE (PlatonicPimp) |
Actually, before they made brianscan and answered what deus' goals were for certain, my theory had been that he was Anti-Horror. The Idea being that given all the data he had and the power to process it, Deus made sense of the evidence and inferred the existence of the horrors. SO he decided to do something about it. The arcology, teh experiments, everything was designed to improve human stock so that it was both greatly physically capable, and incredible metally resiliant, to increase scourge survival chances. Anyone who could come through the horrors of the arcology intact and sane wouldn't bat an eyelash at most horrors. I thought it was an interesting tie-in and a twisted way of making all of deus's crazy ultimately a benevolant act. Because I'm a sick fragger like that. |
I am sooo glad they didn't do it that way.
Kagetenshi
Nov 26 2006, 03:06 PM
QUOTE (nezumi) |
What does Scourge Unending have that the Horrors source book doesn't? I have the Horrors book, but not the second. |
It has more Horrors, but less awesome.
~J
Rajaat99
Nov 26 2006, 03:28 PM
QUOTE (fistandantilus3.0) |
QUOTE (BookWyrm @ Nov 23 2006, 10:04 PM) | Ibn Eisa was revealed as a Master Shedim in (I believe) Shadows of Asia & the SR4 history update. |
Think it was System Failure IIRC
Only one I've used out of the ED books in SR so far is Cathrune, messing with Mercs again.
|
I've used Cauthruune also. She screwed with one of the players, then she got banished.
LordHaHa
Nov 28 2006, 01:33 AM
QUOTE (Rajaat99) |
Now for the speculation: Bone Crown has to be Jeremiah Adams, of the Cult of the Seventh Seal. |
Not so sure about this. On the one hand, the "horn crown" and the whole fervor among the Seventh Seal group would support this. However, the "entry vector" for Adams does not 100% match with Bone Crown's. For example, the entry for the Seventh Seal states that Adams was already intergrated within Humanis at a low level of importance. There is no mention of any major crisises "of the moment" caused by him, save for a low level incident with the Sons of Sauron (but that hardly qualifies as a major crisis).
Also it appears that the Humanis leadership pushed him into his current position, though he does appear willful enough to set his own agenda.
I'm not discounting it, because there is a lot of supporting evidence. After all, Bone Crown could be trying its "Corrupt leadership and control things behind the scenes" entry tack here. But to be honest, this just doesn't feel like one of its operations. Looking at the entry in Horrors and the one in YOTC, it just doesn't taste the same. Sure, that can be chalked up to different authors, but it just seems too different than the methods employed previously by Bone Crown. Major (Named) Horrors are brilliant, but I would not go so far to say that their decision making processes qualifiy as creative. ED backs this line of thinking up with the Artisan Skills - those marked have problems utilizing those skills to such a degree that one can tell that they have been marked.
I also find it telling that the IEs and/or dragons don't get interested in the guy. You would expect that one of that group would have posted something in the Shadowtalk in that entry, but they are silent on this issue (though that could also be due to an effort to keep the situation under wraps). And on that note of visibility, wouldn't a Horror try to keep it's true condition under wraps when groups exist to combat them?
I would be interested on how the rest of you guys slice this.
fistandantilus4.0
Nov 28 2006, 01:48 AM
I agree that it isn't bonecrown. In the horror's book, the level of devotion to it is just fanatical. This guy is a set up figure head because of a coincidence of SURGE. I do wonder if they were able to spin the crash into something to support/legitimize him though.
LordHaHa
Nov 28 2006, 03:23 AM
QUOTE (fistandantilus3.0) |
I agree that it isn't bonecrown. In the horror's book, the level of devotion to it is just fanatical. This guy is a set up figure head because of a coincidence of SURGE. I do wonder if they were able to spin the crash into something to support/legitimize him though. |
That would be fun. Taking a Seattle-focused tack on this, I don't know how his message would play out in the already-chaotic Barrens, but I bet that in the more developed areas with Humanis leanings (like Shonomish; see Knowing Cop's entry in the Seattle Sourcebook) could see an upswing of followers. They have a nice-ish life set up, Crash 2.0 screws it up, and this Adams fellow - who they think isn't too bad of a guy to start with - has been preaching moderately current-event compatible 'end of the world' talk. Could see an upswing in followers there.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please
click here.